[MERGE] KROME Beta: K-Mod 1.31 and RoM 1.03 Extended

[JosEPh_II]

@jtanner28,
I managed to get a savegame loaded by going thru the Advanced BtS Main Screen Option then loading Krome. Otherwise if I tried to load from BtS Main screen Load Save Game it would give the "Cannot Load version 303 expected version 302 or lower" Error msg. See previous post screenshot.

Once I got the game to reload my last save I could start at 2050BC, Savegame attached. But as I progressed thru the turn and into the next 2025BC I would start getting error msgs (see screenshot). Then it will CTD (logs provided).

Hope this helps. Up to this point had been playing fine. Will continue to see if I can figure out a work around.

JosEPh

 

[jtanner28]

Sweet! Log files, screenshots, and save files. Thanks JosEPh_II. That should help out immensely. Looks like a night code-crawling and caffiene for me.

 

[kiwi_lifter]

Are there any common conditions that accompany the freezes? Is it just a complete freeze or a CTD? About how often are they occurring? Any data you can provide would be helpful to try to track it down and fix it. My current suspicion centers around random events. I read in the old revision notes that RoM had a problem with events at one time. Are you playing with events enabled?

Hi again,

World Builder often crashes the game....but sometimes simple things like moving a unit or a wonder being built does it. Every game has crashed so far before the Rennaisance.

Events are on, btw.

@as it's a complete freeze, I have to restart the game. Usually, I can play on if it was a world builder freeze, otherwise, it tends to crash soon again.

 

[satrapper]

hey jt
i discovered your project via your post on the kmod thread. good idea this. hav'nt played much yet and obv it's still in beta but couple quick observations:

i would echo kiwi lifter and lose the unique units and buildings, lighter mod the better. but thats just my pref, tis your baby

bug options dont save (well for me anyway). CvModName.py still refers to RoM, you should prob change that to KROME so it matches the mod folder name for those of us that don't have RoM installed.

(edit) i just ran a quick civcheck on it, there are a load of xml errors to fix, they are a likely source of ctd behaviour

 

[jtanner28]

hey jt
(edit) i just ran a quick civcheck on it, there are a load of xml errors to fix, they are a likely source of ctd behaviour

Yup, been tracking them down. I'm not sure what "civcheck" is though. Sounds like something I could use.

@JosEPh_II Thank you so much for the logs and savefile. They helped me pin down some of the CTD's. Your savegame will now play past where you saved it.

NEW VERSION Beta 0.7 uploaded in OP. Now with (at least) 30% less hair-pulling teeth-grinding CTD madness!

Seriously though. I've learned a bucketload from this little troubleshooting experience and will not make those particular mistakes again. FYI, modular loading seems to be broken, so some of the RoM 1.03 Extended stuff is missing for a bit. I'll have it all back in, plus new stuff and changes in version 0.8. I'm getting confident enough with the XML and Python that I think I should be able to start actually customizing the content now without destroying the whole mod.

EDIT: Darn it! I still have the startup errors... GRRR! OK, I'll figure it out later.

 

[satrapper]

civcheck is a very handy, simple tool for this stuff, read the thread a bit to get a handle on it first:http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=276286

i ran it there on 0.7, it flagged a few you missed
keep up the good work!

 

[jtanner28]

civcheck is a very handy, simple tool for this stuff, read the thread a bit to get a handle on it first:http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=276286

i ran it there on 0.7, it flagged a few you missed
keep up the good work!

DOH! Sometimes I am such a dunce. Of course there would be a sub-forum with modding tools just sitting there waiting to be used. I just never thought to look. I've been puzzling this stuff out with an abacus and a broken crayon when I could have been coding in style. LOL! I'll check out all the tools (especially civcheck) when I get home from work. Thanks satrapper.

 

[satrapper]

in order to save mod settings like BUG, the modname in CvModName.py must match the name of the folder which contains the mod, in this case, simply "KROME". lose the beta reference. or name the mod folder "KROME Beta 0.7" or whatever. just have them matching. CvPath.py details this i believe.

keep on trucking, i look forward to the complete version.

 

[JosEPh_II]

FYI, modular loading seems to be broken, so some of the RoM 1.03 Extended stuff is missing for a bit.

Iirc RoM 1.03 was prior to Zappara starting to use the WOC system. After 1.03 WOC and Modular loading became the rage.

Now with that said, for 1.03Extended I had Afforess integrate vincentz Jungle Camp Mod and it was a Modular type Mod. So if 1.03 uses the Modular system it was from Afforess helping me out.

I also wanted vincentz early Industry Mod as it really helped when you got to the Ren/Industrial Eras. But by that time Afforess was lobing interest in Modding CIV and was getting into Minecraft.

@satrapper,
Thanks for helping jt out. I, for one, really want this Mod to fly!

Getting set to D/L beta 0.7.

