It must be the difficulty at which I play as I have NEVER had this event occur and I frequently have both religions in my city. Thanks for the feedback!!
[MOD] Fall from Heaven II
- Thread starter Kael
- Start date
Note to Kael... I reported this "bug" a while back (it's a little funny to get) and you told me that there were checks in place to insure that the city was within (I think!) one square of water. Well, I was offered by the Guild of Nine the opportunity to hire a pirate crew again. I accepted the offer and, once again, a privateer showed up in the city. This time around the city is even further from water (six squares!) and there is NO water (except possibly for a river) anywhere close.
You may want to check this out.
You may want to check this out.
Kael
Deity
Note to Kael... I reported this "bug" a while back (it's a little funny to get) and you told me that there were checks in place to insure that the city was within (I think!) one square of water. Well, I was offered by the Guild of Nine the opportunity to hire a pirate crew again. I accepted the offer and, once again, a privateer showed up in the city. This time around the city is even further from water (six squares!) and there is NO water (except possibly for a river) anywhere close.
You may want to check this out.
Oops, your absolutly right. There was a typo that was keeping it from working. I'll fix it int he next version. Thanks for keeping on it!
I don't know whether or not this is a problem but... The Guild of Hammers is supposed to place a forge in every city of the civilization that owns it (I believe!!). I have found this to be true even in new cities constructed after the Guild has been built. And yet... I decided that I wanted to try playing Basium (for the first time) so I picked the Kuriotates (heh!! they can only build four cities -- they could wait until Basium entered the world for any more... ). However, I built every wonder that I could in the city to construct the Mercurian Gate (at least those still available after I discovered that I could NOT build it in my capital -- which way my first preference). This included the Guild of Hammers.
Well -- none of my new cities has a forge and, according to the description of the Guild of Hammers, I think that they should -- right?
The other problem I discovered -- and I'm very confident that this is by design -- is that the Mercurians cannot build beast masters. I guess that puts them right on a part with the Luchirps, right?
Anyway, it's pretty cool having angels but I probably won't switch to Basium again. By the time he came into the world it every freakin' good spot was taken by that rotten Sabathiel who seems to own half the world (Lakes).
). However, I built every wonder that I could in the city to construct the Mercurian Gate (at least those still available after I discovered that I could NOT build it in my capital -- which way my first preference). This included the Guild of Hammers.Well -- none of my new cities has a forge and, according to the description of the Guild of Hammers, I think that they should -- right?
The other problem I discovered -- and I'm very confident that this is by design -- is that the Mercurians cannot build beast masters. I guess that puts them right on a part with the Luchirps, right?
Anyway, it's pretty cool having angels but I probably won't switch to Basium again. By the time he came into the world it every freakin' good spot was taken by that rotten Sabathiel who seems to own half the world (Lakes).
about no.5, I mean not the patches, but the information packages as warlord, beyond the sword. the same question, will I have to buy a new package if civ release it in order to play ffh2? I will be quite upset if the answer is yes.
MagisterCultuum
Great Sage
@ Omegon3: I was disappointed a while back to find that the free buildings only go to the civ that actually builds the free-building granting wonder (in my case it was the Catacomb Libralus). I believe they still get this bonus after losing the wonder too.
@tipwong: Ah, you mean expansions. If FfH moves to the expansion then you would need to buy the expansion, otherwise not. Kael chose not to move FfH to the Warlords Expansion, but then decided that moving to BtS was a good idea (he actually new about BtS back when Warlords was first releases, since he was asked to work on a scenario for it. He knew it would add far more to the game than the first expansion did, and didn't see much point in making everyone buy 2 expansion sets). He actually started over on the BtS version, so presumably the same would happen if there were another patch. Of course, I don't think there will be another. Version .23c is the last version for vanilla Civ IV, and all later versions (including the current .30, all future Shadow versions, and Ice) are for BtS.
@tipwong: Ah, you mean expansions. If FfH moves to the expansion then you would need to buy the expansion, otherwise not. Kael chose not to move FfH to the Warlords Expansion, but then decided that moving to BtS was a good idea (he actually new about BtS back when Warlords was first releases, since he was asked to work on a scenario for it. He knew it would add far more to the game than the first expansion did, and didn't see much point in making everyone buy 2 expansion sets). He actually started over on the BtS version, so presumably the same would happen if there were another patch. Of course, I don't think there will be another. Version .23c is the last version for vanilla Civ IV, and all later versions (including the current .30, all future Shadow versions, and Ice) are for BtS.
