Middle-Earth: Lord of the Mods (Private Beta I)

[Plotinus]

If Sumeria can have Enkidu Warriors, the Hobbits can have Bullroarers. Sounds fine to me.

 

[WildWeazel]

Spring break is here! Beta-time! Right? RIGHT???
I never liked the idea of an Enkidu Warrior unit, but whatever. The hobbits should have some kind of mounted unit, even if it is a pony archer.
btw the Robin Hood hat is a great idea! Why didn't I think of that? Archer, feather, it's perfect!

 

[LAW_FREAK]

Just hurry up with this mod so I dont have to wait anymore! Come on Come on pick up the pace

 

[WildWeazel]

OK look, we've had this discussion before and telling us to hurry up on OUR mod so we can get it done for YOU isn't going to help at all. We're taking our time with this because we want it done right, and we're having fun doing it. This team hasn't been working for 2 years so we can deliver you a finished product and hope it satisfies you. We're doing it because we enjoy Civ, modding, and LotR. If you want to be of any help, be my guest. But don't jump in with an ultimatum and expect us to salute and put in extra hours to get the mod done on your schedule.

 

[GRM7584]

Speaking of which, is there anything last minute I can do to help?

Edit: Post pruned to discourage further off-topic silliness.

 

[Greenlocke]

Well, we're already mucking with the facts by considering more than one Bullroarer. The only thing going for my suggestion is that the name "bullroarer" sounds a heck of a lot more Middle-Earthy and hobbitsey than "pony archer" does. Everything else about the name would be flat out innacurate. Is that something we can swallow or not?

Maybe "Bullroarer" might be more suitable as a great military leader for the hobbits rather than a hobbitsey name for 'pony archer.' Although I must admit that the former certainly sounds more LOTR-ish than the latter.

@GRM7584: I like the sounds of that (I study celtic history) but since we don't have any examples of hobbit chariots in the texts (do we?) I would hesitate to utilize them within the mod. It would be interesting though.

edit:This brings up an interesting concept that I know little about, although it has probably been discussed before. Since Civ is traditionally about what civ's could do rather than what they did do (example: the Indians can build nuclear missiles and bomb britain, although they never did this in history) is there a reason to not include ideas such as GRM7584's? Or has this mod decided to only recreate those events which did happen within the LOTR world? I would certainly enjoy utilizing hobbit chariot archers, and they would not necessarily be 'wrong', although I don't think any hobbits actually rode on chariots. My opinion is: Since we are utilizing specialized civ-specific techs and unit lines we should really attempt to 'recreate' LOTR rather than extrapolate what might have happened, although both would be fun. I feel that we (through techs and civ-specific unit lines) are already limiting and guiding each civ towards a certain pre-destined direction rather than allowing the user to 'take the civ' in any direction they choose. Hobbit should act like hobbits, and orcs like orcs, right? Any opinions?

 

[Plotinus]

I think the idea of Hobbit chariots is getting a bit silly. Hobbits aren't Celts, they're English if they're anything, and the closest thing the English have ever got to a chariot is those awful rickshaw things that hurtle around the West End late at night!

 

[GRM7584]

Gosh, not to be rude, but...

(for the slow among us: I am not serious. The purpose of this post is to offer generic help, which WO seemed to indicate might be appreciated)

 

[Greenlocke]

and the closest thing the English have ever got to a chariot is those awful rickshaw things that hurtle around the West End late at night!

If I'm not mistaken, when Aulus Platius invaded Britain with 4 legions between 43-47 AD, he was met by Britons (who were actually Celts I believe, because they practiced the 'loose' Celtic religion and utilized Druids) whose nobles fought and travelled upon chariots. Right?


@GRM7584: I don't see any problem with discussing your idea. Sometimes those ideas offered in jest turn out quite good.

 

[GRM7584]

Edit: Post pruned to discourage further off-topic silliness.

 

[Bjornlo]

Not to mention there were once anglos and Picts there.
They were ruled for couple of hundred years by the vikings (including 150yrs in a row).
Then there was the invasion and conquest by the normans ( vikings living in western France, a gift from the king of France).

