Israeli tanks in Lebanon

[William GBTW]

In order for Israel to exist they had to kick out Arabs so Arabs defend. I'm just telling you that the Iranians said they don't support Hezboallah. I don't speak a word of Arabic (other than some like Al-Qaida) but I watch Arab news; they give it in English and sometimes I have translator.
*
LONG LIVE PALESTINE! LONG LIVE YASIR'S LEGACY! LONG LIVE ARAB UNITY!

 

[Sh3kel]

In order for Israel to exist they had to kick out Arabs so Arabs defend. I'm just telling you that the Iranians said they don't support Hezboallah. I don't speak a word of Arabic (other than some like Al-Qaida) but I watch Arab news; they give it in English and sometimes I have translator.
*
LONG LIVE PALESTINE! LONG LIVE YASIR'S LEGACY! LONG LIVE ARAB UNITY!

So you don't speak Arabic, yet you listen to news in Arabic via the means of a "translator". You believe the Iranians aren't supporting Hizzbollah despite hundreds of Iranian-made Fager 3 and 5 rockets hitting Israeli cities.

All this in, and you honestly believe we think you're nothing more than a common troll?

 

[nivi]

In order for Israel to exist they had to kick out Arabs so Arabs defend. I'm just telling you that the Iranians said they don't support Hezboallah. I don't speak a word of Arabic (other than some like Al-Qaida) but I watch Arab news; they give it in English and sometimes I have translator.
*
LONG LIVE PALESTINE! LONG LIVE YASIR'S LEGACY! LONG LIVE ARAB UNITY!

I will never through that extremism you got going on, so I give up and will save my breath for someone who is a bit more rational.

 

[William GBTW]

1. I was joking about the Long live... parts;
2. I think that BOTH of you are to blame;
3. I think Russia supplies Hezbollah;
4. Lets not break down talks;
5. I hope that you accept Gaza's peace terms.
"and you honestly believe we think you're nothing more than a common troll?" What do you mean?

 

[Sh3kel]

1. I was joking about the Long live... parts;
2. I think that BOTH of you are to blame;
3. I think Russia supplies Hezbollah;
4. Lets not break down talks;
5. I hope that you accept Gaza's peace terms.
"and you honestly believe we think you're nothing more than a common troll?" What do you mean?

Russia?!? The missiles are manufactured in the People's Republic of China as per request from the military of IRAN!

 

[William GBTW]

Okay; Russian, Chinese same dif; Katysuas are Russian. Please awnser by last line.

 

[Sh3kel]

Okay; Russian, Chinese same dif; Katysuas are Russian. Please awnser by last line.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fajr-3_rocket

A troll is one who makes arguments based on what he "thinks" he knows, rather than on what he "knows" he knows. If you can't back up your arguments, as I am doing right now, you're trolling - fishing for a counter response to your argument from the other side, considering you have nothing of value to contribute to the discussion other than your unfounded opinion.

 

[William GBTW]

I'm not trolling. But do you recongize the right of Palestinens to exist? Are they humans to you?

 

[Sh3kel]

I'm not trolling. But do you recongize the right of Palestinens to exist? Are they humans to you?

Yes, of course they're human. They're also armed, have elected a terrorist organization to head their government and have repeatedly tried to kill me and my fellow servicemen and civilians. To me that means they're a grouping of humans with means, intents and opportunity to try and kill me - and hence why we're bombing them into submission until they are either unarmed, unable to attack us or best - unwilling to do so.

 

[CurtSibling]

Won't work? Our "overreaction" is working so bloody well that it's got the jackasses in Gaza discussing a cease fire for the first time in over two years. We've seen a dramatic drop of rocket fire from Gaza into Israel and there are for the first time actual negotiations for the liberation of the kidnapped Israeli soldier in Gaza.

Still plenty of innocents dying by Islamic rockets and Jewish jets.
Don't try and justify your attacks to me. I cannot be brainwashed.

And for the record...I don't support Israel or the Arabians.
You all are a bunch of extremists fighting for derelict ideologies.

I can understand your relcutance to admit in this case, might has probably made right, but history proves that more often than not on the long run, a swift kick in the ass might cause a people full of nationalistic, xenophobic maniacs like the Japanese to become an actually beneficial member of the world community faster than a nice "talking to". If your neighbour breaks into your territory and kidnaps three of your men while firing thousands of rockets into your territory - "losing control" is the only way to make sure just exactly how intolerant you are to bullfeathers. I don't what about your europeans, but down here we use our bullfeathers to fertilize our fields - not to feed to our public.

Wonderful speech, you should run for office.

Might does indeed make right, but might without intellect is doomed.
Just ask your old enemy, the 3rd Reich...They learned that might is not enough.

While I am glad you lazy Israelis are finally doing something to help your
Euro-American allies in the war on islamic extremism, you really are going
about it in a slapdash way. You make even the Americans look stylish.

The media from various nations make it look like Israel are brutally slaughtering
at random, in a flailing attempt to vanquish a shadowy gang of assassins who
are under the control of Iran. While Iran takes the pressure of the world's eyes
off their own dark nuclear agenda. And also, the Israeli armed forces have now
shown their hand in war, enabling valuable data to be gathered.

