lemonjelly
Modding For Ethne
Yeah, he's been immortal for ages, Ceridwen granted him immortality back in the AoM.
Yeah, they are based off the Bannor code-wise, got the same graphics as well, I'll try to make a Hero for the next version
[MODULE] Patria
- Thread starter lemonjelly
- Start date
Yeah, they are based off the Bannor code-wise, got the same graphics as well, I'll try to make a Hero for the next version
isthmus
Warlord
For everyone's benefit, since this stuff tends to get lost deep down in the lore forums
The students..
As for an evil leader, i think the students all ended up being pretty evil, but I'd say gastrius or mikel dylantyr (fire was the most powerful and commonly used magic in patria at that time, right?) would fit well. That said if you wanted to include them as buildable units they'd be out of the question
Possibly have someone who 'resembles' the risen emperor? We don't know if he's actually ever been an emperor of patria but he might have been a strong mage with ambition at that time. Maybe death 'tames' his evil intentions as such.
The students..
Was kinda thinking that the students would be the heroes.
As for an evil leader, i think the students all ended up being pretty evil, but I'd say gastrius or mikel dylantyr (fire was the most powerful and commonly used magic in patria at that time, right?) would fit well. That said if you wanted to include them as buildable units they'd be out of the question
Possibly have someone who 'resembles' the risen emperor? We don't know if he's actually ever been an emperor of patria but he might have been a strong mage with ambition at that time. Maybe death 'tames' his evil intentions as such.
Valkrionn
The Hamster King
The Risen Emperor was not a patrian leader. Or mage. Or anything to do with patria.
If you read the "In a Bright Land" story, you see he was actually an angel of Esus, the Angel of Good Intentions. You also see that Korinna is Gyra's (archangel of Death, Basium's twin) daughter.
If you read the "In a Bright Land" story, you see he was actually an angel of Esus, the Angel of Good Intentions. You also see that Korinna is Gyra's (archangel of Death, Basium's twin) daughter.
isthmus
Warlord
The Risen Emperor was not a patrian leader. Or mage. Or anything to do with patria.
If you read the "In a Bright Land" story, you see he was actually an angel of Esus, the Angel of Good Intentions.
I heard that he was a liar about connections to being in power in patria, didn't realise he wasn't there at all.
Obviously havn't read the story.. do you have a link/is it in the pedia?
Valkrionn
The Hamster King
I heard that he was a liar about connections to being in power in patria, didn't realise he wasn't there at all.
Obviously havn't read the story.. do you have a link/is it in the pedia?
Forum link is here: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=335081
Otherwise, it's pretty much spread through the Scion's pedia. Starting with the Scion Civ page, I believe; Links to other chapters as well.
dunedainjedi
Warlord
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2009
- Messages
- 117
I got a few ideas for Lemonjelly. For a hero why not Kylorin? He's never been afraid to get his hands dirty. Plus he's an Immortal Archmage Emperor who the Gods call upon to clean up their messes. What more could we ask for?
Second, why not have four of Kylorin's students(one from each school) replace Archmages. They could be buildable(and start with the 3rd level spell sphere for their favorite school), or simply upgrade from a mage with the appropriate spells. This gives the Patrians some nice flavor as a civ(as opposed to just being the other Amurites) and, once fallen ages rolls around it prevents Kylorin's rebellion from getting all the archmages when Patria falls apart.
Second, why not have four of Kylorin's students(one from each school) replace Archmages. They could be buildable(and start with the 3rd level spell sphere for their favorite school), or simply upgrade from a mage with the appropriate spells. This gives the Patrians some nice flavor as a civ(as opposed to just being the other Amurites) and, once fallen ages rolls around it prevents Kylorin's rebellion from getting all the archmages when Patria falls apart.
lemonjelly
Modding For Ethne
I like the second idea, but when people thing Patria, they think Kylorin, I want to add more to them, they were meant to be the greatest civilization ever
well, the "greatest civilization ever" all have a tendency to crumble (see the romans, the egyptians, the mesopotamians, the Han, USSR...etc) and end with having "clay feet". Either it comes from decadency or from exteriors threats, generaly a combination of both.
