Moving from starting Settler position

Furycrab

King
Joined
May 26, 2011
Messages
914
Simple question, looking for good reasons you would move your initial settler. More specifically reasons you would move him so that you would lose one or more than one turn and how quick do you feel you get a return on that investment.

Assuming you are not reloading and have more than just your warriors 1st turn scouting.

Btw, don't really want to know what you look for in a starting location (since I think most of us can guess what a good starting location looks like), just reasons you would find a starting location fine but still move your settler for at least one turn.
 

fmlizard2

Prince
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Apr 6, 2011
Messages
424
The most common reasons for me are to get next to a mountain (observatory or Machu Picchu) or to get next to the ocean. Sometimes you can squeeze in an extra luxury tile too, but you generally won't know this for a few turns.
 

RedRover57

Emperor
Joined
Nov 1, 2010
Messages
1,014
Other reasons may include:

- Settle on top of a river hill for an immediate production boost
- Settle on top of a mining resource so you can sell the lux as soon as you finish Mining (not as powerful post-patch due to the happiness "nerf").
-Settle in a more easily defensible position (particularly on higher difficulties where it is not uncommon to be DOWed by turn 20-30.
 

lilnev

King
Joined
Aug 22, 2006
Messages
949
Settle on a hill. All else equal, this pays off very quickly.
Bring more luxuries within three tiles. Sometimes to bring multiple good tiles closer, so I don't have to buy so many. Sometimes I'll move to bring more hills and forests into easy range if it doesn't cost too much (e.g. luxuries further away).
 

Martin Alvito

Real men play SMAC
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Sep 23, 2010
Messages
2,332
Picking up a 3:c5food: tile is another reason that I will move. Otherwise you've hit on them all.

I strongly prefer to settle luxuries, and as a result it's rare that I don't move.
 

Furycrab

King
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May 26, 2011
Messages
914
Moving next to the Coast and/or a River.

You almost "always" start on a river I think.

Questions: If you settle on a resource, do you get it's base bonus? If so, will that improve with anything (tech or building, example: Stable, Stoneworks, Granary)
 

Misterboy

Modern Major General
Joined
Oct 12, 2010
Messages
244
Once you get the required tech, you immediately get the improvement bonus (it's assumed the improvement is immediately built) if you're settled on a luxury or strategic resource. Without the tech (and therefore, the improvement) you get the base resources just as any other tile.
 

The Ed Carden

Chieftain
Joined
May 28, 2011
Messages
16
Slightly off-topic. What's the most amount of turns people have gone before settling their first city? I rarely ever move off the starting spot myself (although I may play around with this after reading this thread) so I think the longest I've gone is two turns.
 

snarzberry

Emperor
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May 28, 2010
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1,240
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New Zealand
I think I move my settler about half the time. If I do move it it will be to settle a mining resource, or on top of marble, or less frequently a calendar resource. After scouting with the warrior I'll sometimes move to pick up a good food hex or another resource.
 

Furycrab

King
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May 26, 2011
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Once you get the required tech, you immediately get the improvement bonus (it's assumed the improvement is immediately built) if you're settled on a luxury or strategic resource. Without the tech (and therefore, the improvement) you get the base resources just as any other tile.

So if I settle on a wheat I start with all the bonus food? Or if I settle on a Marble I get +1 hammer, than +1 hammer and +2gold when I get Masonry and an extra +1 hammer with stoneworks?

It's not OMG imba, but I could see how this can snowball on your first city.
 

RedRover57

Emperor
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Nov 1, 2010
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Settling on a wheat is almost always a bad idea. I would try not to settle on tiles like wheat, cows or sheep because the improvements are too good. Particularly river wheat after a farm plus Civil Service.
 

codepoet

Commander of Cubicle 42
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Nov 17, 2008
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360
Location
Colorado
You almost "always" start on a river I think.

Questions: If you settle on a resource, do you get it's base bonus? If so, will that improve with anything (tech or building, example: Stable, Stoneworks, Granary)

Actually it depends on which Civ you play. Some have preferences built in for always starting next to rivers (America and Songhai off the top of my head)... some hills (Inca)... some forest (Iroquois)... some ocean (England I think). There are others too.
Then aside from that I think it's really random whether you get a river or not - the map generator just guarantees a luxury at the start (which is modified by the Legendary start option obviously).
 

Furycrab

King
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May 26, 2011
Messages
914
Settling on a wheat is almost always a bad idea. I would try not to settle on tiles like wheat, cows or sheep because the improvements are too good. Particularly river wheat after a farm plus Civil Service.

Well that was my question, do you still get the improvements/bonuses if you build on a resource? Someone replied to me saying yes. Previous games say no, so I haven't really ever tried except for Strategic resources that sometimes land under my cities but I can't remember if I got the bonus hammers as if it was Mined. Even settling on a Luxury seems questionable if you don't get the improvements since they almost all have buildings that will improve them even further.
 

Waydeuce

Chieftain
Joined
Jun 11, 2010
Messages
21
Location
Kansas City
I will move to get to the coast, if its clearly visible or to a river for the :c5production: and :c5gold: bonus'. I can't seem to ever spend more than one turn looking for a new or better plot to start on, just feels like I'm too far behind :D
 

vexing

knows
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Dec 24, 2010
Messages
2,668
Well that was my question, do you still get the improvements/bonuses if you build on a resource? Someone replied to me saying yes. Previous games say no, so I haven't really ever tried except for Strategic resources that sometimes land under my cities but I can't remember if I got the bonus hammers as if it was Mined. Even settling on a Luxury seems questionable if you don't get the improvements since they almost all have buildings that will improve them even further.

you get the normal bonuses but they have to exceed the city base to provide a bonus.
you don't get improvement bonuses - the city does not count as an improvement.

as an example settling on a horse on a grassland (2 food 1 hammer normally) won't change the city tile. if you build a stable, the city tile will go up to 2 hammers as the base tile is up to 2/2.
settling on a grassland cow (3 food) will make your city tile have 3 food. getting a stable won't further change the city tile, as the base tile is still just 3/1.
 

Hustapha Thool

Warlord
Joined
Apr 30, 2003
Messages
234
If I am playing normal speed I usually do not like to move more than 2 turns. If I play on marathon, I have moved up to ten turns probably, sometimes realizing that the original was probably the best. When play Inca, I have notice i can usually get much better starts by getting those really sweet hills +4,5,6 by moving. It seems the start balancer does not really take these into consideration.

I often will settle on a cow.
 

Johan de Witt

Prince
Joined
Jun 28, 2005
Messages
415
you get the normal bonuses but they have to exceed the city base to provide a bonus.
you don't get improvement bonuses - the city does not count as an improvement.

as an example settling on a horse on a grassland (2 food 1 hammer normally) won't change the city tile. if you build a stable, the city tile will go up to 2 hammers as the base tile is up to 2/2.
settling on a grassland cow (3 food) will make your city tile have 3 food. getting a stable won't further change the city tile, as the base tile is still just 3/1.

Grassland is 2:c5food:, 3:c5food: with cows. If the yield goes up to 3:c5food:/1:c5production: with a stable then it did improve the yield...
 

André Alfenaar

Warlord
Joined
Oct 21, 2002
Messages
274
The city tile always has at least 1 production.

Considering founding on hills: I am always a bit reluctant to do this, because then I won't be able to build a windmill. But the early poduction of settling on the hill pays off?
 
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