Do religious wonders work differently then? Last game (due to a shortage of mana to build the Tower of Mastery) I invaded the continent on which Rhoanna had her civ (Hippus -- turned out she was in my latest game also; certainly hoped she didn't have a long memory
). She had founded the Council of Esus (her national "religion") and built their religious wonder. AFTER I took her capital, all of a sudden I had shadow mana that I had never had before.
MagisterCultuum
Great Sage
I believe all the other bonuses of wonders (free resources, maintenance changes, crime changes, yields, trade, specialists, free promotions, free xp, etc) work once captured, but free buildings do not.
I have a question that the developers probably won't care for since it kind of goes around the overall scheme of the game... I'm currently playing Basium and I find that the handicap that he (and my partner) have is extremely limiting. First off, by the time he (Basium) entered the game, ALL the decent land (except for my capital) had been taken -- I've been forced into polar regions (playing Lakes) and upgrading the terrain with Archmages. Also, given that the cost of technologies doubles when you are playing "team", I have really fallen behind in the technology race (after all, Basium starts with one city -- with a settler to create a second -- and hardly contributes much to the cost of technology). I've pretty much destroyed Cardith Lorda's ability to progress and lost virtually all wonders since then.
OK... Here's my question: Is there a way to modify the "xml" or "ini" files to play the Mercurians and Infernals right from the start to give them an even chance to keep up with the other civilizations? I know this would pretty much do away with the Mercurian Gate and whatever brings Hyborem into the world, but I'd like to play one game with each from the start just to see how they play (I've already "cheated" and set several of their units to upgrade with only ONE level of experience just to see what they are like). I've looked at the "xml" and "ini" files and didn't see anything that jumped out at me to permit their selection (I don't think that the "playable" setting would do the job -- right?).
Anyway, if this doesn't offend the developers' pride in the game too much and this is possible, I'd really love the feedback. Alternatively, perhaps, there already might be a "mod" permitting this?
Thanks in advance for any feedback that you can provide.
OK... Here's my question: Is there a way to modify the "xml" or "ini" files to play the Mercurians and Infernals right from the start to give them an even chance to keep up with the other civilizations? I know this would pretty much do away with the Mercurian Gate and whatever brings Hyborem into the world, but I'd like to play one game with each from the start just to see how they play (I've already "cheated" and set several of their units to upgrade with only ONE level of experience just to see what they are like). I've looked at the "xml" and "ini" files and didn't see anything that jumped out at me to permit their selection (I don't think that the "playable" setting would do the job -- right?).
Anyway, if this doesn't offend the developers' pride in the game too much and this is possible, I'd really love the feedback. Alternatively, perhaps, there already might be a "mod" permitting this?
Thanks in advance for any feedback that you can provide.
MagisterCultuum
Great Sage
setting bPlayable to 1 would work.
Of course, starting the game as Hyborem would be a very bad idea, what with the fallow trait not letting your cities grow.
My modmod eliminates some team penalties (GPP at least, not sure about techs). I'm also thinking about making the Mercurians not in a permanent alliance with their summoners, but a vassalage agreement (with the human being the master whether he switches or not). If I figure out how to code this, I may make the Infernals work the same way with the first civ to research Infernal pact (that is what summons them)
Of course, starting the game as Hyborem would be a very bad idea, what with the fallow trait not letting your cities grow.
My modmod eliminates some team penalties (GPP at least, not sure about techs). I'm also thinking about making the Mercurians not in a permanent alliance with their summoners, but a vassalage agreement (with the human being the master whether he switches or not). If I figure out how to code this, I may make the Infernals work the same way with the first civ to research Infernal pact (that is what summons them)
MagisterCultuum, YOU ARE THE MAN!!!!! I'm going to try another game with Basium -- given that I just lost the one I was playing to Rhoanna (last in score, but somehow she won on culture) -- to see how he does. I'd like to see some of his neat units, but my slow progress in technology prevented me from seeing most of them (after "cheating" I did get a glimpse t valkyries and ophanims, but didn't see them in battle -- I was going to go to war with Rhoanna once I was sufficiently strong).
By the way... Will there be TWO Basiums in my game? Me and whomever builds the Mercurian Gate?
Also, when I look at CIV4CivilizationInfos, it certainly APPEARS as if the Mercurians should be able to build Beastmasters (at least they are listed under "Units"). What am I missing that they cannot build these units?
Thanks.
MagisterCultuum
Great Sage
I believe so. I did this once a while back (well, I made Sabathiel an alternate Mercurian leader back when bPlayable was for civs instead of leaders, and started as Sabathiel of the Mercurians only latter to switch to Basium of the Mercurians, just to test it out)
Also, both Mercurian civs will get an angel for each good unit that dies, not just one of you.