In the end, even Patria crumbled...
In the end, even Patria crumbled...
Torugu
Prince
- Joined
- Dec 14, 2009
- Messages
- 382
Putting Glasnost and Perestroika on the same level as falling fire gods and evil gods of winter seems like a bit of stretch though.
Another idea to reflect a very advanced civ trying to survive a sudden fall from grace is to make their starting techs a handful of really LATE game techs and no starting techs. For example, they might start with Mithril Working, Sorcery and a node-building tech of some kind but not even be able to build farms or hunt animals.
Essentially, they know the great secrets of the universe and not how to dig in the mud. They COULD immediately start trying to build uber units but with no infrastructure it'd take them 92 million turns to produce it.
Essentially, they know the great secrets of the universe and not how to dig in the mud. They COULD immediately start trying to build uber units but with no infrastructure it'd take them 92 million turns to produce it.
lemonjelly
Modding For Ethne
Yeah, true, but they were the greatest civilization ever according to the lore
Putting Glasnost and Perestroika on the same level as falling fire gods and evil gods of winter seems like a bit of stretch though.
I think that would just smash the AI into teeny teeny pieces
hahahaPutting Glasnost and Perestroika on the same level as falling fire gods and evil gods of winter seems like a bit of stretch though.
I know I know... But I think that ultimately they would have fallen, maybe way later but still.
well, for smashing the AI : if they know how to make mages and how to find mithril... they still can't use mithril weapons until another tech. And they'll still need to tech KotE to make adepts and level them to lvl4 before having mages.
On the other hand the AI might be lost in tech priorities : research agriculture or the tech that comes after sorcery ???
lemonjelly
Modding For Ethne
lemonjelly
Modding For Ethne
Thanks, had help from Opera and Jheral choosing them, have you played?
I don't know about the traits.
In my internal version, her unique spell has been improved, but Kylorin's untouched.
MagisterCultuum
Great Sage
Technically, Kylorin was not given immortality but was made to stop aging. At least, that is what Kael said, but in the game (AoI pedia and the godslayer event) it seems more like he is an immortal who has aged considerably although slowly. Personally I'd rather him still appear to be in his mid 40s, with only a few streaks of grey hair at his temples instead of long silver locks. there is no need to change the leaderhead though, as it is closer to how he is most recently described in the game.
Trenton Majosi was not evil. He may well have been the most noble hero of the age. I'd probably still say neutral rather than good though.
Fire was certainly not the most common magic in Patra. Rather, it was the most difficult sphere for mages to command. During that Age Bhall kept her precept firmly under her control and was a dedicated champion for good, so flames had a tendency to turn against any wicked man who tried to wield them. I wouldn't be surprised if at one point Kylorin made the use of flame a capital offense. Divine fire magic was widespread towards the end of the age and was quite powerful, but its main advantage was that few mages had the dispositions and discipline to learn to control it. Many mages instead turned to worshiping Danalin, in hopes that he would protect them from Bhall despite their wickedness. (The God of Water was by no means evil and would not protect the most wicked of them, but he was lenient enough that some not so nice magicians who avoided the more extreme vices might still get a modicum of protection.)
I would not be surprised if Mikel Dylantyr was one of the few students who sided with Kylorin in the rebellion. Of course, as he would have likely been trained to be evil earlier he probably always bore some serious burn scars from loosing control when he first tried to use flames for ill. It would not surprise me if he personally trained or was even the father of Menolly NuValle, the Queen and most powerful Archmage of the Bannor before the fall. It would also not surprise me if Mikel was among the friends of Kylorin whom Perpentach dominated and forced his old master to kill.
(I could see Carnivean joining him too, not because he agreed with him or was good or anything, but just because making the sides more even allows for greater carnage. Watching an empire burn to the ground is fun, but he would of course switch sides again by the time Good started to win.)
