Modern Age mod preview

[MeteorPunch]

I started working on another mod, and I'd kinda like to get any kind of good ideas from people before things become finalized. First of all, it's set in the present, with all 31 civs slots used, and uses a 140x140 map. Victory conditions are Domination (25% land, 45% pop), Conquest, and Victory Point, which should be the main/easiest one. There might be a Space Race variant, but I'm not sure.

I'm obviously using tons of Wyrmshadow's units mainly, and currently there are about 200 total units. A lot of graphics and sound were carried over from my Aeon mod - less work to do.

Nations list with city count:

1. 5 Argentina
2. 12 Australia
3. 16 Brazil
4. 14 Canada
5. 22 China
6. 4 Egypt
7. 6 France
8. 4 Germany
9. 3 Greece
10. 10 India
11. 6 Iran
12. 1 Israel
13. 5 Italy
14. 8 Japan
15. 14 Mexico
16. 3 Morocco
17. 3 North Korea
18. 5 Norway
19. 2 Portugal
20. 36 Russia
21. 3 Saudi Arabia
22. 5 South Africa
23. 1 South Korea
24. 6 Spain
25. 4 Sweden
26. 1 Taiwan
27. 5 Turkey
28. 4 United Kingdom
29. 154 United Nations
30. 26 United States
31. 4 Venezuela

Some civs will be absolutely easier to win with, so ways of evening things for smaller nations are good.

I've never liked the sprawling "roads on every tile" thing the civ series has always done, so I limited where roads can be built. Terrain values are the same for every terrain...just easier to balance that way. Smaller civs get huge bonuses by resources that are placed directly under cities, which can give up to 25 shields and 25 commerce. In addition to that there are 3 levels of an "Industrial Zone" city improvement which increase production.

My biggest concern is that the thing won't be fun - it might not be. There are no techs to learn, only a few buildings to build, and you start with all units, not gaining anything new to upgrade to. If the mod covered, "Current to Future," or maybe, "1980's through 2010," then there would be a few techs and upgrades, but it would be mostly cosmetic changes because not enough has changed during that time which can be represented by the Civ 3 world/limitations.

One of the cool things is that I got to try the 20 culture groups technique. I used some medieval sets because they have a unique feel to them. This is something I'm totally not sure on, but I believe many European cities centers still have several buildings which are very old and stylish and would make this kind of appropriate. Still looking for a good India city graphic, by the way.

A few more game play problems I'm looking for fixes to:

• AI doesn't go to war very often. In Aeon they fought non-stop. I think it's because there are no strategic or luxury resources.

• Need interesting ways to implement Barbarians/"Terrorists." Some one had an idea, which I call the "al-Qa’ida Launcher" where you have a middle eastern UN city auto-producing hidden nationality "terrorist" units which could then be catapulted anywhere by infinite-range para drop. I tried this, but they didn't use them to attack, unlike Privateers. Maybe I was just unlucky though and should try again.

I didn't cover everything, but it's just a preview. Here's a bunch of pictures:

Spoiler :

Static Leaderheads (thanks for the guide Vuldacon!)

Some Infantry

Civpedia

World

Middle East

Europe

Europe with examples of production/commerce resources

Asia

Asia from an early test game

 

[The Omega]

Looks good.

How are the load/turn times? That tends to be a big problem in many global modern scenarios.

How does the UN civ play out? It looks like a bit of an odd choice, to be honest; having Africa as one big super nation that also controls most of Central Asia, as well as other places around the globe....

 

[Goldflash]

In the Real World South Korea is much larger and more populated than the North, yet you gave the north 3 cities and the south 1? Explain yourself.

 

[MeteorPunch]

How are the load/turn times? That tends to be a big problem in many global modern scenarios.

Right now the turn time are good I think. Starting a game takes 4 minutes, but in between turns is ~15 seconds and loading a game is ~20 seconds.

How does the UN civ play out? It looks like a bit of an odd choice, to be honest; having Africa as one big super nation that also controls most of Central Asia, as well as other places around the globe....

