Large Stacks

[Mesousa]

What happens when you go bankrupt anyway? I know in Civ3 it would sell city improvements automatically, but I never ran out of cash in Civ4. Is it the same thing?

No, since city improvements don't cost maintenance in Civ IV. When you're broke in Civ IV, you lose units.

 

[lovetramy]

rif is ok against gran as long as you on the offensive because gran bonus doesnt apply when defending

 

[Mik1984]

Well I would conclude that the civIV does not adequately penalize stacks of doom(SMAC did).

 

[say1988]

I never played much SMAC (found it tedious compared to Civ II), but it was that you lose the entire stack, if you lose one defender, like Civ II, correct?
That is overkill.
I would prefer to see lots of small stacks to one big one, though.

 

[pi-r8]

rif is ok against gran as long as you on the offensive because gran bonus doesnt apply when defending

Huh? I'm pretty sure it does. You're thinking of the chariot bonus against axes.

 

[slaze]

Huh? I'm pretty sure it does. You're thinking of the chariot bonus against axes.

No, both have attack bonuses only

 

[vb1]

i play standard monarch maps and my big stacks are only 15-20 units... no bigger is needed because the AI's stacks are generally about the same size, and not as well managed.

Could it be that an "escalation effect" occurs? - the AI observes the power graph and tries to match it, so if you have a massive stack you will probably face one, whereas if you have smaller stacks the AI will too?

Or am I just playing too easy on too small maps to need or see truly doom-like stacks?

play on deity thats when you see real sized stacks especially from warmongers like monty and shaka

 

[Levgre]

grenadiers are too powerful against riflemen. You'd need a stack twice as large to do well. It's 14 vs 18.

If they go for grenadiers, either do cavalry and cannons (with a small amount of riflemen for defense against cannons and mounted), or just wait for infantry, as going for military science has slowed them down (since it's a dead end tech)

 

[dubrown]

I've seen huge AI SoDs on Prince level as well, though in Epic speed. But it could've been because I invaded Zara's (who was my equal in power but he was lacking techwise). I had planned my attack wisely or so I thought, surprise attack on one of his bigger coastal cities. A cakewalk to defeat the 2 or so rifles and a few more obsoletes he had defending the city, getting my troops into the city, my defense in that city was ~10 infs, 4 machinegunners, some tanks, plently of cannons and cavalry. The next turn he hit me with troops that took my computer 10 minutes to resolve all the battleanimations. Everything from Pikemen up to curiassers and rifles. He finished my attackforce and retook his city, when I studied what troops he had left, it was still a quite impressive stack in that city and outside it. Ofc I reloaded, delayed the war a few turn to improve my own SoD, now with focus on more of my newly aquired unit, tanks. I beefed up on defensive forces as well. Declared war again, took another city which was easier to defend (alas, he couldn't reach it with his SoD in one go, so my tanks/cannons would have a first go on his stack.) Well, even with alot more defense and a good chunk of his SoD dead from my strike, he did beat me anyway. Third time though, I divided the forces, hit him from two direction, while I lost in one end due to his SoD I got a good foothold on the other end of his continent and could start the invasion.

Ah, maybe a bit off topic but anyway, SoDs can be huge in BtS, good or bad but atleast it gives some interesting battles...

 

[Pariah]

I just lost 3 successive 1-city challenge games (monarch, standard pangaea or lake maps) because of AI SoDs. Several of the AI civs always seem to declare war on me simultaneously - 4 or 5 big nations against 1 little single-city state, how cowardly and despicable is that?!? What's worse, they seem to crank out stacks of 30+ units every 3 or 4 turns! How do they do it? No matter how well-fortified my city was, or how experienced my defenders, sheer numbers always crushed me - especially when 2 SoDs hit me in the same turn.

I mean, if you have to spam units for dozens of consecutive turns, just to survive, when do you get the time to construct new buildings or wonders?

 

[vb1]

I just lost 3 successive 1-city challenge games (monarch, standard pangaea or lake maps) because of AI SoDs. Several of the AI civs always seem to declare war on me simultaneously - 4 or 5 big nations against 1 little single-city state, how cowardly and despicable is that?!? What's worse, they seem to crank out stacks of 30+ units every 3 or 4 turns! How do they do it? No matter how well-fortified my city was, or how experienced my defenders, sheer numbers always crushed me - especially when 2 SoDs hit me in the same turn.

I mean, if you have to spam units for dozens of consecutive turns, just to survive, when do you get the time to construct new buildings or wonders?

One city challenges are all about diplomacy.
Pick one leader that you gonna bribe and shower with gifts for the entire game until he signs a defensive pact and later a permanent alliance with you, and you can avoid the above problems.
Obviously if everyone hates or is at least cautious with you, expect them to pick a fight with a little pushover one city state. (Wouldnt you do the same to the AI if it was in your position?)

 

[Mik1984]

I never played much SMAC (found it tedious compared to Civ II), but it was that you lose the entire stack, if you lose one defender, like Civ II, correct?
That is overkill.
I would prefer to see lots of small stacks to one big one, though.

No, units in the stack received collateral damage unless in a base or bunker. Moreover you had a lot of measures that required you to space out your forces to get ground control, like ZOC, long range bombardment, mobile in open combat bonuses, air units scrambling to support ground troops, etc....

 

[say1988]

Well then, I think Civ II did a better job at stack removal. Though it really pissed me off late game, when I would have the entire city surrounded by units, and there would be troops left in it, so I had to stack.

 

[ranger101]

Well I would conclude that the civIV does not adequately penalize stacks of doom(SMAC did).

I tend to agree. Combat is far less strategic in my opinion than it could be. Now it is just pile your guys in the stack and get moving.

The best thing for an attacker is if the defender has forests (or hills) adjacent to the city he is going to attack. The attacker can reduce the city defenses to zero, meanwhile is pretty much invulnerable in the forest (and quite tough in the hills).

 

[mike p]

I was playing a game as Hes, standard size. I had 2 vassals as my neighbors and Biz just past my largest vassal. I took over Frankfurt and founds stacks of 10 Knights and 10 War Elephants combined with longbowmen in his 3 largest cities. I had rifleman so, knowing that I didn't have the troop power to move forward, I hunkered down in Frankfurt and started building rifles like crazy while teching to Industrialism. I built 20 rifles for the next battle. however, the game decided we needed 20 turns of peace giving him enough time to tech grenadiers, which kill rifles. So, I had a stack of 20 rifles, 4 cannons and 5 cavalry with 3 generals mixed in and all having 3 levels of promotions going into battle, and I got slaughtered. he attacked me first while I was on a jungle tile after I declared war. he left me with 1 rifle and had 15 varied units with some damage left. How should I have approached this differently and how do you deal with massive stacks like this?

You shouldn't have let him attack you first. Rifleman on the attack kill Grenadiers fairly easily, especially if you have three promotions and can take Pinch. I'd declare, let his stack come into your territory and then attack with the Riflemen using your road advantage to land the first blow. Letting his Grenadiers launch the first attack on your stack was a blunder, IMO.

 

[cronullasharks]

Letting his Grenadiers launch the first attack on your stack was a blunder, IMO.[/QUOTE]

Bingo