Moving from Civ3 to Civ4

[iggymnrr]

I will look into bts soon, i was going to wait till thanksgiving/xmas and get myself a copy of civ5 but i doubt my pc will be able to run it, and i still have plenty of fun left with civ4 so i will look into bts soon enough. as for the HOF mod, i looked at the link but for now i will stick to vanilla as i dont particularly like playing with those unless its for a scenario like ancient greece or the civil war and you need cannon/catapults to do what theyre supposed to.

BTS is probably the best edition. But it may be easier to migrate from civ 3 straight to civ 5. I still play all 3 versions.

 

[lymond]

I will look into bts soon, i was going to wait till thanksgiving/xmas and get myself a copy of civ5 but i doubt my pc will be able to run it, and i still have plenty of fun left with civ4 so i will look into bts soon enough. as for the HOF mod, i looked at the link but for now i will stick to vanilla as i dont particularly like playing with those unless its for a scenario like ancient greece or the civil war and you need cannon/catapults to do what theyre supposed to.

If you are having fun with vanilla Civ IV, imagine the fun you will have with BTS. It really changes the game significantly...for the better. Civ 5 was a HUGE disappointment for many many staunch Civ fans. Be warned.

Not sure of your hesitance to use the HOF mod with vanilla. It does not change gameplay. It's primary purpose is for the Hall of Fame team and GOTM team to ensure player don't cheat when playing those game. However, it does add some nice UI features that will improve your game play. With BTS, you have the fabulous BUG mod that adds tons of new UI/info features without changing gameplay. It's really a must have and can installed such that it loads with every game. BUFFY (BTS HOF Mod) is built off of it. Also, you can create a shortcut that loads the HOF mod directly.

i would rather just post the saves, not because i cant use photobucket but because i dont know exactly when to take s/s's unles you have some info on that. I will post a starting pic of my next game. One of the other issues with all this advice is that the scenario changes every time, last night i played one where I was on a continent alone, after i cleared out all the barbs, i skipped religious stuff, grabbed bw and mc, and then just clicked optics, found the other 2-3 civs i forget how many were left, and i was the first to circunavigate the globe first time.

The starting pic is always good at the beginning, mainly to entice folks to help you. Then they will open your saves. Later you can post pics of your empire, capital city, tech screen and diplo screen. The save is the most important thing though.

As to your second point, that is the nature of the game. You will often here that everything is "situational" with this game based primarily on maps and land. "Play the Map" is a constant expression you will here. However, there are some basics the apply to most every situation.

Isolated/semi-isolated starts are quite unique and require some different approaches.

, i would appreciate a rule of thumb on the specialists thing... I dont want to seem like an idiot but i really dont get it... plus, every time i plan on making one city a gp farm, i only end up with 1-2 specialists there, and w/o pacifism or philosp leader it just seems pointless to try, in those cases, i tend to put a engineer in on city with extra food from forge, and and a scientists in the other, i figure that nets me like 3-5 GPS per game, a scientists or two fro the academy and a bulb, and 2 engineers for whatever i need. I think my favorite wonder is hanging gardens in some games, and perhaps notre dame in others depending on the situation, i also like oxford but i tend to forget about it usually

GHP makes a good point above about vanilla. Some things are nerfed and quite different so it is harder to give advice. However, I do play GOTMs now and then so I have some idea how vanilla works.

The rule of thumb is to get a Library up asap in your capital. Usually you will grow your capital to max happy at this point. Use two citizens to run 2 scientists. This will get you your Academy. If you have the food in secondary cities, it is always good to run 2 scientists in as many cities as possible early. This should get you a second GS in a reasonable time, possible a 3rd or more if Philo. The usual break even point on GS bulbs are things like Philosophy. Paper is okay but relatively cheap. I often double bulb Education on the path to Liberalism.

Look for a high food city for the GP farm. Usually 2 to 3 strong food resources (fish,corn, pigs), build some farms as well. Build NE there and run 2 scientists first thing. At some point after getting Code of Laws, you will want to run Caste System for a bit. At that point you can run more scientists in your GP farm, even to the point of starving you city temporarily. (Running hereditary rule or Representation, hooking up and trading for happy resources, will let you grow this city as large as possible before adopting Caste) Also, don't be afraid to keep running some specialists in other cities as well, especially if in Rep.

