News: BOTM 74 - Starts 15 January

[Deckhand]

Here's a new challenge, just for map designers: is it possible to create the release page without any errors?

I only noticed one in mine: the leader is listed as Plato instead of Mansa van Oranje.

 

[Jastrow]

Does anyone have a feeling for a safe Oracle date under these settings BTW? Is turn 70 realistic, or way off the mark???

 

[haphazard1]

This one looks very interesting. Just look at all those lovely resources.

Will have to shake the rust off and see if I can actually finish a BOTM for once.

 

[Xcalibrator]

Can haz spoiler threads pleez?

 

[pomthom]

There are but they're just not Sticky'd

 

[Jastrow]

BTW, can someone tell me... If I settle where the warrior is, and then settle city two on the stone... Are these two cities connected for trade by the river, or do I need any roads?

 

[Deckhand]

BTW, can someone tell me... If I settle where the warrior is, and then settle city two on the stone... Are these two cities connected for trade by the river, or do I need any roads?

They will definitely be connected when you learn Sailing which enables trade on both coast and rivers.
The warrior is not on a river square, so I don't think they will be connected pre-sailing. Maybe there the overlapping BFCs will provide trade when the borders expand - I don't know about that.

 

[Dhoomstriker]

I think that you'd also need a Road segment.

A connection via Rivers within Cultural Borders (or a partial connection via Rivers within Cultural Borders plus Roads that don't have to be within Cultural Borders) will give you a Trade Route connection pre-Sailing.

In this case, the Cities are close enough, since your capital's Cultural Borders will expand at least once by the time that you've settled your second City, but your City where the Warrior is placed won't be on the River. So, you'd need a Road connection to the River, such that one piece of the Road is on a square that has River on at least one full side of square (i.e. put a Road on the PH Riv where the Settler is now standing or on the PH Riv For 1E of where the Settler is standing).

You can confirm my claim when you open the saved game... if there is no Fresh Water bonus displayed in the hover text when you hover the mouse over top of where the Warrior is standing, then you won't get the River connection and you also won't get the free 2 Health in your capital for settling next to Fresh Water.

 

[Jastrow]

Yes, connected after sailing, I knew... I meant before...

Dhoom has confirmed my thinking, which is that I need one piece of road, tho this always confuses me... Why do I need it?? When I paster the Sheep, I will already get the health bonus right, because it is on a river... That means the sheep is connected to my capital... If I then connect the Sheep to the Gem (which look to be on the same river), then why are both not connected to boat cities?

 

[nocho]

^ No, I don't think you'll be connected to the sheep when you've pastured it. It only would be if your city would be riverside (and the same river at that), which it isn't.

 

[Mitchum]

@ Jastrow

I built a quick test game for you (attached). However, if you beat me in the Space Colony gauntlet, I expect a footnote in your victory speech.

Hopefully you get this before you start...

 

[Jastrow]

Thanks, I indeed have not started yet... My worldbuilder skills are extremely limited, and do not include being able to make rivers (which as near as I can tell appear randomly whenever I even think of pressing the river button.)

 

[DynamicSpirit]

Making rivers in WorldBuilder is quite tricky, so doubt that not being able to do it is in general much of a reflection of overall Worldbuilder skills. You basically have to click by the source of the river and then drag the mouse along the intended course of the river to the mouth. Getting the exact path right as you're dragging takes a *lot* of manual dexterity. Even now, after years of doing it, I'm not entirely sure of the precise mouse locations required, and usually construct rivers by much trial and error

If you look carefully at past GOTM maps over the years, there are some quite amusing examples of maps with rivers flowing in the wrong direction or extending into coastal tiles, which are testament to how hard creating rivers in WorldBuilder is (but which luckily have no impact on gameplay, and probably wouldn't even be noticed by most players if you're not specifically looking for them).

 

[Dhoomstriker]

You don't have to hold down your mouse button and drag it. You can also click on one square and then click on the next square in the direction that you want to go, building a River a piece at a time. Doing so gives you a bit more control if your mouse hand isn't always accurate. Right-clicking will remove River pieces from around a square.

The order in which you lay down River pieces can also affect the final layout of the River--not only in terms of direction (i.e. left to right looks different from right to left) but also selectively placing and deleting River segments in different orders can result in a different apperance to your River in some cases.

Part of the "problem" is that the World Builder lets you edit squares, while Rivers lie on the edges of squares, so it takes some experimentation to figure out which side of a square a given River segment will be placed on, as well as how it will connect up to given existing nearby River segments.

Also, the graphics for a River will vary depending upon the X & Y co-ordinate of the map. So, if you want a very specific appearance to your River, it can pay to adjust the starting point of your River to a slightly different co-ordinate on the map.