I wanted to use real nations rather than culture groups or zones, so the only way to do that was to lump all of the remainder cities together. Overall I want these cities to be easier to capture than a regular nation, but not to get rolled over completely, or the opposite, to be dauntingly powerful.

Most UN cities have no production bonuses, however there are 2 zones (East Europe and Middle East), and about 10-15 cities (Singapore, Lima, Amsterdam, etc) which have higher production. This stops the strong nations nearby from completely flattening them, while rewarding the capture of "prized cities" with higher production. The UN overall has weaker units as well.

In the Real World South Korea is much larger and more populated than the North, yet you gave the north 3 cities and the south 1? Explain yourself.

This is the kind of good feedback I need.

Yeah it bothered me too. I thought 2 cities for each of them would be cool, but just the way the map was, I didn't really push for it. So...I've added Busan to South Korea, and deleted Ch'ongjin from the North. An improvement has been made!

 

[Moff Jerjerrod]

My biggest concern is that the thing won't be fun - it might not be. There are no techs to learn, only a few buildings to build, and you start with all units, not gaining anything new to upgrade to. If the mod covered, "Current to Future," or maybe, "1980's through 2010," then there would be a few techs and upgrades, but it would be mostly cosmetic changes because not enough has changed during that time which can be represented by the Civ 3 world/limitations.

I think this concept regarding nothing to research or upgrade might actually be fun. If this scenario is set during modern times with a timescale per turn that does not allow for going too far into the future then this makes sense. Makes for a short brutal contest before games end.

 

[tom2050]

With nothing to research, you may have to severely limit commerce in order to avoid huge lump sums of gold piling up all over the place. (But with limited roads, I've seen you have done that ) Since everyone can set the research slider to 0%.

I would think it may be a bit odd not being able to research anything, just because we are all used to it, but it depends on how the scenario is setup. If the scenario is too long with nothing new to look forward to, it may lose the 'fun aspect'.

Perhaps you don't need official tech's... but you could have specific techs to certain types of improvements or something; and they could be specific for each civ to research.

If you are able to make some improvements that have lots of prereq's in order to build, it would give players something to do on the side.

Were you going to have the standard 540 turns?

 

[MeteorPunch]

With nothing to research, you may have to severely limit commerce in order to avoid huge lump sums of gold piling up all over the place. (But with limited roads, I've seen you have done that ) Since everyone can set the research slider to 0%.

In one of the first versions all tiles produced 1 commerce which lead to massive ridiculousness from the largest civs. Now tiles produce 0 commerce and smaller civs get commerce boosts to make things much more even.

I would think it may be a bit odd not being able to research anything, just because we are all used to it, but it depends on how the scenario is setup. If the scenario is too long with nothing new to look forward to, it may lose the 'fun aspect'.

Perhaps you don't need official tech's... but you could have specific techs to certain types of improvements or something; and they could be specific for each civ to research.

If you are able to make some improvements that have lots of prereq's in order to build, it would give players something to do on the side.

The most legit tech idea I can think of would be techs leading to and allowing "very soon to be in use units," such as the F-35. To do add this I'd have to create a new convoluted system of techs and upgrades for what would probably end up being 10 or so units, tops. Not really worth it.

Were you going to have the standard 540 turns?

Hoping for between 100-250 at the moment.

 

[matteo773]

If you're worried about technologies you could add the olympics/world cups as wonders that arrive every four years; possibly making the previous one obsolete.

There are also quite a few new units that are in the pipeline for most countries. Obviously it would be difficult to get the units as for obvious reasons they aren't available now.

You could also have some states improve their nuclear capability along the tech tree e.g. Iran, North Korea. Whilst also improving their delivery systems. North Korea's missiles seem a bit lacking in navigational abilities last I heard.

You could include the changing economics of certain countries, so China, Brazil and India may develop into superpowers whilst Europe and possibly America suffer.

Of course don't fill the tech tree for the sake of it or with stuff you don't like/want. It's your mod after all.

Oh and quick question. Twenty culture groups? Could someone kindly direct me somewhere I can find out more.

