North Vietnamese Infantry

[Kramerman]

Interseting that I'd be on the topic of Cuba so late at night, 'cause I just finished watching a movie based in Cuba probably about 100 years ago. Original Sin is the name, has Angelina Jolie and Antonio Banderas. Good movie. The racey love sceens didnt hurt . Anyway, as portrayed in the movie Cuba seemed really cool back in the day, like a giant resort complete with fine hotels, resteraunts, theatres, and bordellos.

Sorry I had to reply to the comment about cuban cigars.....

Though their value would drop dramatically, they would become purchased on a much larger scale. And any good markerter would be able to get the cigars to keep their prestige, though your right, it would never be the same. It would kinda be like french wine. "wow is that genuine French wine, ooh lala."
When Frernch wine is really no different then Nappa valley wine.
"wow, a cuban cigar!" But the satement I made in the first place was ment to be a half joke, I dont know if you got it. pretty stupid really....

Kman

P.S.

Make money, not war.

I'd like to add to this quote.
"make money not war, but be prepared for war against those who want to take your money"
:tank:

 

[Kramerman]

Secondly, Only in combination the the United States has Castro stolen 50 years of history. If the US lifted the trade embargo tomorrow, Cuba would be capitalist in 3 years. Even Castro could not stop his peoples desire to make money. He is an old man now. He can only continue to hate America for the multiple attempts at his life.

Yes Cuba may very well be capitolist in a few years if we lifted the embargo....but, the big fat but, is tha Castro would remain in power. He would simply use taxes on hhis country's new found wealth to fund resaerch for weapons of mass destruction, or fund terrorism, or something to scare and potentually hurt the US. Because like you said, and I believe it, he is still bitter towards the US (and who wouldn't be, not to cover for the fact that he probably did desrve it). And he condolences he gave after Sep. 11, what a load of crap. I bet he was thrilled. The moral of the story is, if your going to sponser an assaination, make sure the damn target is assainated. Then if you screw up, dont make it 10 times worse with a Bay of Pigs invasion...

Kman
:tank:

 

[sween32]

The condolenses he gave, whether they were crap or not, was still a huge step towards the rebuilding of Cuba. Castro knows he's close to the end. He's going to want to be remembered, not dispised after his passing into hell. If he didn't send those condolenses, then would Carter give a speech infront of him and his country about becoming a democracy? Probably not.

As evil as Castro is, Canada IS right... the way America treats Cuba is no way to treat such close neighbors. Why don't we treat communist China the same way? I'll tell you why, because they're the only country in the world who could completely kick our ass and have us speaking their language. So, we have to be a bully to the small country who has the potential to be a very helpful and a main trade.

Castro knows what is going to happen after he dies. He's not stupid. As much devastation as he's given, he loves his country and was saving it from becoming the next Las Vegas. Then, he got greedy and power hungry. Now that he's near the end, he has some hard decisions to make. How can he regain the popularity he once had to have a good name in history through the eyes of his people (it's too late for world likability), and still stay in the complete control he's fought for and craves so much?

 

[Kramerman]

Why don't we treat communist China the same way? I'll tell you why, because they're the only country in the world who could completely kick our ass and have us speaking their language

I disagree, China has a very, very large army, much larger than ours. But they are so poorly equiped and trained compared to ours, and with the supplement of our massive Navy (their airforce is also larger, but thay use planes that have been obsolete since the end of the Vietnam era) I must say in a conventional war, the USA owns. But I agree that we are definately more scared of China then Cuba, but the difference in how we treat them probably has much to do with their difference in government and China has begun many changes towrds a limited (very limited) capitolist investment, according to a PBS series I've been watching.

he loves his country and was saving it from becoming the next Las Vegas

What's wrong with Las Vegas?

make money not war, but be prepared for war against those who want to take your money

I like this quote.

Kman
:tank:

 

[sween32]

Originally posted by Kramerman


I disagree, China has a very, very large army, much larger than ours. But they are so poorly equiped and trained compared to ours, and with the supplement of our massive Navy (their airforce is also larger, but thay use planes that have been obsolete since the end of the Vietnam era) I must say in a conventional war, the USA owns. But I agree that we are definately more scared of China then Cuba, but the difference in how we treat them probably has much to do with their difference in government and China has begun many changes towrds a limited (very limited) capitolist investment, according to a PBS series I've been watching.

The main reason why China has a huge advantage over America is not because of equipment and technology. It's because of their people. America, as much as people may deny it, is an Athiest country. There's no way somebody will sacrafice their lives or crash their plane just to kill a few of the enemy. No way in hell. China is very noble and loyal towards their country and religions. How do you stop an enemy who outnumbers you, and every one of them willing to kill themselves for their greater good? In smaller wars, they probably wouldn't be so willing. But in a war against America, there would be no question what they would have to sacrafice. I firmly believe that US-China relations are the most important in the world right now. Terrible things that you couldn't imagine would happen to both countries. It also depends on who joins who's side. Even Cuba itself would be a powerful ally for America, and a big danger if they joined China. If that war didn't end up in the destruction of man-kind, then civilization itself would take a huge blow.