I also tried making the Mercurian Gate a National Wonder once, and summoned 6 Basiums (Basia?) that way, each leading a different Mercurian civ civ (all in one big permanent alliance). Since the Basium unit would use convert city on which ever city built the gate, I was able to build one over and over again. When I finally switched to a Basium, I used this spell to take over all the other Basiums' (Basiorum?) capital cities.
Also, both Mercurian civs will get an angel for each good unit that dies, not just one of you.
I also tried making the Mercurian Gate a National Wonder once, and summoned 6 Basiums (Basia?) that way, each leading a different Mercurian civ civ (all in one big permanent alliance). Since the Basium unit would use convert city on which ever city built the gate, I was able to build one over and over again. When I finally switched to a Basium, I used this spell to take over all the other Basiums' (Basiorum?) capital cities.
OK... I started the Basiums as a civilization only to find that the only unit I had was a settler. So... I edited the CIV4CivilizationInfos and modified the "FreeUnits" section. I added a warrior and a scout, then going a little further (cheating like h*ll) I also put in an angel and Basium (after losing the LAST game, I'm giving Basium the best chance possible).
Well... The only units that actually appeared at the start was Basium himself and a settler. No warrior, no scout, and no angel. I rechecked the CIV4CivilizationsInfo and everything appears OK -- all the named labels appear to be in the correct position.
Any idea of why the other three units may not have appeared?
Also, I'm still curious why -- even though they are listed for the Mercurians -- they cannot train Beastmasters.
Thanks again for all the help!!!
Well... The only units that actually appeared at the start was Basium himself and a settler. No warrior, no scout, and no angel. I rechecked the CIV4CivilizationsInfo and everything appears OK -- all the named labels appear to be in the correct position.
Any idea of why the other three units may not have appeared?
Also, I'm still curious why -- even though they are listed for the Mercurians -- they cannot train Beastmasters.
Thanks again for all the help!!!
MagisterCultuum
Great Sage
The Mercurians don't have most of the living units buildable (they have "NONE" as a "UU"), including scouts, warriors, and beastmasters. (If I recall, basically the only living units they can build are settlers, workers, adepts, and disciple units.) The game looks for the civ's UUs when it places units of a unitclass at the start of the game, and so finding none, it gives them none.
Angels have a cost of -1, which makes them unbuildable for anyone. This presumably stops them from being given out at the beginning too (but that can still be given in python). Oddly, Basium costs 100 hammers, even though he is given in python to the only civ that could build him when it first enters the game, and so cannot be built anyway (normally)
Angels have a cost of -1, which makes them unbuildable for anyone. This presumably stops them from being given out at the beginning too (but that can still be given in python). Oddly, Basium costs 100 hammers, even though he is given in python to the only civ that could build him when it first enters the game, and so cannot be built anyway (normally)
I thought that I was being smart and removed the "WARRIOR" and "SCOUT" from the "Units" (UU?) section and restarted the game. I still couldn't train these two units... Am I in the correct section (CIV4CivilizationsInfo)?
Thanks.
Never mind... I made the change, but I must NOT have actually saved it (a minor little detail). When I redid the change and restarted the game, I had a warrior and scout.... Anyway, my apologies for being a pain.
I have to ask... I noticed when playing Basium the first time that they COULD train champions and rangers. Does it make sense that they can train these later-game units, but not warriors and scouts?
MagisterCultuum
Great Sage
Spoiler :
I guess champions and rangers are just not among the units they are not allowed to build.
I guess that it's obvious given my questions and comments that I'm playing Basium and the Mercurians for the first time... However, I think (!) that I saw an inconsistency (along with those noted in earlier messages) in regard to their available units. I found, in playing the Mercurians for the first time (a game that I lost!), that I could train Shadows and also promote angels to Angels of Death -- both basically serving the same function. However, they did not have access to Beastmasters (Heralds being their substitute for Beastmasters -- at least once they get promoted sufficiently to Subdue Beasts). To be consistent, shouldn't they be blocked from Shadows also?
Note that I minded... Just gave me three more powerful units (not that they helped me win the game ).
Note that I minded... Just gave me three more powerful units (not that they helped me win the game
).
MagisterCultuum
Great Sage
They used to all be UUs, but were changed because Kael didn't think it appropriate for a living unit to upgrade to an angel (without dieing and coming back as an ordinary angel first)
I'm guessing that Shadows were changed at the same time as they became a religious unit.
I'm guessing that Shadows were changed at the same time as they became a religious unit.
