KoS3 - Warmongers
- Thread starter kossin
- Start date
pigswill
fly (one day)
I'm going to drop out of this one before it starts. I'm not playing well enough and I'm a bit civved out for anything challenging.
I send the scout east as proposed and see nothing interesting other than a hut so SIP.
Ag>AH with worker first while working a 3H tile. (12 turns)
The scout is lucky and nets us...
I pop two more huts for gold...
After AH, horses appear in Churchill's BFC and a bit to our east. I think a bit about what's to be researched next (Masonry/BW)... BW is elected as the worker will be idle too long otherwise. He's currently farming the stone and will be done 1 turn before BW is in to start a chop.
On turn 17, the first team shows up. Also met the second team a few turns later.
Once all our land is explored, I stop for the net person to play and for discussion.
Moscow
Land
Techs
Ag>AH with worker first while working a 3H tile. (12 turns)
The scout is lucky and nets us...
Spoiler :
I pop two more huts for gold...
Spoiler :
After AH, horses appear in Churchill's BFC and a bit to our east. I think a bit about what's to be researched next (Masonry/BW)... BW is elected as the worker will be idle too long otherwise. He's currently farming the stone and will be done 1 turn before BW is in to start a chop.
On turn 17, the first team shows up. Also met the second team a few turns later.
Spoiler :
Once all our land is explored, I stop for the net person to play and for discussion.
Moscow
Spoiler :
Land
Spoiler :
Techs
Spoiler :
Shurdus
Am I Napoleon?
None of the screenies work for me. Also it is indeed a shame to see pigswill go so soon.
mlinneak
Prince
I have the save - I believe I am up now for 20 turns, right?
I definitely agree with wheel then masonry. Following up with pottery and writing seems fine to me as well, so unless there is a great argument made for a different path that is the tech direction I will aim towards.
I am assuming we want to settle the horse site as soon as possible to secure ponies for us? Then settle eastward to secure coast - I doubt I will be able to build more than one settler during my set though. We're going to want another worker soon too.
After the settler I was thinking I would start an archer in Moscow for barb protection, etc. and to allow growth. Then maybe another worker or archer. What does the group think? If I get the go ahead, I should be able to play tonight after I get home from work.
I definitely agree with wheel then masonry. Following up with pottery and writing seems fine to me as well, so unless there is a great argument made for a different path that is the tech direction I will aim towards.
I am assuming we want to settle the horse site as soon as possible to secure ponies for us? Then settle eastward to secure coast - I doubt I will be able to build more than one settler during my set though. We're going to want another worker soon too.
After the settler I was thinking I would start an archer in Moscow for barb protection, etc. and to allow growth. Then maybe another worker or archer. What does the group think? If I get the go ahead, I should be able to play tonight after I get home from work.
mlinneak
Prince
Sorry, I should have noted in my previous post. The screen shots showed up fine for me as well. The first time I attempted to view them, all but the very last one, the tech picture, worked just fine. I refreshed my page and was able to see the last one as well so I was able to view them all.
Meerk
Warlord
- Joined
- Nov 4, 2009
- Messages
- 112
Those were some good huts. 
I personally would have gone masonry before TW, but I suppose the order is not too important. My desire was to get the extra hammers from the quarry, but its hard for me to assess the relative importance of us vs Churchill.
After settler I tend to think we will want another worker pretty soon.
How much emphasis do we need to put on the GW? Maybe in the set after mlinneak?
I personally would have gone masonry before TW, but I suppose the order is not too important. My desire was to get the extra hammers from the quarry, but its hard for me to assess the relative importance of us vs Churchill.
After settler I tend to think we will want another worker pretty soon.
How much emphasis do we need to put on the GW? Maybe in the set after mlinneak?
If we only focus on ourselves, Churchill won't be any help. My idea is to help him focus on Military while we can focus on science thingies.
Philosophical is great in this kind of map... we might even consider the mids and a settled GS approach.
Anyway, Chariots will provide defense against Axes and other Archers better than just Archers.
Settle the horse city yes, that should force Churchill along the coast. I'd consider settling the far east hill city and gifting it to Churchill so he will defend it later on.
As for number of turns... 20ish sounds fine, a bit less/more depending how things go. What's next after Masonry? I'd say Pottery for Expansive granaries goody. Writing afterwards with an eye towards CoL maybe?
Philosophical is great in this kind of map... we might even consider the mids and a settled GS approach.
Anyway, Chariots will provide defense against Axes and other Archers better than just Archers.
Settle the horse city yes, that should force Churchill along the coast. I'd consider settling the far east hill city and gifting it to Churchill so he will defend it later on.