On the whole, this will not give Israel the breathing space they need.
It will only magnetize the worst elements of the jihadic animals.

No amount of your triumphalism will avert the uncertain future.

That is all.
No more discussion.

.

 

[CurtSibling]

Russia?!? The missiles are manufactured in the People's Republic of China as per request from the military of IRAN!

One more thing:

We are finding China is the face of true capitalism.

They are quite happy to make a profit, even from death.
It seems Bejing has learned from the West all too well.

...

 

[Sh3kel]

Still plenty of innocents dying by Islamic rockets and Jewish jets.
Don't try and justify your attacks to me. I cannot be brainwashed.

And for the record...I don't support Israel or the Arabians.
You all are a bunch of extremists fighting for derelict ideologies.

Again, if Israeli civlians were never killed and placed in hospital from Islamic Might-rockets, we wouldn't have needed to retaliate. In the six years since we've left Lebanon we honored the cease fire even when the Hizzbollah repeatedly fire anti-aircraft fire at our airplanes travelling to and from the Machanaim airfield next to Qiryat Shmona, and retaliated violently only when said AA fire resulted in one casualty from the Israeli side. We've also withdrawn to the complete satisfaction of the International community to the area we call the "Blue Line", and allowed the incompetent idiots of the UNIFIL mission to "police" the Hizzbollah outposts next to our borders. You're free to argue whatever the hell you want about our Southern front, but in the Lebanese area you have got to be severly biased if you do not honestly consider Hizzbollah to be the instigator of this round of violence. It's not everyday that even the French agree our response is justified even if they immediately condemn it as "overblown".

Wonderful speech, you should run for office.

Might does indeed make right, but might without intellect is doomed.
Just ask your old enemy, the 3rd Reich...They learned that might is not enough.

While I am glad you lazy Israelis are finally doing something to help your
Euro-American allies in the war on islamic extremism, you really are going
about it in a slapdash way. You make even the Americans look stylish.

The media from various nations make it look like Israel are brutally slaughtering
at random, in a flailing attempt to vanquish a shadowy gang of assassins who are under the control of Iran. While Iran takes the pressure of the world's eyes off their own dark nuclear agenda. And also, the Israeli armed forces have now shown their hand in war, enabling valuable data to be gathered.

On the whole, this will not give Israel the breathing space they need.
It will only magnetize the worst elements of the jihadic animals.

No amount of your triumphalism will avert the uncertain future.

That is all.
No more discussion.

.

Why thank you, I just might take your carreer advice and attempt to run for office. There does seem to be a shortage of common sense these days.

Look, we're doing the world a service by showing the rest of the Islamic extremists we're not going to tolerate their blackmailing tactics and violent ways. We're "breaking all rules" and "over-reacting completely" in order to show them how allergic we are to their antics. Their violence and rhetoric can only be completely disarmed by one of two things - killing their agenda, or killing their preachers. You said it yourself, and you again based upon the lessons learned on the Jewish people's flesh and ash - you may kill a man, but ideas are bulletproof. This is exactly the reason why we're running such a widespread artillery bombardment and airborne bombing campaign. We know for a fact we cannot erradicate radical Islam - and so we have to rely on our military might to kill the radical Islamists. It's a brutal and disilusioning realization, I agree, to understand the only possible way you're going to stop someone is by dropping a quarter ton of explosives on his house, but sadly we and the rest of the world with us, about 6 years after the fact, are now becoming aware to this fact.

You may claim you cannot be brainwashed, but I can assure you from personal experience even those with an iron will are pretty much still vulnerable to shrapnel from an exploding bus.

 

[Sh3kel]

One more thing:

We are finding China is the face of true capitalism.

They are quite happy to make a profit, even from death.
It seems Bejing has learned from the West all too well.

...

I like the Chinese - at least they're equal in their death-mongering, and I can respect them taking the part of the middleman for everyone with money. I severly dislike the Iranians, though.

But then again I also hold the mentality that guns don't kill people, people kill people, and that limiting gun ownership will only result in a rise of stabbing deaths...

 

[Xenocrates]

I was wondering when the origin of the weaponry would attract comment. Apparently the US supplies most of it............

I'd like an explanation for something that's been worrying me for a while. Leha said that hundreds of missiles had been fired into Israel every week from Gaza (something like that anyway - I can't remember the exact number). I checked on the net and found that each missile is 2 metres long. I also checked and found that Gaza has been fenced and the Israelis control the entrances and exits. How the blazes are they getting all of these missiles? Hundreds of 2m big missiles can't be moved without somebody noticing can they?

The second point relating to the missiles is this: I have also read reports on the net that the ultimate origin of the missiles used by Hizbolla is Russia (I wasn't aware of the Chinese link until I read the post above - I'll check it out). Since the US has been 'active' in central Asia could it be that the Ruskies are getting a little revenge?