 

[tom2050]

Here was a short thread discussing the culture group topic.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=330336

 

[General 666]

Everything looks good so far.
... but why give you Spain and France 6 cities but Germany only 4 ,like Sweden or Egypt ???

... and 154 cities for the United Nations ?

I like that the map is rather small. But 31 civs on a 140x140 looks to much to me. I would take out a handful of Civs.
The screenies are awesome !

 

[MeteorPunch]

There are also quite a few new units that are in the pipeline for most countries. Obviously it would be difficult to get the units as for obvious reasons they aren't available now.

This is again, what I'd most like to put in, but won't because I don't think it's worth it for only a handful of units.

You could also have some states improve their nuclear capability along the tech tree e.g. Iran, North Korea. Whilst also improving their delivery systems. North Korea's missiles seem a bit lacking in navigational abilities last I heard.

Sadly I can't put nukes in. I've tested multiple ways, including hidden nationality, and every time I use a nuke, every single nation declares war on me.

You could include the changing economics of certain countries, so China, Brazil and India may develop into superpowers whilst Europe and possibly America suffer.

The economy and production are automated. Having someone upgrade means that they are starting lower than they should or someone else is starting higher. The game takes place over 5 years, max, so big changes won't happen.

I know this all sounds so...constricting, but I think it will be fun in other ways. Also Civ 5 comes out in 15 days, so it's not like anyone will be playing this anyway.

Everything looks good so far.
... but why give you Spain and France 6 cities but Germany only 4 ,like Sweden or Egypt ???

Sounds about right to me, based on land area. Spain may have lucked out though, due to having 2 nice island cities.

Here's another picture of the squished Germany in Europe. Despite Germany's size, I made them the highest production Civ of Europe.

This whole map thing is an inexact science, sometimes a Civ will gain or lose land based on a judgment call of the map designer or city placer. It's very much an approximation, like many things in Civ. I think the map maker (Kal-el) did an incredible job on this map, especially for it's size. There are 2 irrelevant problem areas that I might redo in the future, though.

... and 154 cities for the United Nations?

I don't know what's shocking about this?

Also think of them as segments: East Europe, Central Asia, Western South America. In addition to having weaker units, I am limiting their ability to move units rapidly from area to area.

I like that the map is rather small. But 31 civs on a 140x140 looks to much to me. I would take out a handful of Civs.

I actually wanted 40 nations...

The screenies are awesome !

Thanks, here are more:

Spoiler :

Added massive culture (which is retained on capture) to ~15 cities or so for a more filled out map.

I put a "Space Race" back in. Capture 10 of the toughest cities to win.

Sea Units. Nation-specific carriers, and a handful of others aside, they are going to be generic.

 

[Kyriakos]

Good luck with the scenario
So many bits and pieces of my gfx there (and many which i'd rather not see at all )

Also it is GREAT that Greece is in...

 

[The Omega]

I like the new space race! Seems like an interesting idea.

 

[MeteorPunch]

So many bits and pieces of my gfx there (and many which i'd rather not see at all )

Bits and pieces sounds about right...I like your cities, but I also like to hack things up.

I will probably redo France though.

 

[MeteorPunch]

Cool advisor screens:

Spoiler :

 

[tom2050]

Those are very cool advisor pics!

 

[Moff Jerjerrod]

Looking very good MeteorPunch! Can't wait to try this scenario out.

 

[MeteorPunch]

Given these classes of modern ships, which would you give the "see invisible" ability to detect submarines?

heli/jet carriers
destroyer
frigate
corvette
helicopters

I don't think it's realistic, but I was thinking about just giving the ability to ASW (anti-sub) helicopters and not to ships. That way, heli carriers would be more fun, useful, and true to their name.

Note: Subs will likely be have the highest attack vs ships, while having low defense and invisibility. This way if they "catch you" first, you're in trouble, but if you see and take them out, it's relatively easy. If every ship can see invisible, invisible is pointless.

 

[tom2050]

Are you going to make ASW helicopters naval units? Because I don't believe air units can use the see invisible trait IIRC (which is unfortunate, would have been great).

 

[MeteorPunch]

They are air units, and yes they can see invisible.