Last chance for 255 future techs?

[moof]

We have never gone all out for a high score.
(well we thought we had till we found this site)

There are 255 future techs that can be discovered.
To win with a spaceship it has to land no later than 2019.
The last (255th) future tech has to be discovered in 2018.
Assuming all the "regular techs" have been discovered, what is the last possible date
to start researching future tech #1 and still get all 255 future techs ?

There isn't some way to get more than one future tech per turn is there?

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TTFNFm & MTFBWY moof

" Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity,

and I'm not sure about the former. " - Albert Einstein

Edit:Because of Shadowdales reply below & there is plenty of
misinformation out there without adding links to it.

[This message has been edited by moof (edited August 28, 2001).]

 

[shadowdale]

Well first of all the information in the War academy about the turns in the game on different levels, isn't correct - it has later been discovered that the number of turns is also depended on the map size - but Chieftain and Deity games always have the same number of turns!!!!

Secondly - it is quite easy to discover more than one tech per turn, you can do this any time in the game - as long as your cities are producing enough science beakers.

So all you have to do is have a large number of cities and trade routes in all of them, then the techs will come all by them selves.

And there is one more thing - when you reachers future tech number 164(or 168) then the amount of science beakers required for the next tech reset and you usually end up getting 15-40 future tech is one turn and several more in the following 2-3 turns!!!

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We are species 8472 - assimilation attempts are futile - the weak shall perish

No wait we are species 5618 and we got beer...... don't harm us!!!!!!

 

[moof]

shadowdale,

We were a little concerned by the line
" I have only partially confirmed the figures "
in the link that we deleted.
Thanks for the info, always great to hear
a reply from an unempeachable source.
We will tell Sam you said thanks next time we see him at the frog jumping contest down in Calaveras county.

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TTFNFm & MTFBWY moof

" Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity,

and I'm not sure about the former. " - Albert Einstein

 

[Lefty Scaevola]

you can lnad your spaceship on 2020 turn to win.

 

[Lefty Scaevola]

The future tech timing is very diffucult, because rather than just stopping at 255, it RESETS TO ZERO, so you have to make sure you do not go over. This is more complicated because at some point, at different future tech levels for diferent condition, the algorythim for cacluating beaker cost breack and all of a sudden you are getting about 10X as many future techs per turn.

 

[Andu Indorin]

The real trick is to get to FT 167; from about FT 145 onward (depending on which civ you're playing), each FT requires 32,000 beakers. To guarantee receiving two techs per turn requires a very large, scientifically-oriented civilization. However, at two techs per turn, figure 83 turns to FT 166 (though you can often squeeze a third tech per turn from a highly developed economy). Then, you can achieve techs FT 167 through 255 in 3 turns, but you really have to pay attention to your science to avoid the "overshoot." To achieve FT 255 in 2019, about the latest you can start is around 1933.

 

[allan]

Never shot for 255 (made it to about 150 though), but I suppose you could build your spaceship ahead of time, and keep from launching it until you need to to avoid the overshoot you mentioned.... The max-sized ship seems to take 11 years to reach target, so if you can judge how many techs you can get in 11 years (I've never run into this phenomena after 168 before though, sounds like it gets a little out of hand after that), launch your ship at FT#255 minus that number. If you got to slow it down, set science to zero, turn your scientists to entertainers, and go fundy as necessary to slow your rate down if you think you'll overshoot! I would THINK this would be a solution, but like I said I never tried it (games start getting REAL tedious for me when it starts taking an hour to complete 4 or 5 turns....).

 

[moof]

shadowdale,

Once again we take our hats off to you and eat them!!
We have no idea why we thought that only one discovery per turn was the limit
but we finally got two techs in one turn yesterday.
This was on an old warlord game we dug out that had nearly a hundred cities already,
so it would not take as long but it is already getting quite tedious.
A couple more questions if you are still checking this thread.
We have tried to check the limits for money for our mac edition and the
money and the Tax setting box are both acting weird. When we set the
tax/lux/science box to say where we are showing $6000 income with
only $3000 expenses. If we then close the box and open it again it will show that the
income is now only $2500 so that we are loseing 500 instead of gaining 3000.
This is with about $33,000 in the bank. Even with the Tax rate at 9000 income to
3000 expense, at 37,000 the cash drops a thousand or so instead of gaining the six grand.
Any wisdom on these events ?

Also not that we do not trust you (Lefty Scaevola) but can you confirm that a spaceship
can land in 2020 without the game ending first by time running out, shadowdale ?

------------------
TTFNFm & MTFBWY moof

" Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity,

and I'm not sure about the former. " - Albert Einstein


[This message has been edited by moof (edited September 01, 2001).]