England is not a singular tribe that moved forward, but an ebb and flow of many tribes.

 

[Mithadan]

Eeuw, no chariots. Hobbitses aren't very celtic, as noted above. Wagons might be an option, but if so it would have to be distinct from the wains of the Wainriders!

 

[LAW_FREAK]

You know maybe I WASN'T SERIOUS about telling you to hurry up OK. I too would prefer a well done mod. and dont take everything sooooooooo seriously. OK

 

[Greenlocke]

While I will agree that Hobbits are not Celtic, this statement:

English are Anglo-Saxon, not Celtic

is wrong. Read a history book. The Celts migrated to England during their grand migration phase between the sixth and fourth centuries B.C. Although all of Britain was not Celtic, much of Britain, particularily the South and East was. Also keep in mind that most Germanic tribes (including the angles and saxons) were also celtic in origin, although most of the celtic religion was lost on the continent because the Romans wanted to wipe it out. (The Celts sacked Rome in 390 B.C. and the Romans bore a grudge...) The Picts were also related to the Celts, although how much they are related is impossible to determine now. They used iron tools and weapons that were typical of the 'La Tene' Celtic culture, however they might have just traded for these things. What you really have to understand is that the Celtic 'empire' once stretched from Britain to modern day Iran or India, however it never possessed the strict hierarchies of later empires, not did the Celtic religion believe in writing things down, hence - no stories or literature. The vikings, on the other hand, were not Celtic - they possessed a different religion and genetic background (originating more from modern russia and outside of the Indo-European language pattern). So, the Normans cannot be classified as Celtic, nor can many of the modern areas of modern britain, including parts of scotland, because so much interbreeding occurred between celt and viking. Regardless, to say that the English are not celtic would be incorrect.

 

[mrtn]

This really is the wrong thread for that, but

The vikings, on the other hand, were not Celtic - they possessed a different religion and genetic background (originating more from modern russia and outside of the Indo-European language pattern).

is not correct. At all. Except for the fact that they weren't Celtic.

zxe, you can start a thread in the history forum or something, but prepare to post some evidence for your outlandish claims.

 

[Greenlocke]

I apologize for this whole celtic tangent - it is not what we are doing here.

Anyone else who wishes to discuss this, please pm me, rather than respond within the forum. I don't want to steal lotm forum space with this chatter.

Back on-topic. Lets figure out this pony archer thing with a vote and end the discussion. There have been several options mentioned:

1. No mounted unit for the hobbit civ.
2. A mounted (pony) unit with weak attack/defence but increased speed.
3. A pony-archer
4. A pony-chariot unit (although the poster 'pruned' this suggestion to limit 'off-topic silliness'.)
5. The final suggestion was utilizing the name 'Bullroarer' for one of these 4 units.

My vote is #2 and not named bullroarer. What does everyone else think.

 

[GRM7584]

It was not a genuine suggestion. It was not intended to be any more serious than recommending an armored hobbit lancer riding a hound...and that isn't a real suggestion either.
If I had input, I'd say do not call the pony rider a Bullroarer; call it Took Rider or Thain's Company or something.

 

[LAW_FREAK]

I liike zxe's idea.

 

[aaglo]

... and for some reason, I had always figgered the hats were sort of the "Robin Hood" style. Dunno what I was smoking for that idea, but anyway, that's what it was.

Well, I initially thought also about "robin-hood" style hats, but then I figured out that I don't want to make these little robbinhoodses. Besides, the robin-hood hat with a feather was so obvious, that I wanted to avoid it (i hope the brimmed hat is okay )

 

[The Capitalist]

I think it is a silly concept of having a midget on a pony charging units having horses or giant wolves.I think we should think of another alternative of a mounted unit for a hobbit civ.Maybe a certain mythological creature in a medieval fantasy out of Lord of the Ring realm?What is the harm of stepping out of the context of the story.

Numbers are the "properties of concepts" or useful logical fictions-rather like the fiction of "the average man."..........Mathematics is analytic or empty-Gottlob Frege