NEW Rome 281 B.C - 400 A.D

[McMonkey]

Hello

I have started working on a new scenario covering the rise of Rome. It starts in the year 281 B.C. with Rome as an emerging regional power about to face the Greek general Pyrrhus of Epirus (and his elephants) in southern Italy.
I plan to cover the rise of Rome, the change over to Empire and the eventual downfall of the Western Roman empire.
The map I am using is a slightly modified version of the one I used for my WWII Europa scenario (32,000sq), without the eastern USA!
The playable nations are ROME (intended for human), CARTHAGE (including Levant), PTOLEMIC GREEKS (in Egypt/Cyprus and Rhodes), SELEUCID GREEKS (in Middle east and Asia minor. Also represent Parthians and Sassanids later in game), MACEDONIAN GREEKS (including southern Italy, Crete, Black Sea, eastern Sicily, Massalia and western Anatolia), CELTS (Gauls, Celtiberians, Senones, Ligurians, Britons) and BARBARIANS (Germanics, Latins, Samnites, Dacians, Skythians, Sarmatians and later Huns and Slavs). Also there are several INDEPENDENT cities such as Numantia, Narbo etc...

Once again I have borrowed the best graphics I could find, mostly from Fairline (genius!).

One idea I have had to aid gameplay and historical realism is to place enamy towns where Roman cities were later located. I then named these enemy towns after the local tribe. This means that the Roman player has to fight real Celtic and Germanic tribes. When the Roman player captures that tribes city then it can be renamed to the historical Roman name giving the game a touch or realism.

If you have any ideas or suggestions please let me know.

Thanks

Drew

 

[Gelion]

Have you checked out ImperiumRomanium by Bernd Brosing? It may be a sad thing to learn, but his scenario covers the area and time period you're workng on.

 

[McMonkey]

Hi Gelion
Yes I did play Bernd's scenario a couple of years ago (A1). I also enjoyed Paul Mutica's Wars of the Mediteranian about the same period. These have helped inspire my new offering.
The reasons for me creating a new scenario are as follows:
-I am obsessed with CivII and cannot stop playing it.
-The map I am using is much larger than in previous Rome scenarios (32,000 squares rather than 10,000) which means Britain can be included as well as the whole of Gaul and Germany and the steppes of Russia as well as Mesopotamia, Arabia and the Caucasus.
-There is therefore room for more cities.
-The map is more topographicaly correct. I created it by photocopying a map of Europe at the height of the Roman Empire and drawing a grid on it. I then drew an identical grid on the map editor. I then traced the map across box by box to create the coastline. After that I added Rivers and Mountains, Hills and Forests to recreate the geography of Europe as accurately as I could. The cities are as near as possible to their real possitions.
-Over the years I have had many original ideas (plus borrowed a few) on making the game more challenging and longlasting. These involve changing rules files as game goes on so the odds do not stack too far in favour of the human player. How much fun is it when the Roman empire is at its height and it is a case of mopping up the last few enemy cities. I want barbarian invasions and civil war!
-Also I have spent a long time compiling the best unit graphics from other designers and think that these make for a more attractive game.

I have learn so much about the game from other designers and I have pooled this knowledge to try to create something new and fresh from an old classic!

Hope that answers your question (I tend to waffle a bit!)

 

[McMonkey]

This is an early work in progress screenshot.

I am making much use of some excellent units by Fairline that I have never seen used in any other scenario.

 

[Gelion]

This simply looks amazing. I look forward to many new screenshots and discussing this thing if you need any brainstorming on ideas

P.S. I like your choice of units !

 

[McMonkey]

Thanks
The units look amazing. A lot of them are by Fairline, I found a file with units from early Republican Rome up the the end of the Western empire. I also found some excellent Greek succesor states graphics for the Macedonians, Seleucids and Ptolemics. Some of the Celtic and Skythian units are from ToT graphics that I have shrunk down to fit CiVII Gold.

