No wonder people have issues working out tourism stats.

[Victoria]

There was a question in another post about modifier accumulation and whether it happens, I cannot find the thread so will post here. Its quite complicated so will provide an example

I am America so get a 100% bonus for any one reaching the modern age and am playing against Kongo in the atomic age and Norway in the industrial.
I will use a single art museum in a single city as an example.

If I look in the great works page this gives me the best detail here it shows my art museum is themed and producing 18 tourism but when I hover over it it shows 2 tourism if unthemed for each of the three pieces.

So at this level it is a base of 6 Tourism with an +100% (6) of base for using the Cultural Heritage civic and +100 of base (6) for theming it. - Sadly these details are not explained on the page.
My art Museum is producing 18 Tourism.

If I now look at the Tourism lens it shows +36 tourism for this and underneath states +100% if the country has reached the modern era. What this 100% really is is the tech bonus +100% for Computers ( the teddy bonus mentioned on the screen is not applied at this level!)

If I click on the View Reports button at the top of the screen is shows on the Yields tab that for that city the tourism value is 36.

If I only had that city and looked at the top of the screen at the tourism value this would also show 36.

I now go to the cultural victory screen and look at what culture I am feeding Norway and Kongo

For Norway I have open borders (+25%) so am providing Norway with Base City tourism (36) + 25% of base city tourism (9) = 45 Tourism

For Kongo I have open Borders (+25% of base) and a trade route (+100% of base) - due to Online communities (50%) and Sarah Breedlove(25%). As Kongo has reached the modern era I also get the teddy bonus of 100% of base city tourism

So Kongo is receiving 36 + 9 (open Borders) +36 (trade route) + 36 (teddy Bonus) = 117 tourism per turn.

Lets see how krikkttwo can simplify this for his formula page.

As side notes
1. That teddy bonus is huge
2. Theming is only valid in museums
3. Archaeology has a base tourism value of 3 and so a museum gets 27 tourism instead of an art museums 18... Englands Archaeological museum gets 54. nowhere near as powerful as the teddy bonus.

 

[elitetroops]

Nice work!

So it seems there are three kinds of modifiers when calculating tourism.

1) Modifiers that multiply the yields of a specific source of tourism, for example theming bonus and artifact bonuses. I would assume Christo Redentor doubling output of seaside resorts falls in this category.
2) Modifiers that multiply your tourism as a whole. That would be Computers. Not sure if there are any other.
3) Modifiers that multiply tourism towards a specific civilization. This would be trade route bonuses, open borders and so on.

Modifiers of the same kind are additive, then the total modifier for each group is applied as multiplier to your base tourism.

In your example the modifiers towards Kongo are:

1) +100% Cultural Heritage and +100% theming. Total +200%, multiplier = 3.
2) +100% Computers. Total +100%, multiplier = 2
3) +25% open borders, +100% trade route, +100% Film Studio. Total +225%, multiplier = 3.25.

Base tourism = 6. Multiply with all multipliers:

6*3*2*3.25 = 117

 

[Victoria]

1) Modifiers that multiply the yields of a specific source of tourism, for example theming bonus and artifact bonuses. I would assume Christo Redentor doubling output of seaside resorts falls in this category.

You got it, yeah it took a bit of working out and there are a few numbers slightly out but I check when I get each bonus and it clearly shows in the right place. Damn annoying for example my tourism city base is shows as say 1044 but in the city report screen it shows as 1048... The report screen has 4 I cannot find.

As you mentioned Cristo (and eiffel has seaside affects also) I found that in a city with a border 5 wide a seaside resort further than 3 hexes from the city center is also included in tourism which is nice to know.

 

[myclan]

You got it, yeah it took a bit of working out and there are a few numbers slightly out but I check when I get each bonus and it clearly shows in the right place. Damn annoying for example my tourism city base is shows as say 1044 but in the city report screen it shows as 1048... The report screen has 4 I cannot find.

As you mentioned Cristo (and eiffel has seaside affects also) I found that in a city with a border 5 wide a seaside resort further than 3 hexes from the city center is also included in tourism which is nice to know.

So despite the workable area is only 3 tiles, as long as the tile is belong to your territory, seaside resorts will work? I also want to confirm your tourism output of seaside resort as Teddy.

 

[myclan]

I have never be able to get a Great Artist by now and just believe that it will give out 3 tourism just as artifacts. Great Work of Arts is just so difficult to get/to receive the theme bonus, only 2 tourism is too weak.

 

[Victoria]

So despite the workable area is only 3 tiles, as long as the tile is belong to your territory, seaside resorts will work? I also want to confirm your tourism output of seaside resort as Teddy

What do you wish to confirm. I can confirm it worked 5 tiles away as I said. Do you want a screenshot? That Eiffel takes affect for Cristo?... yes. That it included in the city totals .. yes. that the modifiers are on base... yes... most modifiers are in fact part of base if they count toward appeal.

I have never be able to get a Great Artist by now and just believe that it will give out 3 tourism just as artifacts. Great Work of Arts is just so difficult to get/to receive the theme bonus, only 2 tourism is too weak

Great artists give out 2, not 3. They are weaker than artifacts but it is a question of competition for artefacts (and for great artists) but I agree, why bother unless filling the odd spare slot in a wonder (no theming) The theming is not that hard TBH) and the secret to great artists is to get your theaters down and work them projects if you want lots of them, I have never bothered and normally get about 4-6 by the end of the game.
Many people will go for just archaeology... I like the variety of both because its not about being efficient, its about being engaged in the game.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

There is also the wierdness of the Enlightenment civic...it seems like it only affects your religious tourism for some civs and not others. (So religious tourism is kept separate...presumably both relics and religious Art)

 

[Victoria]

So the summary for New York shows 120 Tourism generated (figure on right above)

If you add up all the values including the resort 4 tiles away you will see it is included in the 120 even though it shows no accumulated tourism (show will always have 0 showing in the tourism lens... I will highlight as a bug)

Now there is a city below this with 1 resort that is within 3 tiles of new your but not within its borders and definitely counted in the other cities tourism. The only alternative I can think of is that resort is counted twice... I will have to test.

