Is there anything worse than missionaries who fail?

[ZeekLTK]

Besides losing a 99% battle...

For me, the thing I hate more than anything else in this game is when a missionary fails to spread the religion in a city I've sent him to.

I almost never reload the game. If I lose a battle or fail to get a wonder then yes I'm upset, but "it's part of the game". But when a missionary fails, I get sooo mad and sometimes I will reload, because I feel like it's completely unfair that I spent all that time and effort to get the missionary to that city and then get absolutely nothing out of it - I basically have to start all over again because he failed.

With wonders, if you fail to get them, then at least you get some gold out of it - so it wasn't a complete waste of time to try for it. With battles, if you fail to win, generally you at least injure the unit you were attacking, which helps the next attacker improve his odds of winning. But when a missionary fails, you get NOTHING, it's a complete waste.

It's just so infuriating when you spend 3-4 turns building a missionary, spend several more turns moving them to their target, sometimes even have to negotiate open borders so that they can get to where you want them, and then, after all that, they FAIL!

And it's not like you can spam them, because you can only have 3 at a time. So it's not like I could just wait, build up an "army" of them, and send them over to convert someone and maybe have some fail, but ultimately get the job done - nope, you have to do it slowly, 3 at a time, and it's just such a huge setback when one or two of them fail, because you have to completely re-do that attempt.

I also hate it when it costs me even more production. For example, I settle a new city, some other religion auto-spreads there (this is also near the top of my list, I hate how only one religion can spread to a new city and how, somehow, it's usually NOT your state religion), I am running Organized Religion, so I have to build a missionary to convert the town myself so that it can get the 25% bonus - so I build him and send him there, and he fails, so I have to build another one and, during all those turns, the town is missing out on the production bonus the whole time. LAMEEEEE!

In fact, I take back the first sentence - I would rather lose a 99% battle than have a missionary fail! It's that infuriating!

 

[nfw]

Corp executives can fail too even when no competing corp exists

 

[AW Arcaeca]

Besides losing a 99% battle...

For me, the thing I hate more than anything else in this game is when a missionary fails to spread the religion in a city I've sent him to.

I almost never reload the game. If I lose a battle or fail to get a wonder then yes I'm upset, but "it's part of the game". But when a missionary fails, I get sooo mad and sometimes I will reload, because I feel like it's completely unfair that I spent all that time and effort to get the missionary to that city and then get absolutely nothing out of it - I basically have to start all over again because he failed.

With wonders, if you fail to get them, then at least you get some gold out of it - so it wasn't a complete waste of time to try for it. With battles, if you fail to win, generally you at least injure the unit you were attacking, which helps the next attacker improve his odds of winning. But when a missionary fails, you get NOTHING, it's a complete waste.

It's just so infuriating when you spend 3-4 turns building a missionary, spend several more turns moving them to their target, sometimes even have to negotiate open borders so that they can get to where you want them, and then, after all that, they FAIL!

And it's not like you can spam them, because you can only have 3 at a time. So it's not like I could just wait, build up an "army" of them, and send them over to convert someone and maybe have some fail, but ultimately get the job done - nope, you have to do it slowly, 3 at a time, and it's just such a huge setback when one or two of them fail, because you have to completely re-do that attempt.

I also hate it when it costs me even more production. For example, I settle a new city, some other religion auto-spreads there (this is also near the top of my list, I hate how only one religion can spread to a new city and how, somehow, it's usually NOT your state religion), I am running Organized Religion, so I have to build a missionary to convert the town myself so that it can get the 25% bonus - so I build him and send him there, and he fails, so I have to build another one and, during all those turns, the town is missing out on the production bonus the whole time. LAMEEEEE!

In fact, I take back the first sentence - I would rather lose a 99% battle than have a missionary fail! It's that infuriating!

Eh, religion will spread by itself if you give it enough time. Usually.
I'm not quite sure why it's so "infuriating" , since you can always build another one, and they certainly don't cost anywhere near how many hammers wonders do...

And I'm guessing you posted this rant thread because this happened to you in your last game or something?

