Most useless wonder
- Thread starter Spoonwood
- Start date
Lord Emsworth
Emperor
Oracle,
Sistine Chapel,
Universal Suffrage,
Manhattan Project.
Sistine Chapel,
Universal Suffrage,
Manhattan Project.
TheOverseer714
Overseer
Depends on who builds it and why. Manhattan Project does suck the most, since it gives no benefit except 2 cpt and the ability to build nukes. Most other 2 culture wonders at least give some benefit even if captured. So my list would be:
4. Universal Suffrage
3. Great Wall (a real pain the butt if built by a tribe with a 3 def. AA unit., I almost never build it due to many factors)
2. Theory of Evolution (if someone else builds it, that is)
1. Manhattan Project- Even in a 20k game, this wonder comes at or about the same time as the UN , the Internet, and SETI, so it definitely gets back-burnered.
4. Universal Suffrage
3. Great Wall (a real pain the butt if built by a tribe with a 3 def. AA unit., I almost never build it due to many factors)
2. Theory of Evolution (if someone else builds it, that is)
1. Manhattan Project- Even in a 20k game, this wonder comes at or about the same time as the UN , the Internet, and SETI, so it definitely gets back-burnered.
Elear,
Have you actually built the Manhattan Project in a 20k game? I can't say I remember doing such. Oftentimes, I barely make it to the modern ages in a 20k game, if at all. And it gives you what 2 culture per turn for 800 shields? Granted it's something, but I can't see it as all too useful in a 20k game of any sort. I say that if your research outstrips your culture and you easily make it the modern ages build Longevity and Cure for Cancer instead (or first). I agree the other ones you mentioned sound pretty good for a 20k game.
Have you actually built the Manhattan Project in a 20k game? I can't say I remember doing such. Oftentimes, I barely make it to the modern ages in a 20k game, if at all. And it gives you what 2 culture per turn for 800 shields? Granted it's something, but I can't see it as all too useful in a 20k game of any sort. I say that if your research outstrips your culture and you easily make it the modern ages build Longevity and Cure for Cancer instead (or first). I agree the other ones you mentioned sound pretty good for a 20k game.
capnvonbaron
Democratia gladii
With the exception of 20Ks:
1. Oracle
2. Sistine
3. Shake's (even more useless in vanilla)
4. All modern age wonders except SETI (and even SETI is still a bit weak)
Honorable mention: Intel agency (considering vanilla)
1. Oracle
2. Sistine
3. Shake's (even more useless in vanilla)
4. All modern age wonders except SETI (and even SETI is still a bit weak)
Honorable mention: Intel agency (considering vanilla)
Darn, no matter what I say you catch me on something.
You're right, I wouldn't build the Manhattan Project in a 20k game unless I was within a few turns of winning and got a freak SGL that would improve my date by 2 turns. I was more referring to the other wonders. For example, referencing our discussion on the MoM, though I reference it as "useless" here, I would quickly build it in 20k games. I was acknowledging that the value of wonders do indeed change based on victory conditions.Lord Katana
Warlord
- Joined
- Jan 22, 2009
- Messages
- 178
Maybe a bit off topic.... but why do a lot of you say that Uni Suffrage is a bad Wonder?
Less WW in Republic or Demo means less on the happiness slider which means more gold right???
Anything i'm missing (or did Uni Suffrage change alot in C3C?)
thz.
On topic...
All ancient times wonders with the exception of the Pyramids. (got two games in which i got a SGL on discovery of Philo/mapmaking and couldnt resist building the Pyramids then
Less WW in Republic or Demo means less on the happiness slider which means more gold right???
Anything i'm missing (or did Uni Suffrage change alot in C3C?)
thz.
On topic...
All ancient times wonders with the exception of the Pyramids. (got two games in which i got a SGL on discovery of Philo/mapmaking and couldnt resist building the Pyramids then
I think there a few reasons.
First, it's a relatively expensive wonder at 800 shields. It's a bit better if you've installed factories, but still takes awhile. There are many important things to build in the Industrial era and I don't think this is one of them.
Second, I don't think most of the people who regularly posted in this thread use a Democratic government; instead, they stay in Monarchy or Republic. With the latter, it only takes a few luxuries and marketplaces to keep everyone happy for the majority of the game. During war-time, usually by inducing the other civilization to start wars, the consequent war happiness will last for enough time for you to fight.
First, it's a relatively expensive wonder at 800 shields. It's a bit better if you've installed factories, but still takes awhile. There are many important things to build in the Industrial era and I don't think this is one of them.
Second, I don't think most of the people who regularly posted in this thread use a Democratic government; instead, they stay in Monarchy or Republic. With the latter, it only takes a few luxuries and marketplaces to keep everyone happy for the majority of the game. During war-time, usually by inducing the other civilization to start wars, the consequent war happiness will last for enough time for you to fight.
Lord Emsworth
Emperor
The US only works if you have War Weariness, and even if you have WW it isn't mitigated by much. Just compare Universal Suffrage with JS Bach's and you know why the former is useless.
I. Larkin
Deity
- Joined
- Feb 21, 2003
- Messages
- 4,417
Normally I do not build any Wonder, but some of them is good to capture. ToE in this case absolutly useless. Fot hte rest things, of cource depend on difficulty level. Greate Lib useless at Monarch and below, but like "a must" at Sid. Probably Manhattan the worst, but nuke all may be a fan. Next are Siniste, Oracle, Mavsoleus, GW.
Schalke 04
Knappe
I really like the Internet for two reasons:
1. increases your empire's cpt remarkably
2. good boost for research
However, most games are decided at that time. For 100k or Space Race it can be a wonderful acceleration for your victory time.
capnvonbaron
Democratia gladii
maybe so. I'm referring to vanilla though, so no internets. Sorry, Al Gore.
Wonders in Vanilla are (more?) boring. Except for being able to rush with MGLs. I like that.
capnvonbaron
Democratia gladii
lol... not sure when or if shaka ever conquered anything in vanilla
True though... Wonders in vanilla seem particularly useless. I'm very much in the "let your neighbors build them for you" camp.