JosEPh

 

[jtanner28]

@satrapper: Thanks for that info. I was not aware of that. Come to think of it, that is likely the cause of the BUG init errors at game startup. I'll be scouring the XML later with civcheck to squish any other bugs I can find. Stability and playability are my #1 priorities.

@JosEPh_II: I have all the modular files that Afforess converted (Jungle Camp, Industry, and another one that I can't remember right now). I tried to get them to work with a modular load, but it crashed immediately. I integrated the Jungle camp mod already. It was actually the cause of your save game crash. A couple of your workers were building a Jungle Camp. It was due to be completed by 2025 BC but would crash the game because of an incorrect art file definition. I stayed up to the wee hours of the night figuring it out and getting Jungle Camp references correctly integrated into all the proper spots in the XML. I knew I had it right when your save game would successfully go past 2025 BC. I'll do the same with the other two mods.

Now that I'm getting the hang of this, what do you think about any changes? It's been suggested to remove the extra UU's and UB's. That should be pretty easy to do, assuming that no one has an issue with it. Another thing I'd like to do is put in all the advanced unit actions like Sentry and Protect as well as all the neat worker automation actions that were in later versions of RoM:AND. What does everyone think? I have a lot of cool ideas, but I don't want to stray too far from the heart of RoM.

T

 

[JosEPh_II]

Some changes that will be needed are in the tech tree. The way it's set up now in 1.03 Ext you have a tech path that leads thru Polytheism. Unfortuanately it's been a proven headache that this inturn gives a Tech leading player (AI or Human) a big advantage in founding more that 1 religion in a very short space of time. Poly leads to Mono that leads into Buddhism which leads into Code of Law that gives Confuscism. So the tech leader can go 1, 2, 3, and boom 4, add lead all others in religions.

It's a matter of prerequiste techs and tech tree placement. The breaking up of the Poly to Mono path is a relatively easy fix.

As for the UU's and UB's I don't have a problem with them nor did I back when RoM 1.03 was a new mod back in 2008.

JosEPh

 

[kiwi_lifter]

Thank you for all your work, Tanner! Like Joe, I am very excited to see this project take off.

I second his recommendation on the tech tree. It's very easy to found four religions via the same path now, and they all get very bunched up. Also, as mentioned earlier, Lit and Christianity should probably be divorced.

Would you be able to do a right up of what you've got in mind, and then we could discuss it? For me, the additional resources, new tech tree, great ai, and improved game speed are the big draws.

Some options that I like to play with from AND that hopefully won't cause any speed issues: Advanced Espionage, bigger cities, useable mountains, no future era.

 

[jtanner28]

I have some ideas about how to correct the religion tech tree problem but I'm kinda pressed for time right now. I'll write it up later and see what everyone thinks. It will involve tech tree changes and probably three new religions. Also possiy some custom coding to make religions in cities more dynamic. By the way, what does everyone think if a possible integration of the True Prophets mod-comp (with some significant tweaks)? EDIT: I just read up more about that modcomp. I'm not really enthused with some of it. I do like the idea of GP's founding religions though. Maybe have the tech give a free GP that can found the religion. My main reason for this is that I prefer to control what city becomes the holy city.

I'm currently integrating the rest of the modular stuff that Afforess converted. I've also used civcheck to eliminate a few more XML issues and finally corrected one of the startup errors. The other error is more stubborn. The message that comes up is "BugInit - init CvScreenInterface failed" it only occurs when a new game is started. I've established that it is indeed a problem with CvScreenInterface.py but have not yet identified what section of the Python is having a hiccup. If I replace the file with the default one from BtS the error goes away but the GUI vanishes too. From this I can determine that the problem is in the new sections of code or some inter-relationship between the new and old code. I intend to slowly merge the new code in a bit at a time and see when the error pops up.

I also fixed the mod name issue. Version 0.8 will be released once I've killed this bug and finished the other integrations. Version 0.9 will involve some cleanup of the Sevopedia, minor graphical errors on the city screen, additional worker and unit actions, and (hopefully) some AND options. I'm also considering a new splash screen. Probably put tht in the 1.0 release. I have my eye on Usable Mountains too, but that will require SDK changes. I'll start looking into that after 1.0.

 

[satrapper]

good to see you making progress!

The message that comes up is "BugInit - init CvScreenInterface failed" it only occurs when a new game is started. I've established that it is indeed a problem with CvScreenInterface.py but have not yet identified what section of the Python is having a hiccup. If I replace the file with the default one from BtS the error goes away but the GUI vanishes too.

karadoc has made a chunk of changes to how BUG operates in kmod i think. adding a host of BUG stuff back in via RoM is bound to cause hassle, i'd suggest just leaving out as much BUG code not included in kmod as possible.
for example, the above error (and the non-functioning pedia) will go away if you simply remove all the "CvPedia" python in the screens folder. oh and CvScreenEnums too. they all come from sevopedia.

this would make the stock pedia the default but you can turn sevopedia back on in kmod bug options somewhere.

 

[jtanner28]

KROME Beta 0.8 released!