 

[Olson]

^no, he posted because *I* sent 4 missionaries to a city today and still didn't get the religion spread I want (I really needed that Org.Rel. 25% production boost)

 

[dohh]

Some ideas that are worse:

1) AI getting Lib 1 turn before You do...
2) AI building an essential wonder 1 turn before You do. Few turns ago he didnt even have the tech for it...
3) After declaring a well-prepared war against leading AI You will be back-stabbed absurdly by pleased montezuma. :suicide:
4) On some very rare situations some essential ressources just stop being there! I understand a mine of Iron can be digged empty, but hey, thats the only Iron I had!!
5) Veryvery often combat results in city attack will lead to situation that I am 1 hit from ANY source short of taking city. If it takes bad luck, it will come, if it takes reinforcements for AI, they will just arrive, etc.

 

[Pangaea]

I find nothing more annoying than losing combat at 95+%, especially 99+%. It's so bad that I often hesitate to send in the GG at 98+%, genuinely being nervous. Typical post-combat comment. "Well, it was only 95% odds, I didn't really stand a chance"

Missionaries failing can be annoying, you need 40 turns to make it worth your while even if he succeeds (and you have the shrine), different math if you take OR into account, but still. I rarely do that myself though. Many AIs are spreading religions like there is no tomorrow, and I pick the one that makes most sense from a diplo standpoint.

 

[AdamCrock]

For me, the thing I hate more than anything else in this game is when a missionary fails to spread the religion in a city I've sent him to.

Well there are a few more irritating things that that Take a "corporations warfare" for example - it's definitely not for the feint-hearted - Some people hate corporations but I love them (depends on what's Your cup of tea You know - and it is my cup of tea because I like to keep myself occupied at times of peace, and hate it when everything is predictable and the game just stagnates ) Also the espionage is quite the irritant for some folks when their (improvements get destroyed, water poisoned etc.) But I also like the esp because it's a double edged sword There's nothig more satysfying than infuriating Your neighbour with "pranks"

And it's not like you can spam them, because you can only have 3 at a time.

Come now - the religion victory would be far too easy if You could build more of them at one time

I also hate it when it costs me even more production. For example, I settle a new city, some other religion auto-spreads there (this is also near the top of my list, I hate how only one religion can spread to a new city and how, somehow, it's usually NOT your state religion), I am running Organized Religion, so I have to build a missionary to convert the town myself so that it can get the 25% bonus - so I build him and send him there, and he fails, so I have to build another one and, during all those turns, the town is missing out on the production bonus the whole time. LAMEEEEE!

No offense but personally I think You are overreacting here a bit Another religion is always a good thing to have Think of all the benefits - more culture , more +10% research bonus with monastery, faster cultural boarders spread, more happy faces with temples and free religion, heck You can even have those precious +50% culture bonus from cathedrals if You can build enough temples ^^, whats not to like ? I would be happy to herd religions - the more the merrier - and it beats the bonus of 25% for buildings and imho even the chance of missionary fail is not that bad in the light of the benefits You have from 2+ religions in a city

 

[auagxa]

more culture

You don't get extra culture from non-state religions

more +10% research bonus with monastery

Building Monasteries isn't worth it IMO (unless you're aiming for culture). Better build wealth instead.

faster cultural boarders spread

See first point

I would be happy to herd religions - the more the merrier

It is good to have many religions in a city, that is if you don't spread it yourself. Having more than 3 in a non-culture game (assuming you invest hammers on missionaries) is doing you more harm than good. By the time you have FR anyway, you can trade for happiness resources instead

I'm not quite sure why it's so "infuriating" , since you can always build another one, and they certainly don't cost anywhere near how many hammers wonders do...

In AP Cheese games, it could take long for the missionary to go to the far civs since roads are still underdeveloped by the time you are setting up the AP (probably below monarch). Thus, if it fails, it takes a longer time to obtain the victory moreso if you play large maps. During this lost time, someone can plot against you, someone would turn into Pleased from Friendly (because you refuse to stop trading with that far civ) or someone converts to the AP religion (worse if it's everybody's friend).

