I'm running a republic in a continent-based map.I'd like to use my navy as defensive barrier against a potentially hostile force on the other side of the ocean.Would u reccommend a sub-heavy navy or more crusier-based?How efficentive are shore-based cruise missles & bombers at anti-ship defense?
Naval tactics in C3C: sub defense
- Thread starter stalin83
- Start date
Ringo Kid
Prince
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2004
- Messages
- 536
Subs are cheap, but short range so you need a lot of them. I prefer destroyers because they cover more territory with their longer range. If you can predict what route the enemy is likely to follow to reach you, you might station a couple of subs along the sea lane as "early warning radar", far enough out to give your destroyers or bombers ample time to do the actual attacking.
Cost effect -wise, bombers are better than ships because they can attack land based or sea targets. And you can use fighters to scan the sea lanes for advance warning of the enemy fleet.
Subs have the advantage of "stealth attack" which allows them to select a target within the stack of ships, though.
Cost effect -wise, bombers are better than ships because they can attack land based or sea targets. And you can use fighters to scan the sea lanes for advance warning of the enemy fleet.
Subs have the advantage of "stealth attack" which allows them to select a target within the stack of ships, though.
PaperBeetle
Emperor
Surely the most cost effective defense against an overseas aggressor is to ignore them completely until they land some units on your shores. Then you kill those units with your land-based military. This method has several advantages...
(1) They can't attack and sink your shipping if you don't have any.
(2) If it turns out they don't try to come and get you, you didn't waste any shields building ships.
(3) When attacking on land, you have a chance to get leaders.
It does have the disadvantage that the overseas civ might start bombarding your land from offshore. But that, while annoying, is not especially damaging provided you have a proper number of workers who can keep fixing the damage. Artillery and bombers can be used to punish this kind of behaviour, becasue the offending ships will usually end their turn fairly close to your shores.
But if you must build ships, I recommend cruisers over subs. Subs are far too weak and slow to be of much use. If your enemy is behind you in tech, destroyers might be sufficient; they are both cheap and fast.
(1) They can't attack and sink your shipping if you don't have any.
(2) If it turns out they don't try to come and get you, you didn't waste any shields building ships.
(3) When attacking on land, you have a chance to get leaders.
It does have the disadvantage that the overseas civ might start bombarding your land from offshore. But that, while annoying, is not especially damaging provided you have a proper number of workers who can keep fixing the damage. Artillery and bombers can be used to punish this kind of behaviour, becasue the offending ships will usually end their turn fairly close to your shores.
But if you must build ships, I recommend cruisers over subs. Subs are far too weak and slow to be of much use. If your enemy is behind you in tech, destroyers might be sufficient; they are both cheap and fast.
Destroyers for the number. I find Cruisers and Battleship too costly for their usability : If the ennemy use a stack, even of old ships (as Frigates), he can easilly put a hole in your Battleship net by using Bombardment.
And Bombers based in your coast cities. Bombers+Destroyers are highly effectives.
I don't fear naval attacks from AI. Aquawarfare is really too puny in this game (it was more bloody in Civ 1).
And Bombers based in your coast cities. Bombers+Destroyers are highly effectives.
I don't fear naval attacks from AI. Aquawarfare is really too puny in this game (it was more bloody in Civ 1).
Nergal
Prince
You need spotters though, to find out where enemy ships are planes are coming from, subs are ideal for it, unless of course the AI knows where they are.
TheOverseer714
Overseer
There is a risk in using subs if you are worried about dog-piles, because any neutral country will declare war on you if one of your subs are in their path. This is the infamous sub bug. I've even had a caravel run into a sub and get declared on! Subs are risky to use, and too slow to be much use. If you are fully railed, let them land and use artillery to red-line the landing party, then finish them with elite units. Just make sure your coastal mountains have units on them to prevent landings there.
Personally, I build a few cruisers in almost every game. I use them to destroy enemy ships that are bombarding my coastal cites, and they have the same movement points as Transports, so I use them as escorts.
I also build carriers and use them to hit targets that my land based bombers can't hit. When the war is over, the carriers stay off the coast of the enemy, but the bombers come home. Build a few carriers, station them off the coast of the AI civs, and once a war starts transfer bombers to them. You won't have enough bombers to hurt their military, but you can destroy a LOT of infrastructure with 1 fully loaded carrier.
I also build carriers and use them to hit targets that my land based bombers can't hit. When the war is over, the carriers stay off the coast of the enemy, but the bombers come home. Build a few carriers, station them off the coast of the AI civs, and once a war starts transfer bombers to them. You won't have enough bombers to hurt their military, but you can destroy a LOT of infrastructure with 1 fully loaded carrier.
Hey guys , thanks for the input.I've got another concern: gold.
im a republic so big army = big expense in gold.So i'm looking for a high quality solution.
The less number of units I use the better.So i'm considering a combined-arms options suggested by u'all.
The subs would gets the 1st hint of trouble while destroyers + subs would track enemy fleet.
Land-based bombers would sink the incoming fleet.
The reason why I wish to avoid a land-fight as it might distract my forces which would be handling a much larger attack from my neighbours.
im a republic so big army = big expense in gold.So i'm looking for a high quality solution.
The less number of units I use the better.So i'm considering a combined-arms options suggested by u'all.
- a handful of subs (approx 5) for recon off enemy-harbours
- a few destroyers (under 5)
- re-use shore-based Air Force bombers
The subs would gets the 1st hint of trouble while destroyers + subs would track enemy fleet.
Land-based bombers would sink the incoming fleet.
The reason why I wish to avoid a land-fight as it might distract my forces which would be handling a much larger attack from my neighbours.
Sub-bug?? how have i not heard of this
i did wonder in my last game why my subs got attacked by my "friends" lol now it makes sence
Sweetchuck
King
- Joined
- Nov 26, 2006
- Messages
- 649
I thought subs were generally non-detectable.
I'd have enemy subs attacking my destroyers - I'd never see them.
And, when I had subs - I had freakin galleys attacking them.
I'd have enemy subs attacking my destroyers - I'd never see them.
And, when I had subs - I had freakin galleys attacking them.
ChaosArbiter
King
Subs are generally non-detectable - but if a combat ship runs into one, it counts as an attack, they duke it out, and if you weren't at war, well, you are now.
AznWarlord
Monarch
You just need to know what route they're going to attack you with. Same route with ships, same route with troops, find out where the pattern is and hold that area with everything you have.
this i agree with, they will try and try and try and try again with the same area and then when that obviously it not gonna work the AI will find a new spot and milk that to death aswell
