Mid game war advice needed

[Gocho]

Hi all, long time reader of these fantastic forums.

I'm currently playing at Emperor level and find i keep running into problems mid game when trying for conquest wins. Early game I tend to quickly axe rush a capitol for my 2nd or 3rd city then build until Maceman and kill another neighbor. The problem is after that I'm finding there is no real dominating unit until tanks. Grenadiers, Knights and Muskets aren't nearly as strong for me on the attack even with a small tech lead. I find I need to build up rather huge armies in order to conquer during these times and the upkeep of units as well as my quickly grown empire forces me to slow down which allows the computer to catch up.

Am I missing something, other then building large stacks with lots of suicide trebs which kill my upkeep is there a smarter way to wage mid game war? Tech isn't a problem as I can pretty easily get any military tech before the PC.

Edit: BTS games if it matters.

 

[axident]

Hi all, long time reader of these fantastic forums.

I'm currently playing at Emperor level and find i keep running into problems mid game when trying for conquest wins. Early game I tend to quickly axe rush a capitol for my 2nd or 3rd city then build until Maceman and kill another neighbor. The problem is after that I'm finding there is no real dominating unit until tanks. Grenadiers, Knights and Muskets aren't nearly as strong for me on the attack even with a small tech lead. I find I need to build up rather huge armies in order to conquer during these times and the upkeep of units as well as my quickly grown empire forces me to slow down which allows the computer to catch up.

Am I missing something, other then building large stacks with lots of suicide trebs which kill my upkeep is there a smarter way to wage mid game war? Tech isn't a problem as I can pretty easily get any military tech before the PC.

Edit: BTS games if it matters.

Rifles/cannons (or at least rifles/trebs), and cav rush (if you get it before the AI gets rifles) are suitable pre-tank, post-musket assault forces.

 

[madscientist]

Also, what size and type of maps. I play huge and usually had to wait until the end of the game to get domination or backdoor diplomatic in warlords. BTS is another issue but on Prince level I found the same thing. Monarch in BTS is another thing I am still working on myself.

One thing I have learned, paying upkeep on a large army is fine as long as you use it for something and not simply to impress the citizens.

 

[Saltiana]

Hi, myself I'm warring early like you, but mid game I always wait steel for canon. Canon+Rifle+gren+some cav latter to catch up my stacks.

Else if you have trouble with upkeep, you can always take a financial or organized leader if you don't do it already

 

[Gocho]

Also, what size and type of maps. I play huge and usually had to wait until the end of the game to get domination or backdoor diplomatic in warlords. BTS is another issue but on Prince level I found the same thing. Monarch in BTS is another thing I am still working on myself.

One thing I have learned, paying upkeep on a large army is fine as long as you use it for something and not simply to impress the citizens.

I vary my maps a lot but mostly some form of continents (2-3) and standard size.

I am certainly capable of taking the cities slowly from the AI but it just slows down so much in the mid game.

 

[Gocho]

Hi, myself I'm warring early like you, but mid game I always wait steel for canon. Canon+Rifle+gren+some cav latter to catch up my stacks.

Else if you have trouble with upkeep, you can always take a financial or organized leader if you don't do it already

Yeah I'm pretty much a dedicated Netherlands user so I get financial. I will try using cannons more over trebs though.

 

[Molon Labe]

I think you're overlooking Knights and Cuirassiers. They can do a number on a neighbour especially if they haven't got engineering for pikemen.

I don't think you need to delay waiting for rifling to take somebody else out, or at least, cripple them severely. There are lots of units that can put a serious hurt on the AI providing you reach them before they build up a lot of their counter.

 

[Carnage04]

I think one thing you may be missing is trying to tailor your army to combat whatever the rival you plan to attack is going to be like. They have Riflemen? Grenadiers are a must. A lot of Archery units? Maybe try some Cover promoted units.....etc.

Do whatever it takes to make sure that you are throwing units at the defenders that have the greatest odds of winning.

 

[Warspite2]

Hi all, long time reader of these fantastic forums.

I'm currently playing at Emperor level and find i keep running into problems mid game when trying for conquest wins. Early game I tend to quickly axe rush a capitol for my 2nd or 3rd city then build until Maceman and kill another neighbor. The problem is after that I'm finding there is no real dominating unit until tanks. Grenadiers, Knights and Muskets aren't nearly as strong for me on the attack even with a small tech lead. I find I need to build up rather huge armies in order to conquer during these times and the upkeep of units as well as my quickly grown empire forces me to slow down which allows the computer to catch up.

Am I missing something, other then building large stacks with lots of suicide trebs which kill my upkeep is there a smarter way to wage mid game war? Tech isn't a problem as I can pretty easily get any military tech before the PC.

Edit: BTS games if it matters.

Try pillaging first and then conquering. I have brought some civs down to their knees like this even with horse archers. Surround their key cities and resources, keep them from iron and horses, and starve them. Pillage the farms or just move on them, either way you can put the city into starvation. Then the pop will slowly go down and down, finally you attack the city and burn it down. Rinse and repeat just don't try to hold every city or you will run into financial difficulties too quick.

 

[iyyillius]

One option that is also available is the use of spies to put a city into revolt.
Right around midgame is when you should have enough spy points to do this multiple times. this negates the need for an abundence of trebs. Though you can't do it on every city it can keep an assault rolling while reenforcements are en route.

 

[Gocho]

I played through the middle ages of Sisiutil current ALC game this afternoon (no worries, not going to spoil anything) and focused on waring in the middle ages more. Had a lot more success using knights and calvary then normal though this might be due to the game being monarch.

I'm certainly focusing more on balanced armies from now on though, thanks for the tips.

 

[dankok8]

I'm currently playing at Emperor level and find i keep running into problems mid game when trying for conquest wins. Early game I tend to quickly axe rush a capitol for my 2nd or 3rd city then build until Maceman and kill another neighbor. The problem is after that I'm finding there is no real dominating unit until tanks. Grenadiers, Knights and Muskets aren't nearly as strong for me on the attack even with a small tech lead. I find I need to build up rather huge armies in order to conquer during these times and the upkeep of units as well as my quickly grown empire forces me to slow down which allows the computer to catch up.

I agree that between the classical and modern ages, defense has an advantage and tanks seem to turn that around. A way to circumvent this problem is:
1) use diplomacy - get someone to help you out in a war
2) try to fight more short wars (1-3 cities gained) rather than drawn-out ones; however, do be aware that another declaration brings negative modifiers from AI's pleased or friendly to the target civ
3) use more siege

 

[Loge]

I'm waiting until steel now because castles are such a pain to bring down with trebs. Before steel, even with lots of suicide trebs I have to try for peace after a few cities if for no reason besides the WW. Once I have cannons, grenadiers upgraded from macemen seem to be able to bring down any city once its defenses are gone.