Omnipotence - Mo' Like OmniSUCKance.

[Shinzen]

So, I just played a game as the Calabim specifically to get a Vampire Mage with all the promotions possible for magic to get that Fabled Omnipotence promotion.

I did so.

There he is in all his glory. Level 80, 1371 Exp.

Man Vampires are crazy overpowe....

What.

Every. Single Time. Miscast, Miscast, Miscast.

I Miscast Feed 5 times in a row.

I Miscast every spell in the spellbook, reloading in between with Random Seed on. Every time the same thing.

I open worldbuilder and removed the Master of Creation promotion (Never again.)

Miscast again with the promotion gone.

This is insane, he is LESS powerful now then he was when he was just a Master of Elements. I had Twincast and Shooting Star, I was firing 8 of those things 5 squares every turn. He was invincible. Now this.

This has to be a bug. It's too consistent. I tried this over thirty times. Reload, miscast. Every time. I think Omnipotent or Protector needs to remove the Miscast chance from Master of Creation. Hell, I'll never take Master of Creation again as is.

But yeah. That's my story. Never Take Omnipotence. Or, more specifically, never take Master of Creation.

 

[Evalis]

Miscast kills your casting for -2- turns?! I thought it just made the spell not work =( crummy. Yeah that's more of a penalty than a benefit then. 33% chance to miscast twice works out to even steven if you can twincast.. but.. if you lose casting for 2 turns it actually halves your casting ability. Actually it more than halves it.. probably cuts it down to 1/3. By the way.. nice xp.. holy monkeys

 

[Valkrionn]

Miscast kills your casting for -2- turns?! I thought it just made the spell not work =( crummy. Yeah that's more of a penalty than a benefit then. 33% chance to miscast twice works out to even steven if you can twincast.. but.. if you lose casting for 2 turns it actually halves your casting ability. Actually it more than halves it.. probably cuts it down to 1/3. By the way.. nice xp.. holy monkeys

When it was implemented, I didn't know it would kill casting. I assumed it would just cause the one spell to fail.

Wanting to change it, but really have no ideas for it atm.

 

[Shinzen]

I would literally never take the promotion as is.

Why not remove the miscast altogether? Why that would be on Creation is beyond me. Add something like a bonus to health in the owning empire or a boost to summon's strength from the "creation" aspect. That would be way better than crippling a caster.

 

[Valkrionn]

I would literally never take the promotion as is.

Why not remove the miscast altogether? Why that would be on Creation is beyond me. Add something like a bonus to health in the owning empire or a boost to summon's strength from the "creation" aspect. That would be way better than crippling a caster.

Creation allows for some of the most powerful magics, and allows for creating things from nothing (the act of giving birth actually falls under Creation, though Life takes over at that point). It is also unreliable, and occasionally fails in disastrous ways.

All of that comes from Magister. I tried to stick to the lore when designing promos for the new spheres.

 

[Shinzen]

Admirable, but this is unplayable

There must be something better than that.

 

[isthmus]

I suggest a 20% miscast rate, and no gaining of the miscast promotion - the spell just doesn't actually work rather than gimping your unit for a few turns.

 

[Valkrionn]

Admirable, but this is unplayable

There must be something better than that.

Like I said, I want to change it but have no ideas atm.

Suggest some that are in keeping with the lore, or stop complaining.

(Disclaimer: Not annoyed or anything, just saying. )

I suggest a 20% miscast rate, and no gaining of the miscast promotion - the spell just doesn't actually work rather than gimping your unit for a few turns.

IIRC, that can't be done. Miscast effect is global for all miscast spells; Removing it would buff all the others, like Puppets.

 

[isthmus]

IIRC, that can't be done. Miscast effect is global for all miscast spells; Removing it would buff all the others, like Puppets.

Ok, fair enough, back to the drawing board...
Is it worth reworking the master of creation effect itself? I don't know how creating something out of nothing relates to being able to twincast, albeit in a very shoddy manner.
I also think that "mastering" the sphere implies that such mishaps and disasterous failures that occur are either well contained or on a scale too trivial to take into account.
You could possibly have the spell create a new organic resource on a tile as long as it's 2 tiles from another organic resource (similar to the guild resource spreaders from orbis). Couple it with a stat boost to balance it out or something. How does this sound?

 

[Valkrionn]

Ok, fair enough, back to the drawing board...
Is it worth reworking the master of creation effect itself? I don't know how creating something out of nothing relates to being able to twincast, albeit in a very shoddy manner.
I also think that "mastering" the sphere implies that such mishaps and disasterous failures that occur are either well contained or on a scale too trivial to take into account.
You could possibly have the spell create a new organic resource on a tile as long as it's 2 tiles from another organic resource (similar to the guild resource spreaders from orbis). Couple it with a stat boost to balance it out or something. How does this sound?

Twincast really doesn't have anything to do with it, just a useful effect.

As for 'mastering' it... From what I've read, archmages would actually have more catastrophic failings as they'd be attempting stronger magics.