We don't know a lot about Gastrius, except that he was a student whom Kylorin killed for crimes far less serious than those committed by Perpentach, and that a copy of his mind lives on in The Momus as one of his greatest advisers. We can presume that as the master of Metamagic he may have been the most knowledgeable man who ever lived. Personally I've long (and with no real basis) liked to think that he was processed into the Demon lord Judecca, but I just thought of another (possibly cooler) possibility: Kylorin might not have actually killed him at all. It seems probable that he learned how to use the same sort of metamagic abilities as Gowlers do. It could be that all memories of his demise were fabrications planted to facilitate his escape. It could even be that the character of Gastrius never existed, but was a complete fabrication meant to distract those who had once known of the real master of metamagic. The one issue with this is an old pedia entry in which Agares spoke of his death, but he also spoke of Laroth's death and it has since been revealed that Laroth actually departed to the land of the dead while alive. Alternately, he may have allowed his physical form to be slain once he learned how to make his spirit dwell freely in men's memories. It could be that Perpentach's adviser is not merely a copy of a previously dominated Gastrius trapped in that one mind, but the real archmage who can now wander freely through the word of the memories of all mankind, bending the world of the percieved past as well as Laroth bends the dreams of the dead. Gatrius leaves open the possibility that all our lore comes from very unreliable narrators, and that we can blame Gastrius for any inconsistencies or mistakes Kael or I make.
Personally I tend to think that the only real ruler of Patria besides Kylorin should be Perpentach (who seems to have been not only a student but an adopted son and heir apparent), but he is already taken by the Baleraphs and is considerably different than he was in the previous age, when the voices in his head was blocked and he just had autism instead of multiple personality disorder.
I would suggest that the Patrian Capital be named Amur, to explain why the Patrians were canonically originally called the Amurites before Kael decided that was too confusing. Personally I blame Gatrius for this redaction, and still think that we should at least refer to those Kylorin led before uniting humanity into one kingdom as the Amurites.
I don't think Tali has priestesses, an organized religion, or clergy of any kind. He is a chaotic and egalitarian deity, and those who revere him have lack the patience for any hierarchy. he has no temples, only shrines in remote and hard to reach places. The only sacrifices he wants is for people to entertain him through crazy daredevil feats and adventures.
The picture is nice, but I think she would make a better priestess of Ceridwen than Tali. Ceridwen's faith would have been the state religion for most of the history of Patria, although it was never popular except among the highest classes.
For everyone's benefit, since this stuff tends to get lost deep down in the lore forums
The students..
Was kinda thinking that the students would be the heroes.
As for an evil leader, i think the students all ended up being pretty evil, but I'd say gastrius or mikel dylantyr (fire was the most powerful and commonly used magic in patria at that time, right?) would fit well. That said if you wanted to include them as buildable units they'd be out of the question
Possibly have someone who 'resembles' the risen emperor? We don't know if he's actually ever been an emperor of patria but he might have been a strong mage with ambition at that time. Maybe death 'tames' his evil intentions as such.
Trenton Majosi was not evil. He may well have been the most noble hero of the age. I'd probably still say neutral rather than good though.
Fire was certainly not the most common magic in Patra. Rather, it was the most difficult sphere for mages to command. During that Age Bhall kept her precept firmly under her control and was a dedicated champion for good, so flames had a tendency to turn against any wicked man who tried to wield them. I wouldn't be surprised if at one point Kylorin made the use of flame a capital offense. Divine fire magic was widespread towards the end of the age and was quite powerful, but its main advantage was that few mages had the dispositions and discipline to learn to control it. Many mages instead turned to worshiping Danalin, in hopes that he would protect them from Bhall despite their wickedness. (The God of Water was by no means evil and would not protect the most wicked of them, but he was lenient enough that some not so nice magicians who avoided the more extreme vices might still get a modicum of protection.)