Originally posted by Kramerman

What's wrong with Las Vegas?

The beauty of Cuba's land would be destroyed by now if this happened.

 

[Kramerman]

The beauty of Cuba's land would be destroyed by now if this happened.

I believe you can have commercial development and protect natrual wonders at the same time. The commerce would just benifit from having beautiful beaches to attract tourists, kind of like Cancun in Mexico. Developement of Cuba would only make its natual beauty more accessible to the world. Any development at all would make it 9 times more beautiful than it is now with its sprawling slums and murals of Castro on their dilapidated structures, that stretchout across the country. I find modern architecture can be just absolutely gorgeous when combined with natrual elements. I mean, take las vegas. It was a backwash desret town with not a one thing beautiful in its name. Now its covered in lights, drawing more tourists than most any other cities (I only know that New York has the most tourists annually) out to a freaking desert. To me, the one thing less exciting and attractive than a desert is a pile of horse sh**. Thats just my opinion though. If I ruled the world, I'd make Cuba a lavish Carribean resort island with a flourishing economy based on exporting tobacco(though i hate the stuff) , coffee, sugar, and tourism drawn by its inhanced beauty.

China has no religion. It is a nation of athiests in order to more easily control the masses. With no religion, most Chinese have no hope and are easily manipulated with propoganda. And that is why they would die for china, not the reason that you were saying, but it matters not. But follow my logic. 1 chinese man blows himself up and kills 5 americans. ok. 1 American throws a frag into a group of chinese and kills 3. then lives to do it again to kill another 2. then lives to kill 9 more with a state of the art m-4 carbine. then he blows up a tank with a 5 lb, plastic, portable LAW anti tank missile. Then, when out of ammo, he puts on his bayonette and skillfully slays 5 more before being overwhelmed and finally dieying a glorious daeth. meanwhile Apach gunships, a-10 warthogs, and f-15s fly cover for several divisions of nearly invincable M1-A1 Abrahms main battle tanks. f-16s and f-22s destroy their airforce, and their navy is sunk by Aegis cruisers and Supercarriers. when things look desperate, they fire their 2 and a half dozen nukes capable of reaching the continental US. half of them fail and detonate over the ocean while most of the others fall way off target into the coutry side. meanwhile we pull back our troops, and rain down 100s of high yeild nukes that hit right on target in order to back up our words of total destruction if anybody ever dares to fire nuclear weapons at the US.
Thats the scenario Ive calculated after doing much research throught the last few years - kind of a wierd hobby. But it doesnt matter, US China relations, even at their lowest points, have never gotten anywhere near war since the Korean conflict in the early1950s

Kman
:tank:
P.S. the vast majority of americans are not athiests, they believe in a God or Gods, they are just hipocrites and don't follow any of the rules of their religion, such as no premarital sex and such. There are few true athiests who flat out say, they dont believe in any God as humanity knows. But no true athiest flat out says there is no God. for there is no more evidence disproving the existance of a supreme being than there is proving. Good athiests just reject the God and Gods spoken about in the new testament, old, koran, and various other faiths. Funny how so much death is brought by those with religion, and how little is brought by those wothout.

Damn! I hit 3 biggies in one night! What are the odds. Goodnight all, Ive spent to long writing, hopefully i wont do this again for a long time.

 

[sween32]

Originally posted by Kramerman
China has no religion.

Duh! Stupid sween. Must have had a brain fart.

The vast majority of americans are not athiests, they believe in a God or Gods, they are just hipocrites and don't follow any of the rules of their religion, such as no premarital sex and such.

Exactly. We don't practice our religion until we're in our death bed dying of cancer.

if nukes were used in a war between China and America, which most likely they would be involved but maybe not used, it would be the near end of civilization. Total chaos. Nukes would be aimed and used everywhere by every country in the world. Even if the war between America and China ended, some countries could not be stopped once they've begun. It would keep going until our societies were set back to ancient times, and then the majority of us would die of cancer.

But I'm not seeing it with nukes. I'm talking about overall, everything. Out of any country in the world, China is the country America has to fear the most. Simply put. You don't know how a war is going to end. Look at World War II. We got our ass handed to us, but eventually came out on top. All I'm saying is if any part of America could ever be under enemy occupancy in the near future or defeat it, it would be China.

Or Mexico... you'd never expect an attack from Mexico...

You have some very good points. I hope we never have to find out who's right.