Not sure about creating new resources... Will think about it. If Xienwolf had his aspect system done I'd be using that.

 

[isthmus]

I wouldn't be surprised if an archmage would have a larger chance of causing a catastrophe, unfortunately this causes big problems for the omnipotent and it doesn't work on a gameplay scale to have archmages implode after spending ages working them up that sort of level. I was trying to rationalise an opposite approach really
I'm not entirely convinced by resource creating but its the best I can think of at this time of night, watching the election results whilst trying to finish work is tiring stuff

 

[Elwist]

could you have it have a chance of casting the wrong spell. It might not make quite as much sense as failing but it could be interesting.

 

[Valkrionn]

I wouldn't be surprised if an archmage would have a larger chance of causing a catastrophe, unfortunately this causes big problems for the omnipotent and it doesn't work on a gameplay scale to have archmages implode after spending ages working them up that sort of level. I was trying to rationalise an opposite approach really
I'm not entirely convinced by resource creating but its the best I can think of at this time of night, watching the election results whilst trying to finish work is tiring stuff

Right. Like I said, hadn't known of the extended miscast effect when I designed it.

I'd like some kind of drawback based on that, though....

could you have it have a chance of casting the wrong spell. It might not make quite as much sense as failing but it could be interesting.

That's Wonder. I'd like to avoid duplicating effects.

While at it, we need a better one for Ice Mastery as well.

 

[BiffQJ]

What about a chance to gain some type of fatigued promotion (maybe an uberfatigued)? "Wow, that spell worked, but I'm really tired now. I hope no one tries to attack me..."

 

[PPQ_Purple]

That is actually interesting. A promotion that decreases strength and movement by a certain factor. So he can still cast away but if something does come close all he gets to do is murder a wary tired, wary weak old man.

Although personally, I am against the idea that high level things like that having drawbacks. If anything at the time you have mastered a sphere you know almost all there is to know about it by definition.

 

[Evalis]

+1 Ice damage seems pretty good to me. But hum.. how about when casting the spell that creation gives you, it has a chance (10-20%) to minus the city population by 2 or destroy a random building (not wonders or nationals though). Mastering the sphere provides you with a +15% heal rate to all adjacent tiles.

 

[Torugu]

Just thought I could throw in a few ideas:

What about giving it a chance to deal damage to the caster and/or have it scorch the plot the caster is on?

I don't think that I need to explain why messing up a spell might hurt a bit and the scorching (or possibly turning the tile strait into wasteland) could be understood as the spell reversing creation, thereby killing (or, more precisely, undoing) every life in the area.
This would also depict how it is worse to cause a magical catastrophe right next to your capital than next to your enemy's.

Alternatively you could spawn some powerful, mutated barbarians next to the caster, think of it as a "monster" that has been created by the misuse of creation mana.

 

[Valkrionn]

What about a chance to gain some type of fatigued promotion (maybe an uberfatigued)? "Wow, that spell worked, but I'm really tired now. I hope no one tries to attack me..."

Tired is not the same as a spell blowing up in your face... That's honestly more fitting of Ice.

That is actually interesting. A promotion that decreases strength and movement by a certain factor. So he can still cast away but if something does come close all he gets to do is murder a wary tired, wary weak old man.

Although personally, I am against the idea that high level things like that having drawbacks. If anything at the time you have mastered a sphere you know almost all there is to know about it by definition.

The initial mastery promos are free, so they can't be TOO good. I want it to be a good thing, but I also want it to represent the sphere.

+1 Ice damage seems pretty good to me. But hum.. how about when casting the spell that creation gives you, it has a chance (10-20%) to minus the city population by 2 or destroy a random building (not wonders or nationals though). Mastering the sphere provides you with a +15% heal rate to all adjacent tiles.

Healing is Life, not Creation.

Just thought I could throw in a few ideas:

What about giving it a chance to deal damage to the caster and/or have it scorch the plot the caster is on?

I don't think that I need to explain why messing up a spell might hurt a bit and the scorching (or possibly turning the tile strait into wasteland) could be understood as the spell reversing creation, thereby killing (or, more precisely, undoing) every life in the area.
This would also depict how it is worse to cause a magical catastrophe right next to your capital than next to your enemy's.

Alternatively you could spawn some powerful, mutated barbarians next to the caster, think of it as a "monster" that has been created by the misuse of creation mana.

Hmm. Temporary Wasteland wouldn't be a bad idea. Will think about it.

 

[Shinzen]

I like the Temporary wasteland idea. It's good, and considering how long wasteland takes to revert it could be terrible.

I'd say also have a chance of destroying improvements on a tile, or in a city killing some of the population. Maybe creating a Haunted Land.

The trick of course is balancing it for all races. D'tesh would LOVE a free Haunted land or Wasteland. Not so much the City loss though, that hurts everyone. Maybe it ends up drawing energy from a nearby city and drains some of the pop?

 

[Shinzen]

Then again, it's really only the Calabim that have a chance to get an Omnipotent mage Almost 1400 exp...