 

[AdamCrock]

You don't get extra culture from non-state religions

You are correct but You still get +2 from monastery +1 from temple and +50% from cathedral and that's what I had in mind

 

[Lennier]

I hate how only one religion can spread to a new city ...!

It would be nice if religions could auto-spread to cities that already had religions. OTOH, it might make shrines too powerful by having their religions spread too easily. OTGH, it might make the late religions (Islam and Taoism mainly; also to some extend Confucianism and Christianity) more viable.

Eh, religion will spread by itself if you give it enough time. Usually.

Except in the case where the city already has religion. And your missionary has a 100% chance of success in spreading a religion to one of your pagan cities (and I think to someone else's pagan city as well)

4) On some very rare situations some essential ressources just stop being there! I understand a mine of Iron can be digged empty, but hey, thats the only Iron I had!!

Are you sure this is possible in vanilla BTS? I've never had a resource disappear, although I understand that some mods do have "limited resources" added in.

 

[Pangaea]

You are correct but You still get +2 from monastery +1 from temple and +50% from cathedral and that's what I had in mind

You get extra culture if you don't have a state religion. +1 per religion, and +5 for a holy city. This is why I often postpone a long time to choose a state religion (I don't like the anarchy either).

 

[AutomatedTeller]

I like religion and I like that you can manually spread it - I even get why there's a chance of failure. I think, though, that there should be a way to mitigate it - maybe the missionary isn't consumed, but can't do anything for 3 turns, or you can pay gold to keep the missionary from being destroyed when it fails, or you can pay a small amount before you spread to keep the missionary alive. Something to relieve the tedium, especially if you are spreading religion across water.

I've taken to sending settlers out with missionaries.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

1. AI feeding other AI land
2. AI not trying to win. At all.
3. PAVassal States
4. Spawn location balance
5. Laughably bad UI

All of these are worse than missionary failures, and that's leaving a few things out .

 

[Drakarska]

1. AI feeding other AI land
2. AI not trying to win. At all.
3. PAVassal States
4. Spawn location balance
5. Laughably bad UI

All of these are worse than missionary failures, and that's leaving a few things out .

Wow TMIT, that's an extremely short list for you in a post ... You feeling ok or do you have a cold?

 

[Pisskop]

Is there anything worse than missionaries who fail?





Random events I do try to enjoy because they spice up the game, but they qualify for a mention too. either Rome revolts the one turn I show up to it, or the barbarians rise up to swallow me.

 

[SamSniped]

What's worse than 1 failing missionary? 2 failing missionaries. What's worse that 2 failing missionaries? The inability of Congress to do anything. 3 failing missionaries is by far worse than that, though

 

[Seraiel]

You are correct but You still get +2 from monastery +1 from temple and +50% from cathedral and that's what I had in mind

3 buildings I don't usually build .

A thing far worse than missionaries failing is AIs switching to Emancipation. It costs a lot of to switch them back and building Spies in 300 cities also creates the need to make an effort to convert the converted hammers (which are gold) into research again in another city.

Losing Oracle is also quite harsh usually, especially when one was like 2-3T before Oracling Civil Service.

Auto-assignment of Spy-Specialists when max Merchants or Scientists are needed.

The city govenor in Sushi games.

6 Great Prophets in a cultural game out of 18 5% chances (ruined my best culture-game evar, could have been 1100 AD culture but got 1300 AD) .

 

[Timsup2nothin]

When a missionary fails in a city I moved them into, and I then look and see that civ is running theocracy. That's worse.

 

[Robert FIN]

I wouldn't mind about that, if I wasn't playing for Cultural Victory ! It is harder to insert a religion if there is another already, so its multiple times more annoying to spread religion to Mecca with 5 different religions !

 

[auagxa]

I wouldn't mind about that, if I wasn't playing for Cultural Victory ! It is harder to insert a religion if there is another already, so its multiple times more annoying to spread religion to Mecca with 5 different religions !

You wouldn't need more than 4 religions in every legendary city to win culture anyway. By the time you build your 5th cathedral, it is usually near victory.