Kongo is One of the Most Powerful in the Later Stages

[MarigoldRan]

+6 food, + 6 production, +12 gold in combination with the usual culture and tourism in their cities with Archeology Museums.

It takes more to set up, but it beats Outback and Mekewap (in combination with their UB, which gives +5 housing and 2 food and more gold) in terms of productivity because they get that bonus without having to use tiles.

The Kongo beat the Germans in productivity. Their UU comes earlier and is pretty useful. They start with lots of forests and rainforests to chop. And their capital is literally monstrous if you can get 5-8 religious relics (for the Kongo every religious relic provide 2 food and 2 production, and 4 gold), which isn't hard if you have Mt. Saint Micheals.

They're better than the Germans early on in military due to their UU, and they're arguably better than the Germans at building large powerful cities. Why aren't more people talking about them?

 

[Kyro]

Because how well a civilization scales with time is irrelevant in Civ 6. It's all about short term benefits now.

 

[MarigoldRan]

I know. I play Scythia and Monty a lot. But if people play the Germans for their mid-late game bonuses, then why not the Kongo?

 

[Archon_Wing]

But you need to waste a slot on a theater square per city you want productive, save for the capital.

I did win a game with Kongo using only my capital and the 2 cities it flipped though, so I think Kongo's great for those kinds of challenges.

 

[DonPato]

I'm currently playing a game as Kongo and having a blast. Magnus and wall-chopping has gotten me a few wonders, and my UU allowed me to conquer a civ to my south within about 10 turns. Now I'm building theater squares everywhere and waiting for the bonuses to start pouring in like crazy. Not to mention, I have Oracle, plus the UA and Divine Spark, so GW, GA, and GM's are flowing out of my ears. The strategy that you need to take with them is definitely different from the norm, but they're a ton of fun.

 

[halfhalfharp]

I will say that their ability to grab Great People is more worthy mentioning than the other bonuses. Even the AIs can spam great works like a blackhole.

 

[OmegaDestroyer]

I think Kongo is an overall great civilization. The UU is incredibly useful for mobility and defense. The unique district helps you grow huge cities, and the UA and Leader ability help you easily clinch culture victories. I just recently finished a game as Kongo and ended up with something like 6 themed museums; the boosts were nuts.

The only real downside is that you cannot win a religious victory but that is hardly a loss.

 

[bonafide11]

I think Kongo is an overall great civilization. The UU is incredibly useful for mobility and defense. The unique district helps you grow huge cities, and the UA and Leader ability help you easily clinch culture victories. I just recently finished a game as Kongo and ended up with something like 6 themed museums; the boosts were nuts.

The only real downside is that you cannot win a religious victory but that is hardly a loss.

I don't disagree that they're strong, but I don't see a defensive UU past the ancient age as too useful because I rarely worry about an AI attack past then.

 

[Frostburn]

When the game first came out, I played a Kongo game and managed to find a relic with my first goody hut. Huge early game boost if you happen to get that lucky.

Also; can you still find relics from early goody huts? I haven't found one in the Ancient era in a long time, wondering if it got patched out?

 

[liv]

Yeah relics are still there. Found one yesterday playing as Indonesia

 

[KayAU]

Kongo may just be my favourite civ...there is some competition for that spot in Rise and Fall, but Kongo is certainly still great. I love their museum ability and special district, which I will spam as much as possible. The Mbanza works like a super tile improvement which provides its yields without needing to be worked, and provides adjacency bonuses to districts.

 

[Kyro]

I know. I play Scythia and Monty a lot. But if people play the Germans for their mid-late game bonuses, then why not the Kongo?

In Germany's case it's not just its half-cost industrial zones that make it powerful, it's the fact that every city can build an additional district on top of the population limit. Which means Germany's advantage applies twice because while the average Civ only has expensive industrial zones in crucial cities, Germany can afford to have them in as many as the player chooses without the opportunity cost the average Civ faces and with all the added benefits. This happens to be a lot more powerful than Kongo's productive capabilities because of two reasons:

1: Time and Chance.
It takes very long for a player to fill up enough artifact/relic slots for it to be comparable to Germany's advantage. Not to mention the lack of reliability in acquiring said artifacts/relics.

2: The fact that "late" game is an illusory term in Civ 6 means that by the time the investments in Kongo actually start to make a significant difference, the game should already be over. Thus rendering any advantage in growth and production moot. In Germany's case their advantage simply occurs early enough.

 

[Lily_Lancer]

Kongo is a bottom-tier Civ, we shall not satire on civilizations.