 

[sween32]

I think the next war after the War on Terrorism will be the Massachusetts-Rhode Island War. I'm going to go get my pitch-fork and torch right now! There's no excuse to have a tiny state like that! It should be used to make a small state be bigger!

 

[Neomega]

Rhode Islanders would fight to the death to keep Taxachussettes from ever ruling them. But they have nothing to fear, the war on terrorism will only end if America loses, because we can never win. There is no objective, no enemy, and we don't have the equipment to fight suicide bombers because, well it's an exercise in futility. The only real solution is to stop bombing people. 100,000 Iraqis dead x 10 close family members who loved them = at least 1,000,000 who hate America... all for cheap gas. 1,000,000 preaching to other people who identify more with them than western nations = minions of poor, desperate people who hate America. Only a fraction of them have to be suicidally angry, to create thousands willing to sneak in and die. The worst is yet to come for America unless we change our ways, which I doubt. I am an atheist and I believe the chances of there being a supreme being like any of the major religions tout.... as being about 1:6,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000... and thats cuz thats as big as I can count. Its possible, but I doubt it is.

 

[Neomega]

"But it doesnt matter, US China relations, even at their lowest points, have never gotten anywhere near war since the Korean conflict in the early1950s"

Try Vietnam, where china walked out of the security vote, and the other four members voted for war while the ambassador was gone, and where hundreds of thousands of Chinese troops once again swarmed over the North Vietnamese border to help them fight.

 

[sween32]

Now that there is an entire team for Guerilla additions to Civ3, you can expect more of these kind of units. And, civilopedia's for the ones that already exist.

kemal69, Chief Propaganderist of the July 26th Coalition, has put together TWO civilopedias for the NVA Infantry. One is a general entry (much like the ones in Civ3) and the other is a historic entry which goes into their specialties which really cannot be implemented into the unit itself. Use them as you wish.

 

[PCHighway]

You see We were soldiers once? I thought it was pretty accurate, as far as the book goes. In fact I recommend it, it has a pretty boring beginning, but it get a hell of a lot better, fast. The casualties, or rather Deaths, in Vietnam were some 50.000, For the u.s, and 1.000.000 for the North Vietnamese. They earned their freedom. Any country that could put up with all that Tech is well worth forgiving. Also if you don’t want to see the movie because of Gibson, like me, do it anyway.

Or Mexico... you'd never expect an attack from Mexico...

Dude, your paranoid. As for a Chinese\American war, well Your talking about the two most solitary countries that exist. Neomega, makes a good point, both countries have fought each other, and both understand the hell Nuclear Missiles could bring better than any of us. No-One wants to start a war without a good reason, besides Bush. My fear is The ‘war on terrorism’, is rapidly turning into the next Cold War which Korea and Vietnam were part of, are we going to drag Iraq into this next cold war?

 

[ViceRoy]

How about Canada?

What comes to use of nukes...

As it's should be pointed out...
Nuclear weapons aren't really weapons in normal sense...
They are the ultimate destructive devices.
They are both genocidal and suicidal.
I think there are two perfect examples what would happen if someone will start really using them.

BTW everybody should see the movie:
Dr.Strangelove or Or: How I Learned To Stop Worrying
And Love The Bomb

That is one great movie (Peter Sellers and George C. Scott steal the show). Just think China instead of Soviet Union there. You get the laughs and the end...is just amazing.

What is more funny it was done right after the period of "Cuba missile crisis".

 

[sween32]

I am not paranoid... just a little suspicious... yeah...

Doctor Strangelove? Ok... I'll... have to check that one out...

 

[sween32]

if anybody wants to make an animation of this unit pulling out a grenade will it's running and blowing itself up, then go ahead. it could be very useful, since they did go on suicide missions

 

[Neomega]

Sapper cruise missiles ehh?

 

[Barret]

Great unit. Has anyone made civilopedia icons for it?

 

[GeneralTacticus]

Try Vietnam, where china walked out of the security vote, and the other four members voted for war while the ambassador was gone, and where hundreds of thousands of Chinese troops once again swarmed over the North Vietnamese border to help them fight.

Huh? The only time in recent history when China has invaded Vietnam was in1979, and they did that with the support of the US.

 

[Neomega]

China helped fund and Arm the cong. The war was hopeless because United states could bomb cambodia yes, but bombing China was out of the question. Therefore destroying the enemy's ability to fight was hopeless, therefore destroying the vietcongs will to fight was hopeless.

Arming North Veitnam by the chinese began as early as 1950, supplying arms to the Viet Minh to help fight Boa Dai, who was supported by the French, who were in turn subsidized by the Americans.

 

[GeneralTacticus]

I know that. You stated that 'hundreds of thousands of Chinese swarmed over the border to help them fight'.