DBear
unbeliever
Has ANYONE had ANY game where the Darloks amounted to ANYTHING? I have never seen the Darloks become powerful in all my games, and that's a lot.
MoO1 and the Darloks
- Thread starter DBear
- Start date
The Darloks are not set up to be really strong competitors. The spying thing they have going is at best something to help come from behind. Plus, their default AI settings don't lend themselves well to rapid expansion.
It's theoretically possible that the Darloks could get a good starting location and happen to not be playing with their usual diplomatic mindset, but be running as industrialists or something, while the other nearby races are running governments that are not much interested in early expansion or are blocked off by large gaps or dead stars. In that case, the Darloks might expand enough to pose a significant threat. Any race can potentially become a runaway winner due to sheer luck -- it's just that the Darloks are substantially less likely to realize this potential because their typical governing style and their racial abilities don't lend themselves to it well.
It's theoretically possible that the Darloks could get a good starting location and happen to not be playing with their usual diplomatic mindset, but be running as industrialists or something, while the other nearby races are running governments that are not much interested in early expansion or are blocked off by large gaps or dead stars. In that case, the Darloks might expand enough to pose a significant threat. Any race can potentially become a runaway winner due to sheer luck -- it's just that the Darloks are substantially less likely to realize this potential because their typical governing style and their racial abilities don't lend themselves to it well.
DBear said:Has ANYONE had ANY game where the Darloks amounted to ANYTHING? I have never seen the Darloks become powerful in all my games, and that's a lot.
Species whcih are hard for human to play are even harder for copmuter, so that is why you never find Darloks as a strong species. But, that doesn't mean that they are weak at all. They are one of the best if you play them well. Just imagine that you can easily get all those nice techs much easier and faster just in few turns. You also could detroy mmany missle base much easier and ruien the economy of you opponent just with subbotage. Its strenght makes Darloks the most hated species in the game.
But I think if you play impossible then you have a good chance to find a strong darlok. Well darlok sometimes attack you in tricky way. You have a message, "silicoied destroied 100 of your factories" but it is you allience? What does it mean? Thats is the point of having strong darlok. You have be very good in computer to find out that all those spys belong to darlok.
Liquidated
Goofed Up on Cough Syrup!
I love playing darloks on impossible. in medium size galaxies I can win most of the time but smalls REALLY have it out for me in that no one likes you at start and you meet your buddies very quickly!
think one of the hardest combos really has to be darloks small impossible but if you can live long enough to snag 3 or 4 solid planets and hold them into mature computer techs... you will run away with the game for sure.
just no one, other than the psilons left unattacked, can keep up with a pissed off darlok spy-wise.
defintiely one of my favorite races to play.
Cheers!
-Liq
think one of the hardest combos really has to be darloks small impossible but if you can live long enough to snag 3 or 4 solid planets and hold them into mature computer techs... you will run away with the game for sure.
just no one, other than the psilons left unattacked, can keep up with a pissed off darlok spy-wise.
defintiely one of my favorite races to play.
Cheers!
-Liq
BasketCase
Username sez it all
I only played the Darloks once in my entire MOO1 career.
It was a large map, and for most of the game I never held more than four stars. Then I destroyed the Guardian, and with the technology thus acquired, wiped everybody else out.
It was a large map, and for most of the game I never held more than four stars. Then I destroyed the Guardian, and with the technology thus acquired, wiped everybody else out.
neutrino
Warlord
i think the Darlocks are more interesting as a human player (HP). much less so as a computer player (CP).
to get the most out of the Darlocks, they need to exploit their espionage bonus and get busy w/ diplomacy. HP can do that, but rather iffy by CP.
in some ways, as a HP, the Darlocks are like the Psilons: both start weak, as they cannot become powerful until they develop their economies. HP can manage weak-starting races much better than CP.
while the Darlocks are rather boring as CP, the Klackons are another matter. CP generally handles brute-force races like the Klackons better as going for quantity is something CP can handle better.
to get the most out of the Darlocks, they need to exploit their espionage bonus and get busy w/ diplomacy. HP can do that, but rather iffy by CP.
in some ways, as a HP, the Darlocks are like the Psilons: both start weak, as they cannot become powerful until they develop their economies. HP can manage weak-starting races much better than CP.
while the Darlocks are rather boring as CP, the Klackons are another matter. CP generally handles brute-force races like the Klackons better as going for quantity is something CP can handle better.
I have had the Darloks become the dominant race in one of my games (I am one of the few). Once they reach a dominant position they can be truly scary, destroying up to 10 missile bases or over 100 factories per turn, framing their opponents in council votes, having every tech any other race has, and being utterly impossible to get techs from. Had I not had the Meklar and a decent number of worlds I would not had stood a chance in the game. Likewise if they could have chosen better targets for their sabotage I could have easily lost. As it was, I had to do a mass invasion of one of the other races to get enough techs to be able to capture a Darlok world to catch up enough in techs to compete.
It was a fun game, but I will never wish for a powerful Darlok opponent again.
StuporMan
It was a fun game, but I will never wish for a powerful Darlok opponent again.