 

[isau]

Yeah relics are still there. Found one yesterday playing as Indonesia

A little off topic but I think the "spiritual" Golden Age reward should be giving you a free relic or two and the random ones found in goody huts should be removed.

 

[MarigoldRan]

1. For the Kongo, the theatre square IS a factory. You're not "wasting" a tile on a theatre square. What you're actually getting instead is a factory that produces 6 hammers and 6 food AND a crap ton of culture and GP points.
2. Sure, Germany can build an extra district for its population. But each Kongo city HAS 3 or more pop than the average German city because of their UB. Kongo has the edge because it means with extra pop they have more production
3. Their UU is NOT a defensive UU. The Ngao Mbeba is one of the best units for taking classical era cities in single player BECAUSE THEY TAKE ALMOST NO DAMAGE FROM CITY RANGED ATTACKS OR ARCHERS. These units are very effective at conquest (more effective than Germany's UU). They can survive shi- that a lot of other similar units would die from because archers don't do anything to them.
4. Kongo is guaranteed rainforest/forest start meaning lots of chops for Magnus.

The Kongo reminds me of the Goth from Age of Empires 2. Their UU loses in a straight match against equivalent UU's of their era (for example: legions beat Mbeba in a straight match-up). But their extra mobility and effective immunity to arrows mean the usual counter against melee (archers) don't work on them, similar to the Gothic Huskarls from AoE2.

[Skip to 8-minute mark for the Huskarl]

Also, like the Goth, the Kongo needs time to set up their cities. But once they're set up properly, they're unstoppable because their cities are giant and have an extra food-producing industrial zone (known as "the theatre square").

 

[MarigoldRan]

Also, for relics, all you need is Mt. Saint Micheals or Yerevan so you can martyr your apostles. That comes in early enough. And once you have that you're guaranteed an extra 10 prod and 10 food and a crap ton of culture in your capital.

And that's assuming you don't get lucky and get a relic from a goody hut.

Also, Kongo early game is better than German early game due to their UU and the crap ton of forests and rainforests they can Magnus chop. Start bias matters.

 

[Archon_Wing]

1. For the Kongo, the theatre square IS a factory. You're not "wasting" a tile on a theatre square. What you're actually getting instead is a factory that produces 6 hammers and 6 food AND a crap ton of culture and GP points.

Yea, but you actually need to spawn the great artists. Art musuems are a bit late.

2. Sure, Germany can build an extra district for its population. But each Kongo city HAS 3 or more pop than the average German city because of their UB. Kongo has the edge because it means with extra pop they have more productio

Amenities are an issue too.

Germany's bonus is much more flexible because they can do stuff like fit in an extra holy site early game and not suffer much loss and before mbanzas.

But their extra mobility and effective immunity to arrows mean the usual counter against melee (archers) don't work on them, similar to the Gothic Huskarls from AoE2.

Well the thing with Goths is they have multiple ways of boosting production and can also crap out halbediers and champs to cover their weaknesses. But before they can get this combo, they're not that great. And also, Spirit of the Law is great.

The other thing about huskarls is that they also do massive bonus damage against archers too.

 

[MarigoldRan]

1. No, its not the Great Artists. It's the Archeologists and the Dead Apostles. Their bonuses come from relics, sculptures, and artifacts.
2. Well ok fine. Amenities are a greater issue with Kongo than Germany.
3. Oddly enough, thanks to the Magnus Chop and the Kongo start position, the Kongo DO have a lot of ways to boost production to cover their weaknesses.

Their early-mid game is actually better than the Goths in AoE2. The Ngao would be Godly like the Huskarl if it was cheaper. As it stands, it's a very decent UU, definitely not in the top 5, but probably in the top 10.

And yes, Spirit of the Law is great. While the Ngao don't get bonus damage against archers, they are more mobile than the analogous huskarl due to their ability to attack an archer in 1 turn when the archer is stationed in a forest, which is not to be underestimated

 

[Archon_Wing]

No, its not the Great Artists. It's the Archeologists and the Dead Apostles. Their bonuses come from relics, sculptures, and artifacts.

That comes even later And Mt. Michel is definitely possible but I think it's a bit luck dependent on religion spread. Yes, it's not hard, but it's still not within your control.

Oh yea, after the Magnus chop thing, I've really found production per turn to be someone devalued since you can just speed build things like that. Sure, it matters later, but still.

 

[Jewelrunna]

I’ve been saying that Kongo are seriously underrated. Mbanzas and Nkisi are two of the best uniques in the game.