New Natural Wonder Bit Much

ahawk

King
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King Solomon's Mines seems like the best natural wonder, now. The only thing that comes close is the GBR, which is actually two tiles worth of bonus yield. Why I feel this way:


1) +6 :c5production: is incredibly powerful, even beyond the early game. Prior to planting a GE or getting the late-game SP for extra production from mines, it's highly unlikely that you will match this sort of production in a single tile until rather late (or at the expense of a precious GE).

2) In an early-game situation, you're basically looking at building a granary and/or water mill in a ridiculously short time to start getting food yields up quickly. This means this city will catch up very quickly to whatever your capital is doing, assuming similar terrain types around each city.

3) As Spain, this is +12 production (and whatever gold for finding it).

4) Again in the early game, any side with an early UU that finds this is likely to bowl-over its neighbor. This goes double for Germany, Zulu, and anyone else who can more easily afford the high maintenance of such a large army as well as having said early-game UU.

5) On higher difficulties, an AI civ that works KSM may have unbelievable production, given that they already get bonuses to help them.


Ultimately, KSM seems like the best NW in the game now. The only competitors are Eldorado (if you find it first, at any rate) and GBR. While Eldorado can let you buy a quick Settler, KSM could let you build the Settler in almost no time and let you do it again and again. And while GBR is fairly potent, GBR requires you to be on a coast and to also be able to actually reach both tiles.

It's up for debate, but KSM seems like a new 'Skill-dorado'...
 
I agree that Spain starting next to it is a game that's been decided. But apart from that with it's just slightly better than some others...
 
Well if you play as Catherine and have iron on a hill that is 4 hammers without even mining it so this 6 hammer natural wonder is not such a big deal.
 
Hearing people complain about any wonder while Fountain of Youth is still in the game is... I dunno. Surreal?
 
Started a game with Celts the other day and was up 12 faith by t7 and growing in pop... 6 faith plus 2 food from Natural Wonder, plus 2 faith from forests, plus 4 faith from pantheon. Holy warriors were cranking out like madness!! So I'd take on any other civ with king Solomon's mines cause that city will not grow from the very outset!!
 
It's actually not that much worse (I would even argue less bad) than the Fountain of Youth.

Crapton of happiness, and all your units forever heal at double speed. Yeah...


~R~

That's true. The happiness boost is super-powerful, and that's the main issue with FoY for me. Units healing faster is nice, but not incredible, given how bad the AI is with warfare.

I'd still say KSM is worse, though, because KSM helps you get whatever you need, not just happiness, or science, or food. KSM lets you build everything so much quicker, so you can get up National Wonders, coliseums, libraries, universities, markets, whatever, up to match whatever you need. And you can do this for two different cities if you settle carefully around KSM and have the workable tiles over-lap. Just transfer the tile from one city to the other as you like.

Moreover, on higher difficulties, the AI doesn't really need any extra happiness. Even on Emperor, the AI is almost never going to actually see unhappiness due to the bonuses it gets, so FoY's happiness bonus isn't so useful to it. While on the other hand, +6 production, when given to an Emperor AI, is going to mean it builds even faster and gets everything far quicker than you, practically bumping its production up to Immortal or Deity levels.
 
It's not as big a yield as you think. Imagine how you'd distribute your citizens to work it; let's say you've got a city with population 4. It works KSM, a cow, and a couple of farmed grasslands: 9 Food, 7 Production. Now imagine another city, same size, this time with a couple of grasslands wheat tiles nearby. Work those and two mined hills, you've got 8 Food, 6 Production. Build a Granary in each city, and the one with KSM has 11 Food, 7 Production; the one with the wheat has 12 Food, 6 Production—basically just as good (granted, yes, the city with KSM will build that granary faster).

Obviously I'm just pulling hypothetical city sites out of thin air here, but you get the idea—KSM sites are generally going to fall within the existing range of strong sites. Sure, you could plant a city near KSM and a bunch of wheat and maybe some stone and cows for good measure, but your odds of getting KSM in your capital (without wandering in the desert for forty turns) are vanishingly small. You can already get absurdly strong starts (multiple wheats, stone, salt, etc.) if you insist on cheesing it, and getting KSM in your second or third city, no matter how good the site is, will never have as much of a game-breaking effect as having a perfect site for your capital.

Hell, with Goddess of the Hunt I've gotten three 4 Food, 2 Production Deer tiles in one city. If that's not broken, KSM is definitely not broken.
 
+6 production certainly is not to be scoffed at.:)
 
It seems that the KSM has a moderately low chance to appear. Normal is 10, El dorado is 2, Fountain of Youth is 1, KSM is 4.
 
Sorry,what's the source for this new wonder? I missed it.
 
Probably data mining from the steam leak.:)
 
Nvm, found it at well of souls. Interesting... doesn't seem very "natural."
 
I wish there was a way to disable some of the wonders but keep others. Fountain of Youth, Cerro De Potosi and El Dorado all annoy me.
 
One thing that these new natural wonders does throw into question is the value of the oldest natural wonders. Things like the Grand Mesa (2 Production, 3 Gold) and the Barringer Crater (2 Gold, 3 Science) are looking pretty anemic by comparison.
 
What's the rareness code? Is this something that will appear every game or just occasionally like El Dorado and the Fountain of Youth?
 
I wish there was a way to disable some of the wonders but keep others. Fountain of Youth, Cerro De Potosi and El Dorado all annoy me.

Mods

Or you can remove the entries from the xml directly. (make a backup first).
 
Not that OP, Huns for example can get 4-5 production on horses + other yields. Similar case for Russia. It is OP only when Spain controls it.

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