 

[Sh3kel]

I'd like an explanation for something that's been worrying me for a while. Leha said that hundreds of missiles had been fired into Israel every week from Gaza (something like that anyway - I can't remember the exact number). I checked on the net and found that each missile is 2 metres long. I also checked and found that Gaza has been fenced and the Israelis control the entrances and exits. How the blazes are they getting all of these missiles? Hundreds of 2m big missiles can't be moved without somebody noticing can they?

They're essentially construction pipes a few inches in diameter with scrap-metal fins attached to the tail end, liquid fuel (usually regular car petrol) and a jury-rigged warhead made from regular explosives. The yield of a Qassam missile is hardly that of a Katyusha rocket, and there are have been multiple instances in which the Qassam actually lands inside a building and manages to cause only minor structural damage while killing no one. It's essentially a model rocket with a fertilizer bomb or a small charge at the tip - nothing like the army-grade rockets the Hizzbollah is firing into Israel, hence why there has been no "I'M GONNA KILL EVERYONE THAT MOVES" reaction into Gaza, only localized incursions into Gaza to weed out and kill the insurgents. To prevent any rockets from being made in Gaza we'd have to bar any type of plumbing shipment from entering. We're not unreasonable to the point we won't allow the Palestinians to rebuild...

The second point relating to the missiles is this: I have also read reports on the net that the ultimate origin of the missiles used by Hizbolla is Russia (I wasn't aware of the Chinese link until I read the post above - I'll check it out). Since the US has been 'active' in central Asia could it be that the Ruskies are getting a little revenge?

The original Katyusha rockets are Russian-made, WW2 era statistical weapons that were exported after the war to many Eastern Bloc countries, and sold to many costumers - inclduing the Arab militaries. As rocketry advanced these missiles were improved, adding width, lenght, range and explosive capabilities to the rockets so that we now have a paramilitary organization in Lebanon carrying Syrian and Iranian military grade rockets such as the Katyusha-III short ranged rocket, Fager (also spelled Fajr) 3 and 5 ground medium-ranged rockets, and reportedly several Iranian truck-launched Zelzal 2 rockets.

These aren't your average model rockets that blow up on impact. They're military grade projectiles.

 

[Xenocrates]

Thanks Shek you've answered my question about how they get in. They are small home-made weapons. It reminds me of David and Goliath!

I checked out the Chinese link quickly, I think its the anti-ship missile that was linked to China, is that right?

Anyway the epoch times, which carries the story: www.theepochtimes.com/news/6-7-18/44024.html
is a rabidly anti-establishment front for the Falun Gong cult. They would certainly have an interest in trying to implicate China in this and I would be deeply suspicious of anything they say. It's rumour like this that starts World Wars.

Anyway i'd like to ask a favour of you all, everytime I hear Hizbolla being described as 'Islamic terrorists' or "Islamic extremists' I cry. They aren't fighting for Islamic reasons - they are fighting for other reasons. I suggest its lazy thinking to label Hamas and Hizbolla as 'muslim fanatics', so can we all leave that out of the discussion; you wouldn't appreciate someone tuning in here and calling the IDF 'Jewish extremists' would you?

 

[Sh3kel]

Anyway i'd like to ask a favour of you all, everytime I hear Hizbolla being described as 'Islamic terrorists' or "Islamic extremists' I cry. They aren't fighting for Islamic reasons - they are fighting for other reasons. I suggest its lazy thinking to label Hamas and Hizbolla as 'muslim fanatics', so can we all leave that out of the discussion; you wouldn't appreciate someone tuning in here and calling the IDF 'Jewish extremists' would you?

They're a paramilitary organization headed by a fanatical Shi'ite Sheikh called Hassan Nasrallah and heavily motivated by the Shi'ite Ayatollahs from Iran, and one of the major terms of enlistment is belief in the Shi'ite system of laws. Once it was truly fighting us because we were "opressing southern lebanon", but since the pull-out it's limited itself to being a heavily armed and extremely well trained radical Islam paramilitary organization. They're certainly trained and strctured like a military force, but their primary motives are indeed "muslim fanaticism" and "radical Islam".

 

[Xenocrates]

They're certainly trained and strctured like a military force, but their primary motives are indeed "muslim fanaticism" and "radical Islam".

Can you explain that?

One could make the same argument for the IDF; do they not hold religious beliefs too?

The Spirit of the IDF draws on four sources:
The tradition of the IDF and its military heritage as the Israel Defense Forces.
The tradition of the State of Israel, its democratic principles, laws and institutions.
The tradition of the Jewish People throughout their history.
Universal moral values based on the value and dignity of human life.

From the IDF website.

 

[Sh3kel]

Can you explain that?
One could make the same argument for the IDF; do they not hold religious beliefs too?
From the IDF website.

Our Prime Minister, Minster of Defense, Chief of Staff and the vast majority of our branch commanders are secular, we allow women equal rights and conscript them as part of equal duties, and I can't be executed for disobeying a religious command while on duty.

We are loyal to Jewish traditions in the sense we allow our religious soldiers to pray, make efforts to ensure the laws of Kashrut are well maintained and practice a mandatory resting day on the Sabbath except for immediate operational needs, but we sure as hell don't go establishing Iranian-style "suicide units" in order to "free Jerusalem from the opression of the muslim infidel enemy"...