I will post a preview of the Units file once I work out how to upload Bitmap. At the moment I am getting a message saying my allowance is full. The only image I have uploaded is the one above. I must be doing something wrong!

 

[Gelion]

I think the images you uploaded to the downloads section count as well. Just check everything you've ever done with CFC....
I'm looking forward to an update on this!

 

[McMonkey]

Excuse my ignorance, what is CFC?

 

[Cimbri]

Excuse my ignorance, what is CFC?

You are posting in it.

 

[Leonidas300]

Werd100:

Looking very nice.

One suggestion:

There were historical reports from many ancient writers (Arrian, Pausanias, et al) who noted the rather large stature of the Celtic and Germani tribes, especially the Senones, who had long flowing blonde hair and were noted as "Blonde Giants". It would be interesting to have large units used for these "barbarians".

Here are some passages:

"Many historians confirm the great height of these wandering Celts. The ancient Greek historian Pausanias, for example, called them the world's tallest people. Gerhard Herm, his modern counterpart, agrees. He describes them as "blond giants" who struck terror into the hearts of every foe, even in the mightiest of the mighty Rome, which they fought several ferocious wars with and which they once captured, sacked, and burned to the ground.

"Of course, not all Celts were giants. The average-sized ones probably towered no more than a foot above ordinary men. But their ranks also contained substantial numbers who rose to a gigantic stature.

"At the utmost divergence from the mean, some Celts even stood to a colossal height, perhaps as tall or taller than the nine-foot-nine Goliath, or even Og, who required a bed over thirteen feet long. Such behemoths, when they first put their ships ashore on Europe's seacoasts, no doubt startled the aborigines.

"Doing as they did in Asia and Asia Minor, the invading Celts first robbed these lesser mortals, then chased them off the best lands. As they multiplied and required even more territory, they crowded still others out. This fast-expanding nation, according to Strabo, eventually grew to some sixty different tribes — each with its own name.

"In Upper Asia, Mesopotamia, and Asia Minor, these plunderers were known as the Gomarian Sacae. But once they settled in Europe, the decided to shed their derisive name, which means "robbers", and began calling themselves the Celtae (pronounced "Kelti"), which denotes "potent and valiant men". The Greeks, however, understood them to say Galatai, while their Roman neighbors heard their name as Galli. The aborigines of France, meanwhile called them Gauls.

"These slightly different pronunciations of course caused different spellings, as the Celtic scholar Henri Hubert explains: "The word which was written down as Keltos in Spain and the neighborhood of Marseilles sounded differently in the ears of the Greeks of the Balkan Peninsula, who wrote it down Galates. But it was the same name". (Source: DeLoach, "Celtic Giants", 54-55.)

Another:

"The plundering Celts and Gauls, who initially met only token opposition moving northwest through Greece, soon came into conflict with the powerful Roman Empire. One subgroup of the Celts, the Senones, actually attacked and managed to sack Rome around 387 b.c. Facing off for the first time against 30,000 screaming Goliaths, enraged by grave insults done them by Roman envoys, the Romans were terrified and ran as soon as their lines broke at the Battle of Allia:

"That terrifying July day the Latins would never forget. The great size of the Celts unnerved them. Some of the giants they saw wore chain-wrought iron cuirasses, and some wore only shirts gathered up with belts plated with gold or silver. But many wore no armor nor clothes, preferring instead to go into battle naked. Most, however, wore overlong broadswords slung around the right flanks on chains of iron or bronze. The spears and javelins they brandished give us some idea of their strength. On the spears were affixed iron heads a cubit in length and even more [18-20 inches], and a little under two palms in breadth. [Their swords were] about 96 inches [8 feet] long....

"But the terror the Romans felt at the Allia sprang not from the Celt's height and armaments alone. These supermen also assaulted their eyes and ears with fierce looks, deep voices and pre-battle antics. One of these antics called for some of the huge Celtic champions, when they were formed for battle, to step out in front of their lines, brandish their large weapons menacingly at their smaller adversaries and challenge the most valiant among them to single combat.