Later, I like Great Merchants after Liberalism as you can run trade missions in foreign cities to provide huge boost to gold for teching or upgrades.

Note: Great Person Points are boosted in BTS in many ones. For one, a Golden Age not only provides anarchy free civic switches, for temporary Caste System, but it also provides a 100% boost to GPPs during the Golden Age. With NE this is huge and even better if you build Parthenon.

Culture games are different, of course, as you want to focus on producing Great Artists for culture bombs.

For Diplo, it is good to try to get at least 1 or 2 Great Engineers to rush UN.

gonna start a new game in a minute, and ill try to post some screens and ask for advice on how to handle the early/mid game, i can figure out how to early rush and rex all on my own, its the buildings and the techs that confuse me because im the type to put a granary/forge/baracks/library/lighthouse in every city, and usually an aqueduct also, then usually comes theatre and colluseams

The bolded buildings are fine for most cities. Definitely a Granary and I like Forges everywhere as it boosts static production as well as whip overflow hammers. Barracks is really[a matter of how much you intend to war, which I usually do. Theatres are ok later in vanilla since culture is different and monuments obsolete so early (they obsolete with Astro in BTS not Calendar). Coliseums are usually not necessary, but happiness IS nerfed in vanilla. I only build the "Unique Building" coliseums in BtS as some are very good. (Note: No Unique Buildings in vanilla)

As a rule, if you are plan is to play into late game like Diplo and Space, then Oxford is a must. Make sure you have at least 6 cities with 6 libraries. Whip out Unis asap and build Oxford in your best science city. Most try to set up a strong cottaged Bureau cap for Oxford. In lieu of that, a good GP farm can make a nice Oxford with running scientists, especially with representation. DO NOT NEGLECT OXFORD if going late.

If playing an early conquest/domination type victory, you can usually ignore Oxford as it generally won't matter. But try to have one city growing large, like your capital, to take on the brunt of research to get to the military techs fast and support the economy. Of course, you want to setup an Heroic Epic city.

Again, I recommend posting a start for now and get some opening advice. Play short turn sets, rinse/repeat.

Generally plan for lower levels in most games: Build worker first, build settler at size 3, chop if you go BW early which is often good, tech worker techs (food first), then go Writing>Alpha> Maths>Currency. Make sure your cities are connected by road or water for trade routes. Get foreign trades routes connected asap. Trade route commerce is important.

If you have marble, stone or INdustrious trait, going for things like Oracle and/or Mids is not a bad play. Don't dally. Chop those suckers out. Good things to Oracle are Code of Laws and Metal Casting. CoL will get you your own religion, although often you wont' adopt yours unless in isolation. Religion plays a key part in diplo so choose wisely. Look for foreign religion spread. (Once you get better with early research you can try for the Oracle>Civil Service slingshot)

Next you can go to Literature for Great Library, Music for Great Artists (Golden Age usually), and then shoot for Civil Service > Liberalism. Definitely run Bureaucracy and try to setup your capital for a heavy cottage Bureau cap, even if you have to move the Palace.

Edit: Lastly, another thing I noticed in your game. Try to avoid unhappy citizens. You pay maintenance on them. One way is to curb growth in your city by adjusting citizens to production tiles and running specialists. However, also not that unhappy citizens are free production if you whip them so that can be a good thing, but don't leave them for long. Also, again, make sure you have enough workers. At least 1 per city, but more like 1.5 per city. Workers can be chopped out quickly or 2popped whipped.

 

[Handel]

The main difference between both games is the Civ 3 is "spam every free tile with a city" game unlike in Civ 4 the human player will suicide himself if he plays in this way. BUT - the devs didn't succeed to develop an AI which can play successfully by those rules so they bent the rules in AI favor so the AI effectively still plays Civ 3 instead of Civ 4. The players will tell you this is not so but the truth is the AI still city-spams every free tile.

 

[damerell]

The main difference between both games is the Civ 3 is "spam every free tile with a city" game unlike in Civ 4 the human player will suicide himself if he plays in this way. BUT - the devs didn't succeed to develop an AI which can play successfully by those rules so they bent the rules in AI favor so the AI effectively still plays Civ 3 instead of Civ 4. The players will tell you this is not so but the truth is the AI still city-spams every free tile.

You seem to have inadvertently forgotten to attach the save which proves your point with an AI city on every free tile.