Over moderating

[Stapel]

I have been thinking about a post like this for a while. I know our beloved CFC forum has suffered some nasty behaviour, but It is my opinion that some reaction are overdone.

Recently I was slightly annoyed by these:

My first post:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?postid=709696#post709696

Originally posted by gonzo_for_civ
As a mod I saw far worst stapel, such as someone posting lesbian porn while asking a question because they "thought it would be a cool pic to post"........they didn't last long.

Yours just tells us that you are destroying the company who made the game this site owes most of it's traffic to, nothing big

My answer to that: Uhmmm, no, that is not the case imho. I was planning to buy the game, but just needed to know some stuff. At the time I was indeed playing a illegal copy. I was unpatched, thus unsatisfied, but also impressed by the game and wanted to purchase it! As I have some experience with spending money on louzy sofftware, I just wanted to be sure.....

 

[Stapel]

What bothers me:

If only there would have been a reaction like: Hi Stapel, welcome to this forum. We won't help you, unless you buy the game. Once you do, you will find Firaxis has some decent patches!

And, before buying, be sure you purchase the US-version iso the UK one, as you will be patched up sooner.

That would have helped I guess....

 

[Stapel]

Also, I wrote quite a long post in the "US-anthem boo-ed by French in stadium" thread.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=56694

While submitting, the thread was closed. The thread could be explained as trolling, but was imho, just a good reaction, including debating, on an actual topic: behavior in football stadiums. My reply was lost ....

My point: CFC needs to be less strict!

 

[Turner]

While I feel your pain, Stapel, I think it is just fine has it is. Why? Because trolling isn't allowed here, we don't have thread upon thread of flamming, trolling, spam, etc. Sure, some gets through, that's going to be true anyway. But TF and Co have done a great job keeping this place civil. Over eager? Sure. Over moderated? Probably. Worth it? Definately.

As with any complex society, and yes I do believe we are a society here, there must be give and take. And if i have to give up some of my free speach and hvae to watch myself, fine. I'll deal with that. There have been plenty of threads that have been pretty hot, and they seemed to do okay. And this is because we all knew if we got too out of hand the thread would have been closed down.

Have you ever read the forums at battle.net? I used to, until it became a flame-fest. Maybe a year or so ago I stopped reading them. Same for the IMDB forums, they can get pretty flame-y there, too.

So I guess it's all a matter of what you're willing to give up.

I can sympathize with you re: thread closure. There have been a bunch of threads I've wanted to respond to but couldn't because they were closed. Granted, I've never had a thread close on my while posting too it.

I can also understand your reluctance to buy a new game w/o trying it first. I don't buy a game generally until it's rather old. Last game I bought: 'Star Trek Action Pack', consiting of Elite Force, Elite Force EP, Armada, and Armada 2. These titles have been out a long time, and I waited on buying them. Two reasons: One, I got a good deal on them ($20 for all four new, patched,) and two; $40 is a lot of money to spend on a game. The last new release I bought was PTW, and the next one will probably be C3C. I don't plan on spending a bunch of buckage on games. . . So I understand where you're coming from in your post. But look at all the posts we get in Civ3:GD that are closed because of 'illegal activities.' To be honest, if it wasn't for the point I made three paragraphs up, it would be a lot worse.

The point I'm trying to make is that CFC is a great place to be because of moderation. (and yes, I do believe in moderation in all things - including moderation.) But allow a little bit of anarchy, a little bit of lawlessness, and this place would sink fast into a quagmire of flaming, abuse, and priacy. Okay, I'm exaggerating, but you understand.

So I'll deal with the moderation. For the most part, I don't have to control myself too much, as long as I stay away from the Faith & Evolution topics. . .

 

[col]

The moderators are responsible to Thunderfall. We enforce the guidelines that he wishes to have for his site.

If you have issues about particular decisions then PM the moderator and find out why a decision was taken. If you are still unsatisfied then PM TF himself.

Thunderfall has made it very clear that there is a ZERO piracy tolerance policy throughout CFC.

 

[Stapel]

Maybe you are right Turner. It is just my experience. In general all is fine!

Sometimes I get the impression that fear for a flame fest is based on just anxiety. I have had this feeling from the moment I got here first and it is still there.
Just my two grants (like to think big )

 

[Turner]

Look at it this way. . .if you really wanna know the boundries, just say whatever until someone tells you to stop. Keep in mind too that different moderators will have different styles. I wonder how many of our mods in OT had decided to let something pass, only to have another moderator moderate it.

Of course, this won't make you too popular with the mods. . . .

 

[Stapel]

Originally posted by col
The moderators are responsible to Thunderfall. We enforce the guidelines that he wishes to have for his site.

If you have issues about particular decisions then PM the moderator and find out why a decision was taken. If you are still unsatisfied then PM TF himself.

