Is there a COTM approved utility that ...

[Jason Fliegel]

Is there a COTM-approved utility that will tell me whether a declaration of war will break any of my trade deals? In COTM 11, I have deals with Civ X and Civ Y, and I'm thinking of declaring war on Civ Z. I want to figure out whether my trade routes with X and Y go through Z's territory. Apart from looking at the map myself, is there a way to do that?

 

[Gyathaar]

No utility that I know of will do that.
and btw.. if civ Y and civ X knows the map for the entire trade route (and has required techs), the trade route will not be broken unless civ X & Y is at war with civ Z aswell.

 

[solenoozerec]

No utility that I know of will do that.
and btw.. if civ Y and civ X knows the map for the entire trade route (and has required techs), the trade route will not be broken unless civ X & Y is at war with civ Z aswell.

Just a tiny addition: Your trade routes will be broken if they go through civ Z.
Sometimes it is hard to understand whether it goes through Z or not.
An example is when you clearly see a water path from your civ to X and Y civs. You may think that your trade route goes through sea, howver, X and Y civs do not have harbors and the only way to trade is through civ Z.
Obviously answering what will happen requires a knowledge of buildings in X and Y civs. You may make some guesses by looking on existing trade routes between X and Y and other civs.

Even if such utility existed, I am not sure it could give you an answer for all cases, since it can rely only on information available for human player and this information is not always enough.

 

[ainwood]

Actually, this is something that we've added to the new version of civassist.

It generates a graphical view of the trade network, and you can see where it goes. It is not 100% reliable, because its spoiler-proof. As such, it uses 'known' information about roads (from teh last time you got the map / explored the area).

Its not released just yet, but should be fairly soon.

 

[Gyathaar]

Just a tiny addition: Your trade routes will be broken if they go through civ Z.
Sometimes it is hard to understand whether it goes through Z or not.
An example is when you clearly see a water path from your civ to X and Y civs. You may think that your trade route goes through sea, howver, X and Y civs do not have harbors and the only way to trade is through civ Z.
Obviously answering what will happen requires a knowledge of buildings in X and Y civs. You may make some guesses by looking on existing trade routes between X and Y and other civs.

Even if such utility existed, I am not sure it could give you an answer for all cases, since it can rely only on information available for human player and this information is not always enough.

The part you are missing is that even if the trade route does go though civ Z, it may still not be broken.. for the trade route to be broken both trading partners has to be at war with a civ that the trade route has to go thou... (unless only one trading partner knows the trade route)

 

[solenoozerec]

The part you are missing is that even if the trade route does go though civ Z, it may still not be broken.. for the trade route to be broken both trading partners has to be at war with a civ that the trade route has to go thou... (unless only one trading partner knows the trade route)

I am not sure about that, but it should be easy to model. I used to think that trading route simply does not go through the territory of civ with which you are in war even if it is sea territory. I might be wrong, but it is easy to check.

 

[Gyathaar]

I used to think the same untill I did some tests

 

[ainwood]

Yes - it does go through civs you are at war with. It is blocked by units from civs that you are at war with though IIRC.

 

[solenoozerec]

Yes - it does go through civs you are at war with. It is blocked by units from civs that you are at war with though IIRC.

Ok, I won't do any tests. Though it raises another question. If route is blocked by units, is it blocked both ways?

 

[ainwood]

Ok, I won't do any tests. Though it raises another question. If route is blocked by units, is it blocked both ways?

Actually, I might be wrong...

Its coded, but I can't remember exactly. I think that it might be that you can't trade over a tile owned by a civ that you are at war with; nor a tile that has a unit on it from a civ that you are at war with.

However, a trade route only needs to go one-way. If the trade partner isn't at war, then no problem.

Edit: And you can only trade over sea and ocean tiles that you have explored (and have navigation / astronomy / great lighthouse as appropriate).

 

[Gyathaar]

Actually, I might be wrong...

Its coded, but I can't remember exactly. I think that it might be that you can't trade over a tile owned by a civ that you are at war with; nor a tile that has a unit on it from a civ that you are at war with.

However, a trade route only needs to go one-way. If the trade partner isn't at war, then no problem.

Edit: And you can only trade over sea and ocean tiles that you have explored (and have navigation / astronomy / great lighthouse as appropriate).

Yes, this seems correct to me.. and since all civs is at war with barbarians, you cant trade though tiles where there are barbarian units

 

[denyd]

Since you can't trade through barbarians, if I'm giving France 4gpt for spices and a barbarian steps onto our only connecting road is that deal broken and if if is who gets the rep hit?

 

[AlanH]

Yes, it's broken. I had rep problems with barb galleys or squid in the Med Melee game. If both of you are supplying per-turn benefit in the trade deal then I *think* both of you get a rep hit.

 

[Gyathaar]

As long as you dont supply a lux or resource in the pure per turn trade you wont get a rep hit I believe, however if you gave them a lux instead of the 4gpt you would...
Reason is because it is their trade that is broken, while you can still supply them with the 4gpt