 

[Victoria]

There is also the wierdness of the Enlightenment civic...it seems like it only affects your religious tourism for some civs and not others. (So religious tourism is kept separate...presumably both relics and religious Art)

Does it only effect your religious tourism? I thought it was an overall modifier based on religion. as it is a modifier on your overall tourism shown in the victory screen.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

Does it only effect your religious tourism? I thought it was an overall modifier based on religion. as it is a modifier on your overall tourism shown in the victory screen.

Well both Enlightenment penalty and the Film Studio seem like they apply to both specific sources (religious tourism/ tourism from the Film studio city) And specific civs (ones with Enlightenment/ones in modern era)

Which implies that you don't really have a "total civ/city/tile tourism" in any gameplay sense.

Instead each source is applied to all civs separately with three (guesses here) different "levels" of multipliers

-Theming, Printing Press, Heritage Tourism, Satellite Broadcasts, Christo resorts, Reliquaries, Leakey, Frech bonus

-Computers

-Enlightenment, Trade Routes, Film Studio, Gov difference, Open Borders

Level 1 used in great work screen
Levels 1&2 are used in tile/city/civ wide displays
All levels used in victory screen displays...where the only real gameplay effect happens.

 

[RealHuhn]

That explains how I've won my earliest culture victory with Teddy today (turn 234, Immortal, standard).
On turn 200 I was kinda worried because I barely got any writers and artists. I still needed like 400 foreign tourists which usually takes quite a while. But after I got 5 themed archeological museums and christo/eiffel tower combo with +100% trade routes and all tourism civics, the game was over extremely quickly.

This probably makes Teddy even better than Victoria although Victoria is a lot stronger in mid game (after harbor/CHs) and should be able to have better infrastructure and more cities than Teddy.

 

[myclan]

View attachment 459387
So the summary for New York shows 120 Tourism generated (figure on right above)

If you add up all the values including the resort 4 tiles away you will see it is included in the 120 even though it shows no accumulated tourism (show will always have 0 showing in the tourism lens... I will highlight as a bug)

View attachment 459386

Now there is a city below this with 1 resort that is within 3 tiles of new your but not within its borders and definitely counted in the other cities tourism. The only alternative I can think of is that resort is counted twice... I will have to test.

I think it is in information age and you have researched computer, so the tourism of the Great Lighthouse is (2+6)*2=16

And I also see that one of the seaside resort giving out 20 tourism while another is 12,
5(appeal)*2(double)*2(Computer)=20? so you don't have the Cristo Render? If having one, the tourism output will be 40?

How about the Great work of Writing? I heard that it should gives out 4. But in your picture just show 32
shouldn't be 4*2(two great work)*2(Computer)=16?

Many thanks

 

[KrikkitTwo]

Printing Press doubles gw of writing

 

[myclan]

Printing Press doubles gw of writing

Oh, I forgot that, thanks.......

 

[Victoria]

If you look to the top of the screenshot you should be able to see the cristo base, no eiffel though. It does pose the question what has happen to that doubling. I should have made more saves.
Will go check that game, pretty sure thats cristo in the picture.
BTW, did you notice one of the seaside resorts has 12 tourism so is not breathtaking. As long as its breathtaking when built it will keep running, just like british seaside resorts

 

[Victoria]

And I also see that one of the seaside resort giving out 20 tourism while another is 12,
5(appeal)*2(double)*2(Computer)=20? so you don't have the Cristo Render? If having one, the tourism output will be 40?

One just got ones spade and shovel and made a beach. It was a breathtaking (4) beach and appears to just provide 4 tourism.
It is the national park that is doubled and appears not to be the sandy beaches (at least not English ones)

 

[myclan]

One just got ones spade and shovel and made a beach. It was a breathtaking (4) beach and appears to just provide 4 tourism.
It is the national park that is doubled and appears not to be the sandy beaches (at least not English ones)
View attachment 459437

So it means that seaside resort, just like the national park, generates a tourism=appeal of the tile?
So actually Cristo Render doubles it and then Computer further doubles it, resulting in generating a tourism=4 times of the appeal of the tile.
Thanks for confirmation.

 

[Victoria]

So it means that seaside resort, just like the national park, generates a tourism=appeal of the tile?

yes, silly me, national parks do not double.
just was testing a bit more on seaside resorts and OMG I had fun.

I had run out of places to settle that had charming shores so started building entertainment centers, theatres and just planting trees to up the appeal... got lots more resorts that way... then won before I could do much more

 

[myclan]

yes, silly me, national parks do not double.
just was testing a bit more on seaside resorts and OMG I had fun.

I had run out of places to settle that had charming shores so started building entertainment centers, theatres and just planting trees to up the appeal... got lots more resorts that way... then won before I could do much more

The best strategy of Teddy is find a Hawaii to settle new city in later era. All you need for the city is a Harbor+Commecial Hub+Theater(Film studio of course)+neighbourhood(just for more population, high production), then plant trees everywhere except where a seaside resort can be built. Use your inland tile to build a national park to further increase the appeal of the city. I have had a city with 8+ seaside resort and the average appeal is 8~9(with Eiffel Tower though). Even if you are not pursuiting for culture victory, the gold it provides is just amazing.

 

[Victoria]

The best strategy of Teddy

Be careful with that word best. Teddies strat to me would be more complex than this and must play to his strengths. A great island and a great idea.
... are you sure national parks increase appeal... I thought they increased amenities.