Thunderfall has made it very clear that there is a ZERO piracy tolerance policy throughout CFC.

By no means do I have a problem with a special issue. I was just adding my view on the rules / guidelines and their enforcing in general. Or at least trying to...

About the piracy: I fully agree with the zero tolerance. I have been a software sales rep for 5 years now, and last 1.5 years I am also a shareholder. So I do understand the importance of it!

I just think asking for the quality of a product before buying is a bit different than asking for a no-cd patch.

Edit: in response to Turner's polularity to the Mods concern:

You all do a great job! I really think so! But I also am that arrogant to think I should give advice to mr. Prefect.

To make things up again, I will do a dance:
[dance]

 

[SunTzu]

piracy's bad
Here's a thing about moderators, they are given power by TF to moderate, there's really no orders given to them. Moderator's mod what they want and if someone complains about it to TF, then the all powerful moderator action could be reversed. So don't bother trying to guess what each mod will allow, cause mods allowance differs with their mood.
Btw, i'm surprised this hasn't been closed since this thread is questioning the moderators "power"

 

[Stapel]

Originally posted by SunTzu
Btw, i'm surprised this hasn't been closed since this thread is questioning the moderators "power"

It is not. Just my view. Meant to contribute to this forum.

What surprises me, is that I haven't been called naive yet .

 

[Eklektikos]

Stapel, you're naive.

Happy now?

 

[Knight-Dragon]

Moderating is less of a 'power' issue (except for some people I guess) than a responsibility issue, for me. It's a lot harder than you think, if you want to be a good moderator that is. And fr personal exp, it's a heavy responsibility.

In my case, I'm still in the learning phase, so you might have to bear with me for a little.

Plus there're lots of cloak-and-dagger stuff going around (which are reallly unappreciated), it really adds up to less time to do my normal postings...

 

[Ohwell]

Cloak-and-dagger?

 

[Zwelgje]

I think that people need to understand that when they come to a forum with thousands of members there have been things happening in the past.

The examples you give: trolling, talking piracy are great examples of things that may have gone wrong in the past and thus the administrator and the mods have made the choice to be more firm on these issues.

I think that is exactly what has happened here at CFC.
We've had our fair share of trolls and we've had our fair share of people who don't want to spend money on a game but still feel they can talk the game into the dirt. TF and the mods decided they had seen enough and made the rules in such a way this will remain a forum we can all enjoy.

Thus I have no problems whatsoever with the modding here at CFC.

 

[gonzo_for_civ]

All right! My 3rd post after coming back has already been a source of complaint, I guess I just have a knack for that

@Stapel, if you had read the rules, you would've known piracy is intolerable here, and as for the thread that could've been described as trolling, well you've said it, it was trolling, so I'd just let dead dogs lie. Complaining about moderation has never helped

 

[Duke of Marlbrough]

There is a zero tolerance for piracy. Zero, none.

Are you more concerned that the time you spent on your reply was lost or that the thread was closed? Perhaps the very idea that your reply was that important to you is an indicator that that thread was getting out of hand. But, yes, threads are closed in attempts to avoid issues. We would rather close a thread than to let it keep going and have to ban posters after it is all done with.

 

[addiv]

Maybe there should be a special ranting forum on CFC. An unmoderated forum where you can say whatever you want (except seriously offending other users). I've seen this kind of subforum on other forums, and it works quite well.

But it's not really necessary in my opinion. These forums are possibly over moderated yes, but on the other hand it makes this forum the most civilized and best quality forum I've seen.

 

[CurtSibling]

I think the level of moderation is just fine...
The mods are subdued but hardcore when needs be...

What else do we need?

 

[Padma]

Originally posted by addiv
Maybe there should be a special ranting forum on CFC. An unmoderated forum where you can say whatever you want (except seriously offending other users). I've seen this kind of subforum on other forums, and it works quite well.

It was tried, a couple years ago. It may not have been a *disaster*, but it was shut down; terminated with extreme prejudice. It's even gone from the archives, now. Ask some of the long-time members about the "Peanut Gallery". They'll know.

On the topic at hand, I *may* be guilty of "overmoderation", but I would rather shut down a problem before it gets out of hand, than wait, & have to issue bans, leave hard feelings, etc.

 

[Lefty Scaevola]

This site has the strictest rules on trolling, flaming, other inflamatory posting, off topic, spam/advertising, and spam/unserious posting of any game forums I a familiar with. That is the the way TF wants it here. I am a troll, and flamer, and a jokester in serious threads, at other sites where that is OK. I have no problem with owners deciding what their standards are, its their nickle, or with myself trying to comply with them. Everyone can seek out the cyber environemnts that please them, it is a great big open interent, with something for everyone, and there is no possibility AT ALL of TF pleasing every civ gamer that comes by here.