 

[allan]

In CivI the limit for your treasury was 30,000. It seems like there's something similar in CivII--not exactly 30 grand, but you can't make money if you have more than 30 grand held over from the last turn. I generally rush-build a bunch of stuff when I go over like that.... Anyone know for sure what the cash limits are in CivII?

[This message has been edited by allan (edited September 01, 2001).]

 

[Goatman]

Originally posted by allan:
Anyone know for sure what the cash limits are in CivII?

As far as I've seen $30,000 is correct, unless you get a patch.

Originally posted by moof:
...Any wisdom on these events ?

I have also encountered this event. As far as I can tell it is just a bug in the game. The only way around it is to continually check your tax rates.

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I know all of the answers, It's the questions that confuse me.

 

[starlifter]

...
confirm that a spaceship can land in 2020 without the game ending first by time running out
...

Yes, you can indeed land a SS in 2020. However, the last turn of growth, improvement completion, etc. is going into 2019.

When your SS lands in 2020, the event occurs almost instantly after you end your 2019 turn. So what you have in 2019, plus your SS points, are what you are going to finish with!

 

[moof]

Thanks Starlifter !!,

BTW we have gotten our mac version of Civ II up to $39,902.
The last several turns only add 2 or 3 $ a turn though even with
Taxes at 12,500 & Expenses at 2,600. after $39,902 it starts losing $ by
2 or 3 $ a turn.
Sorry is it Gold not $? Oh well you get the point all be it a small one.



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TTFNFm & MTFBWY moof

" Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity,

and I'm not sure about the former. " - Albert Einstein

 

[starlifter]

BTW, Moof, if you want to see a SS land in 2020, you can download my Deity HOF game (its the #2 game) from:
http://www.civfanatics.com/civ2hof.shtml

Just extract the 2019 game and load it. It was saved with Civ II MGE, 5.4.0f. As soon as you end the turn, the SS lands before anything else can occur.

 

[allan]

Which is why you can't have a "double win"--i.e. win by both conquest and spaceship.... I tried it once, two ways:

1)I conquered the last city the year before my ship landed, and it never showed the spaceship movie next turn (just the guillotine thing). Nor did it give me the (400) points for my spaceship....

2)I waited till the ship landing turn before taking the last city, but then never had the opportunity to take that city because (as Starlifter said) the spaceship movie runs at the very beginning of the turn....

[This message has been edited by allan (edited September 06, 2001).]

 

[moof]

allan,

LOL, yes we can confirm that it works just the same as you described above
for Civ II Mac version 1.0 We tryed that a while back when we were trying to figure out the difference in points
between a SS win and a ConQuest win early in the game.

BTW where does it show if you got a bonus for winning a game early?

------------------
TTFNFm & MTFBWY moof

" Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity,

and I'm not sure about the former. " - Albert Einstein

 

[allan]

You know, I've wondered that myself.... I don't know if there is such a bonus (I know the manual seems to state there is).

Maybe it's figured into that percentage "rating" but not the raw score. Does anyone here know for sure? I always finish earlier than 2020 (sometimes much earlier), but have never seen any acknowledgement of that achievement....

 

[starlifter]

The "early finish" bonus is very misleading.

First... technically, the "bonus" is not a "bonus" score, since it is not "added" to a base score. It is a "replacement" score... that's because it completely substitutes for the "normal" score.

This is how it works... based on the map & game characteristics which are set at the outset of the game, Civ II computes a "secret", fixed value for an early conquest. Whenever you win Civ II, the "normal" score is compared to the "secretly" computed score and the year you wiped everyone out, and if Civ II "decides" what you did was worthy, the higher of the two is what you get.

Though the secret bonus amount is fixed, under certain conditions of late game years, it can in fact be reduced.

Eventually during the game, there will come a certain point (a year) in which your "regular" score will exceed value of the "secret" bonus. From that point on, the bonus is irrelevant. Generally, this "crossover" point is very early in the game, so unless you are conquering say, in the BC years, or maybe early AD years, you probably won't see it.

Remember, it is a fixed bonus... that means you get the same bonus if you kill everyone in 3900 BC or 400 BC. You will not get a bigger bonus for a faster kill. But conversely, the bonus can (and eventually will) be reduced in later years, and eventaully the "normal" score will be greater, and hence the one reported. I've never tested or researched the exact pattern, since that is not my style of play.


Hope that helps <IMG SRC="http://forums.civfanatics.com/ubb/wink.gif" border=0>.

EDIT: Wording changes.

[This message has been edited by starlifter (edited September 06, 2001).]

 

[starlifter]

Here is an example... in GOTM 6, the "early conquest" "bonus" was 1140. If you wiped everyone out soon enough, your score "bonus" would have been 1140, and it would have been annotated on your Civ II score screen. Since the 50^PNP function already rewards the time factor in the GOTM scores, you would have had to count and add up your "normal" score manually to compute the GOTM score in that situation.