"We do not know whether any Romans accepted such a challenge at the Allia, but if they did, according to Celtic custom, each challenger would have then broken forth into a song praising the valiant deeds of his ancestors and boasting of his own high achievements, while at the same time reviling and belittling his opponent, and trying by such talk to strip him of his bold spirit before the combat. Not just the champion warriors, but the whole Celtic army took part in this psychological warfare. Beating their swords rhythmically against their shields, they assailed the enemy's ears with a tumult of almost intolerable sound.

"The whole country round seemed filled with their exceedingly loud war cries, accompanied by the unceasing blare of innumerable giant boar-headed war trumpeters and horn blowers" (Ibid., "Rome vs. Senone Giants", 249-251).

 

[Leonidas300]

the Celts:

 

[Leonidas300]

Vercingetorix:

Leader of the Gauls and remembered for his battles against Caesar at the Battle of Alesia (52 BCE):

 

[Leonidas300]

The Germani:

Rome's first real challenge against the Germani came when some 300,000 Cimbri had crossed the Danube and had started migrating southward looking for new lands to possess. Even the giant Gauls were afraid of these Germani, and asked for Roman protection from their hyperaggressive cousins.

"The first few armies the Romans sent to check their advance were annihilated, and Rome itself was saved only when the Germani decided to head west to find greener pastures in Spain. The desperate Romans then sent for one of their greatest generals, Gaius Marius, who whipped the legions into shape and successfully defeated the Tuetone and Ambrone tribes, even capturing their giant King Tuetobokh, who towered above even the Roman spears. The terrible Cimbri still remained however, but Marius had a plan.

"On the appointed day, one hundred and eighty thousand Cimbri took up a position in the plain. There they formed a square whose sides measured nearly four miles. Behind them waited their wives and children and the other noncombatants, with their wagons. From the throats of the vast multitude of warriors and even their families now came horrible war cries and shouted singing. Meanwhile, the horn blowers and trumpeters rent the air with their stirring calls to battle. The charioteers began lining up in their appointed places.

"Some of their splendidly adorned cavalry, which numbered 15,000, pranced about, eager for battle. They wore helmets made to resemble the heads of wild beasts with gaping jaws, and above those rose plumes of feathers. This adornment, as calculated, caused them to appear even more frightful, even more invincible, and even more enormous than they already were.

"As the savage hosts worked themselves into a frenzy, Marius and his legionnaires approached from the east, with the sun and wind at their backs. As the Roman legionnaires entered the field, the great Cimbri army set itself into a motion that Plutarch likened to the billowing of a furious ocean at high tide.

"As was their custom, the bravest of the Cimbri, with blood-curdling yells, led the attack. So that their ranks might not be broken, those in the forefront bound themselves together with iron chains attached to their belts. This surging tide of blond barbarian giants the Roman foot soldiers attacked first with their javelins. The breech this created allowed the Romans to get inside the Cimbri lines with their swords. As the battle progressed, a big cloud of dust arose from beneath the combatants' trampling feet. The light wind at the Romans' backs blew this dust mostly into the faces of the Cimbri. The hot August sun also began to hinder their sight.

"To shut out the harsh glare, the heavy-sweating Cimbri warriors now and then lifted their shields at the sun, thus exposing more of their large bodies to the Romans, who slew them almost at will. After great numbers had been killed and it became evident to those still alive that there was no chance to turn the tide of battle, many brave German giants bound themselves together with chains to fight to the last man.

"But some sought refuge among their wagons. Then before the Roman's eyes occurred a most unusual scene. The female giants, reports Plutarch, "slew all that fled, some their husbands, some their brethren, others their fathers." With their hands they then throttled their little children and threw them under the racing wheels of retreating chariots or before the pounding hoofs of horses or draft animals. Then they killed themselves" (Ibid., "German Giants' Annihilation", PP. 101-102).