StuporMan
neutrino
Warlord
in those games i have played in the past w/ the Darlocks as one of the CPs, there were not that many cases in which the Darlocks became powerful. i think the placement of the Darlocks' home world plays a big part: if they can start towards one of the four corners and no other races are close by, then they have a much better chance. in addition, their chance of survival and growth are better, if they do not have to worry about expansionist races like the Klackons and the Silicoids.
hmmm ... maybe i should start a game, then change the CP races so that the Darlocks only have to face: Psilons (i usually play this one), Humans, Alkari, Bulrathi, Sakkra, and Mecklar. then use an editor to give the Darlocks a bit of lead in Computer Tech. see what happens ......
hmmm ... maybe i should start a game, then change the CP races so that the Darlocks only have to face: Psilons (i usually play this one), Humans, Alkari, Bulrathi, Sakkra, and Mecklar. then use an editor to give the Darlocks a bit of lead in Computer Tech. see what happens ......
I actually had a game on 'hard' as the Klackons with a dominant Darlok empire. Their spying was really getting to me, and they were turning everyone against me, until finally I lost the vote.
Out of sheer stubbornness, I opted for a final war, and eventually won -- not least because all those techs that the Darloks were keeping safe from me (due to their counter-spying bonus) were now suddenly shared with all the other races (much easier targets), meaning I was quickly able to turn my tech list into a superset of theirs. A few rich-world surgical strikes later, I was in a dominating position, and proceeded to eventually kill everyone and win.
Far as I can tell, it's only pure luck that makes them ever get big. They were the first to get all the GNN expansion reports, and once they had a strong empire, they were really able to hold their tech lead and turn the galaxy against me a lot easier than any other race.
Out of sheer stubbornness, I opted for a final war, and eventually won -- not least because all those techs that the Darloks were keeping safe from me (due to their counter-spying bonus) were now suddenly shared with all the other races (much easier targets), meaning I was quickly able to turn my tech list into a superset of theirs. A few rich-world surgical strikes later, I was in a dominating position, and proceeded to eventually kill everyone and win.
Far as I can tell, it's only pure luck that makes them ever get big. They were the first to get all the GNN expansion reports, and once they had a strong empire, they were really able to hold their tech lead and turn the galaxy against me a lot easier than any other race.
Sullla
Patrician Roman Dictator
Any race can become powerful in Master of Orion, although some are much more likely than others to do so. My very first Impossible game saw the Darloks are the dominant AI power, athough they were still inferior to my own Klackons, who drew a great start and expanded like mad. I drew a runaway superpower Darlok Empire in a different game:
But fortunately, I had a nice amount of worlds myself, and won without too much difficulty. This isn't exactly a message you want to see, of course!
The AI definitely doesn't play the Darloks as well as a human can, and their poor diplomacy often causes them to be stunted and bullied by the other races. But it has not been my experience that they "never amount to ANYTHING."
But fortunately, I had a nice amount of worlds myself, and won without too much difficulty. This isn't exactly a message you want to see, of course!
The AI definitely doesn't play the Darloks as well as a human can, and their poor diplomacy often causes them to be stunted and bullied by the other races. But it has not been my experience that they "never amount to ANYTHING."
neutrino
Warlord
In a couple of games I have played recently, the Darlocks (as a CP) happened to be #2 or #1 race insofar as overall power was concerned. Some reasons as to why:
1. The Darlocks had good starting location. They did not have to deal with other races until towards the mid-game.
2. The Darlocks were technologists or ecologists (+ diplomatic or expansionist).
3. The Darlocks did not have to face the Silicoids, the Meklars, the Klackons, and the Sakkras all at once. (Only one or two of them were in these games.)
4. During the opening portion of the games, the Darlocks found some nice rich/ultra-rich and artifact planets, boosting their technology and production.
5. The Darlocks had the time and space to build-up. Once they possessed strong economy, they could take advantage of their strengths most effectively. (Espionage/Sabotage and large combat fleets, though not as huge as that of the Klackons.)
1. The Darlocks had good starting location. They did not have to deal with other races until towards the mid-game.
2. The Darlocks were technologists or ecologists (+ diplomatic or expansionist).
3. The Darlocks did not have to face the Silicoids, the Meklars, the Klackons, and the Sakkras all at once. (Only one or two of them were in these games.)
4. During the opening portion of the games, the Darlocks found some nice rich/ultra-rich and artifact planets, boosting their technology and production.
5. The Darlocks had the time and space to build-up. Once they possessed strong economy, they could take advantage of their strengths most effectively. (Espionage/Sabotage and large combat fleets, though not as huge as that of the Klackons.)
neutrino
Warlord
Yeah ... in some ways, the Darlocks need to be played like the Psilons: both of them take time to develop their 'core' region and neither one of them have much in terms of combat (i.e., the Mrrshans, the Alkaris, the Bulrathis) or economic bonus (i.e., the Klackons, the Meklars).
On the other hand, I think the Darlocks can be more difficult to play than the Psilons. As a CP, xenophobic Darlocks are inferior to non-xenophobic ones. In spite of the Darlocks' negative diplomatic bias inherent in the game, they should get involved in diplomacy almost as much as the Humans. Industrialist, technologist, or ecologist traits should also be good for the Darlocks.
On the other hand, I think the Darlocks can be more difficult to play than the Psilons. As a CP, xenophobic Darlocks are inferior to non-xenophobic ones. In spite of the Darlocks' negative diplomatic bias inherent in the game, they should get involved in diplomacy almost as much as the Humans. Industrialist, technologist, or ecologist traits should also be good for the Darlocks.
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