As for number of turns... 20ish sounds fine, a bit less/more depending how things go. What's next after Masonry? I'd say Pottery for Expansive granaries goody. Writing afterwards with an eye towards CoL maybe?
Screenshots work good for me.
I like TW>Masonry here also. Need to let Churchill get chariots up, also we should settle horses first also. After that pottery and writing seems like solid choices. Need to get economy techs before we expand. Also libraries with our PHI trait will help alot here. Mid's is good choice also, stone will help alot here.
After settler I like archer then worker. Need some kind of defense just in case barbs or one of our rivals come along.
Sorry to see you go also Pigswill. Best of luck.
I like TW>Masonry here also. Need to let Churchill get chariots up, also we should settle horses first also. After that pottery and writing seems like solid choices. Need to get economy techs before we expand. Also libraries with our PHI trait will help alot here. Mid's is good choice also, stone will help alot here.
After settler I like archer then worker. Need some kind of defense just in case barbs or one of our rivals come along.
Sorry to see you go also Pigswill. Best of luck.
mlinneak
Prince
I played 20 turns. Everything was pretty much routine except that in the middle of the set I lost our scout to a bear 
We met and started war with Montezuma and Shaka. When bronzeworking came in I went ahead and switched to slavery.
There was a barbarian uprising, but I don't believe it was directed at us
I kept an eye out, but only saw barb animals during my set.
We learned The Wheel, Masonry, and Pottery, Writing is queued up as planned.
After the warrior in Moscow finished, we built a settler, archer, and worker. Another archer has only two turns left. It can be whipped, but I prefer to start another settler next and save the whip for that.
St. Petersburg was founded to secure the horses, and a monument was whipped as soon as was possible, which ended up being this last turn. Next player can decide what to build next, this can also be discussed.
Pastured the horses, and since they were connected via river it does not look like we need to bother with a road yet to connect them.
Suleiman founded and converted to Judaism.
The worker by St. Pete's was building a farm, and the one by Moscow was working on a quarry. These actions can be continued or vetoed by the next one up.
Here is what we have seen of our enemies' territory so far:
French-Roman Corner
Aztec-Zulu Corner
And our great cities:
Moscow
St. Petersburg
The worst thing that happened was the death of our scout. I did take out a Roman scout that was by our borders, and there is the possibility of the next player to take out a Zulu scout with our northern warrior before ending this turn.
The save ~
We met and started war with Montezuma and Shaka. When bronzeworking came in I went ahead and switched to slavery.
There was a barbarian uprising, but I don't believe it was directed at us
I kept an eye out, but only saw barb animals during my set.
We learned The Wheel, Masonry, and Pottery, Writing is queued up as planned.
After the warrior in Moscow finished, we built a settler, archer, and worker. Another archer has only two turns left. It can be whipped, but I prefer to start another settler next and save the whip for that.
St. Petersburg was founded to secure the horses, and a monument was whipped as soon as was possible, which ended up being this last turn. Next player can decide what to build next, this can also be discussed.
Pastured the horses, and since they were connected via river it does not look like we need to bother with a road yet to connect them.
Suleiman founded and converted to Judaism.
The worker by St. Pete's was building a farm, and the one by Moscow was working on a quarry. These actions can be continued or vetoed by the next one up.
Here is what we have seen of our enemies' territory so far:
French-Roman Corner
Aztec-Zulu Corner
And our great cities:
Moscow
St. Petersburg
The worst thing that happened was the death of our scout. I did take out a Roman scout that was by our borders, and there is the possibility of the next player to take out a Zulu scout with our northern warrior before ending this turn.
The save ~
Good set! 
Too bad about the scout... in any case we can always park an archer north and accumulate exp for a super unit.
Def. kill Shaka's scout. Free exp towards GG is welcome.
Churchill is a good boy and will likely settle on that hill where he currently has a settler+archer.
With this in mind, move the warrior NE somewhat.
I thought about things and we should rework the dotmap a bit.
3E of St-Pete on the desert hill will get 2 flood plains for food and has several green riverside tiles that couldn't be used with the other dotmap.
This means we move the city north of this point 1N to grab the marble for a shot at marble wonders. parth+TGL would be pretty strong with Pyramids if we can manage all that!
I fear Churchill will send his next settler near the copper/cow but not on the hill. That'b be a bummer for defense purposes but then again it might be an impenetrable chokepoint. If we could sneak by another settler there and gift the city to Churchill it would solve many headaches I think.