 

[McMonkey]

Leonidas
Thanks for the info, very inspiring. I need to work on my units graphics a bit. One of the Celtic units looks OK but the other one was taken from a ToT game and shrunk to fit and looks a bit weedy now. I will need to alter the way he holds his sword above his head to be able to enlarge him and beef him up a bit.

This is an example of the units graphics.
I have included an early version of the units rules to show which units are which. As the game goes on it will be nessasary to change over the rules and graphics files. At these points units may improve or deteriorate depending on how I am trying to steer the game to keep it challenging. The graphics files will update so the full range off Roman armies can be enjoyed.
@UNITS
Slave, nil, 0, 1.,0, 1a,1d, 1h,1f, 4,0, 5, nil,
000000000000010
Engineer, nil, 0, 1.,0, 1a,2d, 1h,1f, 6,0, 5, Cst, 000000000000000
Roman Cavalry, X1, 0, 2.,0, 4a,2d, 1h,1f, 6,0, 0, Hor, 000000000000000
Companion Cavalry, X2, 0, 2.,0, 5a,3d, 2h,1f, 5,0, 0, nil, 000000000000000
Celtic Warband, X3, 0, 1.,0, 5a,2d, 1h,2f, 3,0, 0, nil, 000101001000011
Celtic Warrior, X3, 0, 1.,0, 4a,3d, 2h,1f, 3,0, 1, nil, 000101001000011
Roman General, X1, 0, 2.,0, 5a,3d, 1h,1f, 8,0, 0, nil, 000000000000001
Germanic Warrior, X6, 0, 1.,0, 4a,3d, 2h,1f, 3,0, 1, nil, 000101001000011
Germanic Warband, X6, 0, 1.,0, 5a,2d, 1h,2f, 3,0, 0, nil, 000101001000011
Balearic Slinger, nil, 0, 1.,0, 4a,2d, 1h,1f, 2,0, 0, no, 000001000000111
Horsemen, nil, 0, 2.,0, 3a,1d, 1h,1f, 3,0, 0, no, 000001000000011
Cretan Archer, U2, 0, 1.,0, 4a,2d, 1h,1f, 3,0, 0, nil, 000001000000111
Dacian Falxman, X6, 0, 1.,0, 5a,2d, 1h,2f, 2,0, 0, no, 000111001000011
Celtiberian Warrior, X3, 0, 1.,0, 5a,2d, 1h,2f, 2,0, 0, no, 000101001000011
Dacian Warrior, X6, 0, 1.,0, 4a,3d, 2h,1f, 3,0, 1, no, 000101001000011
Celtic Cavalry, X3, 0, 2.,0, 4a,2d, 2h,1f, 3,0, 0, nil, 000000000000011
Skythian Horse, X6, 0, 2.,0, 5a,2d, 1h,1f, 3,0, 0, no, 000011000000011
War Elephant, U3, 0, 2.,0, 6a,3d, 2h,1f, 8,0, 0, nil, 000010000000000
Numidian Horse, X7, 0, 2.,0, 5a,2d, 1h,1f, 4,0, 0, nil, 000001000000011
Seleucid Horse, X4, 0, 2.,0, 4a,2d, 1h,1f, 4,0, 0, nil, 000001000000011
Rebel Legion, nil, 0, 1.,0, 6a,3d, 2h,2f, 5,0, 0, no, 000010001000111
Hellenic Hoplite, U2, 0, 1.,0, 4a,3d, 2h,1f, 3,0, 1, nil, 000010000000100
Catapult, nil, 0, 1.,0, 6a,1d, 1h,2f, 5,0, 0, nil, 000000001000000
Arab Horse, X5, 0, 2.,0, 4a,2d, 1h,1f, 3,0, 0, nil, 000101000000011
Battering Ram, nil, 0, 1.,0, 6a,1d, 2h,1f, 5,0, 0, nil, 000000001000000
Siege Tower, nil, 0, 1.,0, 6a,2d, 2h,1f, 6,0, 0, nil, 000000001000000