I would not be surprised if Mikel Dylantyr was one of the few students who sided with Kylorin in the rebellion. Of course, as he would have likely been trained to be evil earlier he probably always bore some serious burn scars from loosing control when he first tried to use flames for ill. It would not surprise me if he personally trained or was even the father of Menolly NuValle, the Queen and most powerful Archmage of the Bannor before the fall. It would also not surprise me if Mikel was among the friends of Kylorin whom Perpentach dominated and forced his old master to kill.
(I could see Carnivean joining him too, not because he agreed with him or was good or anything, but just because making the sides more even allows for greater carnage. Watching an empire burn to the ground is fun, but he would of course switch sides again by the time Good started to win.)
We don't know a lot about Gastrius, except that he was a student whom Kylorin killed for crimes far less serious than those committed by Perpentach, and that a copy of his mind lives on in The Momus as one of his greatest advisers. We can presume that as the master of Metamagic he may have been the most knowledgeable man who ever lived. Personally I've long (and with no real basis) liked to think that he was processed into the Demon lord Judecca, but I just thought of another (possibly cooler) possibility: Kylorin might not have actually killed him at all. It seems probable that he learned how to use the same sort of metamagic abilities as Gowlers do. It could be that all memories of his demise were fabrications planted to facilitate his escape. It could even be that the character of Gastrius never existed, but was a complete fabrication meant to distract those who had once known of the real master of metamagic. The one issue with this is an old pedia entry in which Agares spoke of his death, but he also spoke of Laroth's death and it has since been revealed that Laroth actually departed to the land of the dead while alive. Alternately, he may have allowed his physical form to be slain once he learned how to make his spirit dwell freely in men's memories. It could be that Perpentach's adviser is not merely a copy of a previously dominated Gastrius trapped in that one mind, but the real archmage who can now wander freely through the word of the memories of all mankind, bending the world of the percieved past as well as Laroth bends the dreams of the dead. Gatrius leaves open the possibility that all our lore comes from very unreliable narrators, and that we can blame Gastrius for any inconsistencies or mistakes Kael or I make.
Spoiler Bestiary of Erebus :
Personally I tend to think that the only real ruler of Patria besides Kylorin should be Perpentach (who seems to have been not only a student but an adopted son and heir apparent), but he is already taken by the Baleraphs and is considerably different than he was in the previous age, when the voices in his head was blocked and he just had autism instead of multiple personality disorder.
I would suggest that the Patrian Capital be named Amur, to explain why the Patrians were canonically originally called the Amurites before Kael decided that was too confusing. Personally I blame Gatrius for this redaction, and still think that we should at least refer to those Kylorin led before uniting humanity into one kingdom as the Amurites.
I made her up, she's a Priestess of Tali
I don't think Tali has priestesses, an organized religion, or clergy of any kind. He is a chaotic and egalitarian deity, and those who revere him have lack the patience for any hierarchy. he has no temples, only shrines in remote and hard to reach places. The only sacrifices he wants is for people to entertain him through crazy daredevil feats and adventures.
The picture is nice, but I think she would make a better priestess of Ceridwen than Tali. Ceridwen's faith would have been the state religion for most of the history of Patria, although it was never popular except among the highest classes.
Jheral
Prince
- Joined
- Apr 29, 2009
- Messages
- 502
No heirarcial structures and no organized priesthoods doesn't mean that there wouldn't be people who choose who devote their life to their worship, though. Just felt I should point that out.
lemonjelly
Modding For Ethne
Yeah, but in the lore he's described as old, I didn't know about the other part of the lore.
Yeah, he's neutral, probably took after his God in that respect.
I plan on making the Bannor with this theme, and Holy Fire and stuff, not sure about a module or actually part of Fallen Ages core yet.
A list of the students that joined Kylorin, rebelled and kept out would be ever so useful
Cool idea, I'll use that next time I slip up
I needed another leader, and not knowing a lot about the lore, I just made one up, but I agree, Kylorin is the only real leader of Patria.
Once again, lack of lore knowledge. I used a RNG to make the names.
True, and, yeah would fit better, would Ceridwen help somebody defeat the Patrian rebel students though? Or I'd have to change the lore a lot, which would be a pain, but doable.