Once Stone is hooked up, let's build TGW with a couple of chops. We could also use an extra worker from St-Pete when it grows to size 2. Maybe a granary in the meantime that can be finished later on? Or even a worker directly to avoid working an unimproved fp.
For the big picture:
The key tech in AW is Feudalism. Once we get there, we should be able to withstand huge stacks. This means we'll need to go through Monarchy sooner rather than later.
Given JC is in the house, I think it means very soon.
Too bad about the scout... in any case we can always park an archer north and accumulate exp for a super unit.
Def. kill Shaka's scout. Free exp towards GG is welcome.
Churchill is a good boy and will likely settle on that hill where he currently has a settler+archer.
With this in mind, move the warrior NE somewhat.
I thought about things and we should rework the dotmap a bit.
3E of St-Pete on the desert hill will get 2 flood plains for food and has several green riverside tiles that couldn't be used with the other dotmap.
This means we move the city north of this point 1N to grab the marble for a shot at marble wonders. parth+TGL would be pretty strong with Pyramids if we can manage all that!
I fear Churchill will send his next settler near the copper/cow but not on the hill. That'b be a bummer for defense purposes but then again it might be an impenetrable chokepoint. If we could sneak by another settler there and gift the city to Churchill it would solve many headaches I think.
Once Stone is hooked up, let's build TGW with a couple of chops. We could also use an extra worker from St-Pete when it grows to size 2. Maybe a granary in the meantime that can be finished later on? Or even a worker directly to avoid working an unimproved fp.
For the big picture:
The key tech in AW is Feudalism. Once we get there, we should be able to withstand huge stacks. This means we'll need to go through Monarchy sooner rather than later.
Given JC is in the house, I think it means very soon.
Shurdus
Am I Napoleon?
So my take since pigswill dropped out is that I am up?
I agree with going feudalism soon. If we can get the marble hooked up we may even slingshot it, but I am afraid that we are already too late for that. Even if we can get that, I doubt that I can even find the hammers and beakers to do that in my set.
So I plan to let Moscow grow to size 5 - the cap - and then getting another worker out. The Moscow worker will hook up the stone. I will also take out the Zulu scout.
After getting the stone up I will go for TGW. The spies that this will generate should be very useful in an AW game. Also not worrying about barbs is nice. After a worker is done I feel we need a granary up in Moscow. This will greatly accelerate our whipping power. Both a worker and granary are accelerated by our traits so I feel I can safely go worker first, maybe whip that to speed things up.
As for settling I feel that I can hardly manage to get a settler out if I need to build TGW. I can start one after TGW though. As for settling I feel we need to take the copper sooner rather than later.
As for techs I will finish writing. Research will then go to 0% awaiting libraries. First we need a few more archers and chariots, then the libraries are a big priority given our philosophical trait.
I agree with going feudalism soon. If we can get the marble hooked up we may even slingshot it, but I am afraid that we are already too late for that. Even if we can get that, I doubt that I can even find the hammers and beakers to do that in my set.
So I plan to let Moscow grow to size 5 - the cap - and then getting another worker out. The Moscow worker will hook up the stone. I will also take out the Zulu scout.
After getting the stone up I will go for TGW. The spies that this will generate should be very useful in an AW game. Also not worrying about barbs is nice. After a worker is done I feel we need a granary up in Moscow. This will greatly accelerate our whipping power. Both a worker and granary are accelerated by our traits so I feel I can safely go worker first, maybe whip that to speed things up.
As for settling I feel that I can hardly manage to get a settler out if I need to build TGW. I can start one after TGW though. As for settling I feel we need to take the copper sooner rather than later.
As for techs I will finish writing. Research will then go to 0% awaiting libraries. First we need a few more archers and chariots, then the libraries are a big priority given our philosophical trait.
Yes sorry, here is the updated roster. Please note to anyone reading that we are still looking for 2 more players!
1. kossin
2. mlinneak - Just Played
3. shurdus - UP!
4. mjg5591 - On deck
5. Meerk
6. ???
7. ???
I think I'd go settler after the archer. Settle on the desert hill to keep forcing Churchill along the coast. The great thing about Expansive is when you whip something for full overflow (~30
), you dump the overflow in a granary and it completes the following turn. So... whip settler at max hammers -> granary-> TGW imo
I think we should try for (Poly->Priesthood rather than Medi->PH for a shot at TGL) CoL after Writing for a religion (2 happy bonus with temples) and eventually courthouses although that sure isn't pressing. Other options are Aesthetics right now for earlier TGL or heading to Monarchy/Feudalism but I think that's overkill for early LBs.
1. kossin
2. mlinneak - Just Played
3. shurdus - UP!
4. mjg5591 - On deck
5. Meerk
6. ???
7. ???
I think I'd go settler after the archer. Settle on the desert hill to keep forcing Churchill along the coast. The great thing about Expansive is when you whip something for full overflow (~30
), you dump the overflow in a granary and it completes the following turn. So... whip settler at max hammers -> granary-> TGW imoI think we should try for (Poly->Priesthood rather than Medi->PH for a shot at TGL) CoL after Writing for a religion (2 happy bonus with temples) and eventually courthouses although that sure isn't pressing. Other options are Aesthetics right now for earlier TGL or heading to Monarchy/Feudalism but I think that's overkill for early LBs.
mlinneak
Prince
I had a screenshot of Churchill's settler / archer pair but I forgot to include it in my report I will add it here for any lurkers, and any of our team that hasn't had a chance to view the save.
I will add it here for any lurkers, and any of our team that hasn't had a chance to view the save.
Meerk
Warlord
- Joined
- Nov 4, 2009
- Messages
- 112
I think I'd go settler after the archer. Settle on the desert hill to keep forcing Churchill along the coast. The great thing about Expansive is when you whip something for full overflow (~30
Nice. This also sounds like it will dovetail nicely with the plans to let the new worker hook up the stone. That same worker can then do the chops for TGW.
Shurdus
Am I Napoleon?
Ok, I played my set.
Churchill settled the hill where his settler was on turn 43. I take out the scout on the very same turn.
Note how this warrior is no longer spawnbusting anything. I send him over to the hills to the east. No hostile unit can then sneak up on us without detection.
Turn 44.
The Archer in the cap is done - or maybe it was done the turn before, anyway I pick a settler next. I note two scouts, one near the English hill city and one next to moscow. I take them both out.
turn 48
Writing is in. I set research to 0% to benefit from beaker multipliers. I set research to polytheism. I think setting the slider back is no big deal since none of the upcoming techs would help us out military wise. there is therefore no real pressure to speed things up. I also get the stone online, undoing the farm that was on the stone...
Note how I plan whipping the settler for max overflow.
Turn 49
I get the granary in Moscow for one turn. I forgot to mention that the monument in St. Pete's was done too, so I queued a granary there next.
I set production in Moscow to THW and chop one riverside grasshill forrest into it.
The archer that got completed before the settler dies while being in a forrest.
That archer dying was indeed very unfortunate. I should probably not have sent him out to spawnbust since we were planning to get TGW online. However, I feel like I made no mistake in positioning him. Note the log, we had 78ish percent chance to win there. I feel like I took no exceptional risks there but I still feel guilty for not thinking more carefully about this...
Note how St. Pete's is undefended. The archer is close though. I pre-chop the forrest 1 SE of St. Pete's so that we can 1 turn chop an archer should we badly need defenders soon. I do not think it will be a nessecity, but still...
I also whipped the granary there, the overflow is put into a library. After clicking the button I realise that it was not needed to do this... My bad.
Turn 56
TGW is in! Finally some brighter news!
I also settle the dessert hill as suggested. It is undefended right now, Defending it will be somewhat of a priority. The warrior keeping an eye on the chokepoint spotted no hostiles though, so I figured that given that fact, plus the possibility of chopping the archer in St Pete's makes it so that an undefended front city there is no huge deal as of now.
Churchill also hands us some Charity Rice.
After this I think I am, pretty much done.
Here is the overview of our cities.
Churchill settled the hill where his settler was on turn 43. I take out the scout on the very same turn.
Spoiler :
Note how this warrior is no longer spawnbusting anything. I send him over to the hills to the east. No hostile unit can then sneak up on us without detection.
Spoiler :
Turn 44.
The Archer in the cap is done - or maybe it was done the turn before, anyway I pick a settler next. I note two scouts, one near the English hill city and one next to moscow. I take them both out.
Spoiler :
turn 48
Writing is in. I set research to 0% to benefit from beaker multipliers. I set research to polytheism. I think setting the slider back is no big deal since none of the upcoming techs would help us out military wise. there is therefore no real pressure to speed things up. I also get the stone online, undoing the farm that was on the stone...
Spoiler :
Note how I plan whipping the settler for max overflow.
Spoiler :
Turn 49
I get the granary in Moscow for one turn. I forgot to mention that the monument in St. Pete's was done too, so I queued a granary there next.
I set production in Moscow to THW and chop one riverside grasshill forrest into it.
The archer that got completed before the settler dies while being in a forrest.