Ballista, X1, 0, 1.,0, 5a,2d, 1h,1f, 5,0, 0, nil, 000000001000100
Seleucid Cavalry, X4, 0, 2.,0, 5a,2d, 2h,1f, 4,0, 0, nil, 000000000000000
Armenian Cavalry, X4, 0, 2.,0, 6a,2d, 2h,1f, 5,0, 0, nil, 000000000000000
Carthaginian Cavalry, X7, 0, 2.,0, 5a,2d, 2h,1f, 4,0, 0, nil, 000000000000000
Sarmatian Cavalry, X6, 0, 2.,0, 6a,2d, 2h,1f, 4,0, 0, no, 000100000000000
Transport Ship, nil, 2, 10.,0, 1a,1d, 1h,1f, 5,4, 4, nil, 000000000000000
Ship 1, nil, 2, 10.,0, 3a,2d, 2h,1f, 5,1, 2, nil, 000000000000000
Ship 2, nil, 2, 10.,0, 4a,2d, 2h,1f, 6,1, 2, nil, 000000000000000
Ship 3, nil, 2, 8.,0, 6a,2d, 2h,1f, 7,1, 2, nil, 000000000000000
Ship 4, nil, 2, 12.,0, 6a,2d, 2h,1f, 8,1, 2, nil, 000000000000000
Carthaginian General, X7, 0, 2.,0, 5a,3d, 1h,1f, 8,0, 0, nil, 000000000000000
Macedonian Phalanx, X2, 0, 1.,0, 4a,3d, 2h,1f, 5,0, 1, nil, 000010000000000
Seleucid Phalanx, X4, 0, 1.,0, 4a,3d, 2h,1f, 5,0, 1, nil, 000010000000000
Ptolemic Phalanx, X5, 0, 1.,0, 4a,3d, 2h,1f, 5,0, 1, nil, 000010000000000
African Foot, X7, 0, 1.,0, 3a,2d, 1h,1f, 3,0, 1, nil, 000110000000100
Celtic General, X3, 0, 2.,0, 5a,3d, 1h,1f, 8,0, 0, nil, 000000000000001
Legion Ensign, X1, 0, 1.,0, 0a,3d, 1h,1f, 8,0, 0, nil, 000000000000000
Seleucid Legion, X4, 0, 1.,0, 5a,3d, 2h,1f, 5,0, 0, nil, 000010001000100
Auxiliary, X1, 0, 1.,0, 3a,2d, 1h,1f, 4,0, 1, nil, 000001000000000
Cohort, X1, 0, 1.,0, 4a,2d, 2h,1f, 6,0, 0, nil, 000010000000100
Envoy, nil, 0, 1.,0, 0a,0d, 1h,1f, 8,0, 6, Wri, 001001000000011
Merchant, nil, 0, 1.,0, 0a,1d, 1h,1f, 5,0, 7, Tra, 000000000000011
Pretorian Guard, X1, 0, 1.,0, 4a,3d, 2h,1f, 8,0, 1, nil, 000010000000100
Sacred Band, X7, 0, 1.,0, 5a,3d, 2h,1f, 6,0, 1, nil, 000010001000100
Latin Warrior, nil, 0, 1.,0, 4a,3d, 1h,1f, 3,0, 1, no, 000010000000000
Nubian Warrior, X5, 0, 1.,0, 5a,2d, 1h,1f, 3,0, 0, nil, 000000001000000
Skythian Foot, X6, 0, 1.,0, 3a,3d, 1h,1f, 2,0, 1, no, 000111001000011
Levantine Archer, X4, 0, 1.,0, 3a,3d, 1h,1f, 3,0, 0, nil, 000011001000100
Velite, X1, 0, 1.,0, 3a,2d, 1h,1f, 4,0, 0, nil, 000001000000011
Illyrian Peltast, X6, 0, 1.,0, 4a,2d, 1h,1f, 3,0, 0, no, 000101001000111
Iberian Warrior, X7, 0, 1.,0, 4a,2d, 1h,1f, 3,0, 0, nil, 000101001000111
Hellenic Psiloi, X2, 0, 1.,0, 4a,2d, 1h,1f, 3,0, 0, nil, 000101001000111
Spainish Scutarii, X7, 0, 1.,0, 4a,2d, 1h,1f, 3,0, 0, nil, 000101001000111
Thracian Peltast, X6, 0, 1.,0, 5a,2d, 1h,2f, 3,0, 0, no, 000101001000111
Camel Warrior, X4, 0, 2.,0, 5a,2d, 1h,1f, 3,0, 0, nil, 000011000000011
Celtic Chariot, X3, 0, 2.,0, 5a,1d, 1h,3f, 5,0, 0, nil, 000000000000000