Fixed the Pedia bug
Fixed all startup bugs
Added back the Industry improvements
Fixed multiple XML errors (probable cause of CTD's)

Should be very close to "CTD-free"... hopefully.

I haven't made any tech tree changes yet, but that is next on my list. I'll be trying to fix the "religion rush" that starts at Polytheism. One quick note: The BUG option to view either the Sevopedia or the regular Civilopedia does not operate any more. Only the Sevopedia is available right now. I'll probably just remove the options buttons on the next release.

Uploading the file now. It'll be ready in a few minutes. Upload speed is really bad right now.

 

[JosEPh_II]

The True Prophets Mod is a kissing cousin to the Divine Prophet Mod that was in AND and is now refined in C2C. In AND the DP had coding issues. But ThunderBird of the C2CX Team has cleaned that up for C2C. Personally, it's okay and fun at times, but I wouldn't be upset if it didn't make it into KROME. C2C has 26 religions right now and I'm sure you could get some ideas and borrow some code to help there too. Dancing Huskold is the Religion Guru for C2C. And his expertise was used in RoM and AND extensively.

Useable Mountains does require SDK, that's why it wasn't in RoM1.03Ext even though I asked Afforess if he would do it. He declined. I'd Love it if it could be added in, as well as Multiple Production and Multiple Research.

I'm hoping you Don't add in REV. But if you decide to, PLEASE! keep it as an Option. IMHO REV causes strong AI opponents to become shattered messes. (Phungus does not like me for saying this. )

I was able to load 2025 and continue my current game. Which brings up something, Koshling has made a a Save format that makes a savegame Compatible to accepting upgrades. It rarely allows any same to be come incompatible. It's Called Max Compatibility and has been a regular feature of C2C for sometime now. But I have no idea what's involved in adding it to another Mod. Although AND 2.0 beta was supposed to have it in it.

I have lots of things I'd love to see in KROME but since it is you doing the work and not I, I'll just suggest and hope you like what you see posted.

JosEPh

 

[satrapper]

damn, you work fast. excellent job with this. serious pat on the back deserved.
i played about 200 turns of 0.8 and had not a single issue, ctd or otherwise. promotions in pedia is garbled but thats it.

 

[jtanner28]

Accidental Double Post

 

[jtanner28]

Thank you. I'm trying to learn as quickly as I can. I'll take a look at the promotions in the pedia and see what I can do. I have another small list of errors that I'm looking into also. Hmm, I may just update the OP with a "Known Issues" section so that everyone can view them and can keep track of what still needs work.

In other news, I successfully set up VC2008 Express last night with the K-Mod source files so that I can begin to add SDK changes to KROME. I did a quick addition of some C++ code (it was 2:30 AM... way too late to try anything too huge), complied it and tested the new dll in game. It completely worked. Now I'm all set for Passable Mountains, Multiple Production/Research, and all manner of other stuff.

In fact, I have an idea for an actual NEW feature. Something unique to KROME. It's not a huge idea, but it would lead to new gameplay mechanics. And it would require me to construct some AI code so that the AI characters could use it too. If it works out and seems like something the community would like I'll back-port it to vanilla BTS as a SDK/Python Modcomp. No hints on what it will be. I don't want to overcommit. I'll keep it in a seperate branch of KROME until it works and then release it. Probably v1.1 or 1.2.

Speaking of versions, I think it would be cool to make a "roadmap" of what I intend to do. I want to stick with the basic themes of RoM, AND, and K-Mod, but branch off with some new ideas at some point. I'll always want the mod playable on lower-end PC's, so I won't be adding just everything under the sun. I learned a long time ago with Half-Life modding that the concepts of balance, uniqueness, and playability are incredibly important. Although I'm not to the point of synthesizing new CIV4 content from scratch, I'd like to be there some day. Right now all I can do is merge other folk's work. Hopefully this new idea that I have will be a first step in that direction.

New releases will probably slow down over the next week or so because I'll be out of town on vacation next week. I'll try to squeeze out some more bug fixes and a few new features with one more release before then.

@Joseph: Please post any ideas that you have. You have much more experience with RoM than I do. All the way back to it's beta release. My goal is for this to be a branch of RoM... Kind of an alternate history. "What if RoM hadn't used the REVDCM dll as it's base and instead went with a K-Mod base? How would it have evolved?"

 

[satrapper]

a roadmap would be hip alright. i never played RoM, was just looking the the changelogs there, zappara sure added a lot of content! and tweaked it like a mofo! which leads me - as a RoM noob - to ask how is this version 1.0.3 for balance? (prob joseph or some vetern could answer that one too if he's reading) whatever about content, will you be adding many of the gameplay changes from subsequent versions?

speaking of content from later versions, browsing the version history, the only things that float my boat really are perhaps extra events, inquisitors, BarbarianCiv and Revolution.

i'm very happy with what you've put in so far though and realize that rev especially is a lot of work to add. (more than i am willing to put in myself if i'm honest).

enjoy your vacation, jt