Spoiler :
That archer dying was indeed very unfortunate. I should probably not have sent him out to spawnbust since we were planning to get TGW online. However, I feel like I made no mistake in positioning him. Note the log, we had 78ish percent chance to win there. I feel like I took no exceptional risks there but I still feel guilty for not thinking more carefully about this...
Spoiler :
Note how St. Pete's is undefended. The archer is close though. I pre-chop the forrest 1 SE of St. Pete's so that we can 1 turn chop an archer should we badly need defenders soon. I do not think it will be a nessecity, but still...
I also whipped the granary there, the overflow is put into a library. After clicking the button I realise that it was not needed to do this... My bad.
Spoiler :
Turn 56
TGW is in! Finally some brighter news!
Spoiler :
I also settle the dessert hill as suggested. It is undefended right now, Defending it will be somewhat of a priority. The warrior keeping an eye on the chokepoint spotted no hostiles though, so I figured that given that fact, plus the possibility of chopping the archer in St Pete's makes it so that an undefended front city there is no huge deal as of now.
Churchill also hands us some Charity Rice.
Spoiler :
After this I think I am, pretty much done.
Here is the overview of our cities.
Spoiler :
Looks like another fine set,
Too bad for the archer... may he find a happier life in the lands beyond Civilization.
Some things:
No need to fogbust anymore, let's pull back the warrior to the north. He can serve as city garrison to the end of his days.
Why are we roading corn? We have between 9 and 11
surplus everywhere. Cancel the worker doing so and get him to do something more useful... like improving the new city.
Churchill has just started on his next settler. My feeling is he will settle the copper but... where? Hopefully he is smart and goes for the hill.
Moscow: call me crazy but I'd queue another worker and then a settler. We can *try* for Mids later on.
St-Pete: let's add a chop or two for the library. This way we can generate a GS faster than the GSpy from TGW in Moscow. Also farm the fp 1E of it and give it to Novgorod (it's halfway built already)
Next city: sheep/wine to block the north to ourselves.
Can the next player move the marker 1N for the marble city? Just so we don't get confused.
Techs:
Without the ability to trade, there are several things we need.
-Monarchy for wineries/HR if we don't get the Mids and
-Feudalism for obvious reasons
-CoL perhaps for a religion (or maybe we can grab Taoism instead)
-Currency for economy
-IW for jungle and iron
-Aesthetics/Literature
The question is, what order?
I think we can discard CoL as a priority. Taoism should be fine enough and is an easy bulb.
IW should be fast after the economy is settled.
Monarchy would allow unlimited happy and make Feudalism easier should we start having difficulty with troops.
Currency... should never be delayed too much
Aesthetics/Literature are extras but could quite be worth it as an economy source.
Churchill is currently researching Sailing by himself which isn't bad but in the future please kindly redirect his research on the correct path.
Techwise... I'm not quite sure. Hooking up marble is quite far off.
Currency is several techs away so I'd stick with monarchy for now.
Too bad for the archer... may he find a happier life in the lands beyond Civilization.
Some things:
No need to fogbust anymore, let's pull back the warrior to the north. He can serve as city garrison to the end of his days.
Why are we roading corn? We have between 9 and 11
surplus everywhere. Cancel the worker doing so and get him to do something more useful... like improving the new city.Churchill has just started on his next settler. My feeling is he will settle the copper but... where? Hopefully he is smart and goes for the hill.
Moscow: call me crazy but I'd queue another worker and then a settler. We can *try* for Mids later on.
St-Pete: let's add a chop or two for the library. This way we can generate a GS faster than the GSpy from TGW in Moscow. Also farm the fp 1E of it and give it to Novgorod (it's halfway built already)
Next city: sheep/wine to block the north to ourselves.
Can the next player move the marker 1N for the marble city? Just so we don't get confused.
Techs:
Without the ability to trade, there are several things we need.
-Monarchy for wineries/HR if we don't get the Mids and
-Feudalism for obvious reasons
-CoL perhaps for a religion (or maybe we can grab Taoism instead)
-Currency for economy
-IW for jungle and iron
-Aesthetics/Literature
The question is, what order?
I think we can discard CoL as a priority. Taoism should be fine enough and is an easy bulb.
IW should be fast after the economy is settled.
Monarchy would allow unlimited happy and make Feudalism easier should we start having difficulty with troops.
Currency... should never be delayed too much
Aesthetics/Literature are extras but could quite be worth it as an economy source.
Churchill is currently researching Sailing by himself which isn't bad but in the future please kindly redirect his research on the correct path.
Techwise... I'm not quite sure. Hooking up marble is quite far off.
Currency is several techs away so I'd stick with monarchy for now.