The Ancient map is a bit blurred, especially the Celtic (brown) and Germanic/Skythian/Barbarian (Blue) cities. It does however give a good idea of the scale of the playing area. Rome starts off with five cities (Rome, Terracina, Neapolis, Venusia and Canusium) and is surrounded by hostile Latin and Celtic tribes as well as the Greeks of southern Italy.
Most of the orange cities are the Macedonian and other Greeks, the slightly darker ones in Spain and the Caucasus are the actual Barbarians.
Carthage is olive green, Ptolemic Greeks are yellow and Seleucid Greeks are red. The choice of colours is purely aesthetic.
I may add more cities as I develop the scenario.

 

[Leonidas300]

Werd100:

Overall you have chosen some great units.

I still do lots of modding for Civ2 and I have a great fondness for ancient history and scenarios, so I may be able to help out a bit.

Give me some time and I'll do up some "mighty and valiant" warriors with which to pit against the Romans.

I agree with you that the scenario should not be easy for the player, and through events, you will be able to create some barbarian invasions... heheh

Cheers!

 

[McMonkey]

Thanks Leonidas
The ones I realy need to sort out are the Celt with the green shield and the German with the yellow shield. Both of them look a bit small and puny. I will try to track down the original ToT graphics and put them on the thread. I think they could be altered to not have their sword/axe above their heads and therefore their bodys would not need to be shrunk so much. The Nubian warrior is also not right. I would prefer him to be a bit beefier and maybe have some armour on + no headdress.
Graphics are not my strong point so I try to obtain them from others and then do minor mods to suit my needs.

 

[McMonkey]

View attachment CELTS + GERMANS.bmp
These are some of the best Celtic and German Warband units I have found (created by Fairline for Tecumseh's Roman Coval War ToT scenario).
I may try shrinking them to fit the CivII Gold boxes. Also it will be nessasary to rearange the possition of the arms.
If anyone thinks they can do a decent job of this or has alternative units the I would be grateful. As the Units files will change several times during the course of the game it would be good to have several alternative units for the Celts and Germans so the graphics don't get stale.

 

[McMonkey]

I have just been looking at the Manage Attachments page and have realised where I was going wrong. I was trying to post Jpegs that were larger than 500KB. When I got the message I thought it meant I had reached the maximum total attachments. Doh!
Oh and CFC = Civ Fanatics Centre. Doh!!
Still on the bright side I can squeeze on more screenshots and pics now!

 

[Leonidas300]

Werd100:

From what I have gathered many of the tribes facing the Romans over the years varied a lot in how they looked. Heck, many of the tribes had a very, what we might call, "Viking" look about them. Even the Celts sometimes wore helmets with feathers.

So, it seems reasonable to have units as you have them as well as others that could be used generically for "event-generated invasions".

I'll do up some generic barbarian units as well as a few others.

If you are going to use multiple unit files, one way to avoid having to use a lot of different units, is to do what Paul Cullivan did in his "Seeds of Greatness" scenario: use the same unit multiple times as the tech/strength increases. For example, for Legion I, he used one roman unit; for Legion II, he used the same unit twice (as a mutiple unit); etc....

In this way he avoided having to come up with all types of tech names. It simplified things. Just a suggestion.

 

[Leonidas300]

Here is an example of Rome's enemies.

Here is a painting depicting the surrender of Vercingetorix before Caesar: