It is 1This seems to be a common sentiment, but one I don't share. 4in all cities and 6
2 per building, not 2.That's why I suggested the removal of the culture instead. the +2 faith while still maintaining +1 science and +1 culture allows for it to be a powerful founding belief. +1 faith would make it kind of pointless as you'd be forced (without natural wonders, religious UC's, or ancient runes) to build shrines first anyways if you wanted to found, nullifying the point of the pantheon in making the council your first-build multi-purpose building.
As you said, culture is king. That's why by removing the single culture from ancestor worship would make it a have a sacrifice in early culture to use, while still being powerful. The issue with ancestor worship is that it provides the best benefits of the monument, shrine, and council for a third of the price of all three combined, in a single building. It also lets you get four culture per city within potentially two buildings which is just ludicrously good, far too good for a pantheon with so much less investment or circumstantial cost compared to so many other pantheons. With my proposed culture nerf it would at least require some form of sacrifice while still being a very powerful, low investment pantheon.
In hindsight I think it ought to have +3 faith/+1 culture, I think that would solve your issue here in combination with the scaler. This way you at least get some early culture and science compared to building shrine first, while being able to delay shrine till 3rd so your culture does not fall behind. So in other words, still very useful early yields without such insane amounts of easy early culture.
Do Samurai not improve sea resources in BNW?
Not like what they are proposing, no. They want to turn fishing boats into a multi-turn build done by workers like land improvements; something we don’t have art or animations for, aside from the coding. Workers seem to handle non-resource sea improvements okay, but aren’t sea resources are handled differently?
I cannot count the number of times I've tried to make Earth Mother work. If you've got mining luxuries it looks like it'd be great. Mines are available quickly and are great improvements, culture is love, it buffs the first building every city is going to build, sounds good to me! And then in practice it's just...fine, at best, I guess?
on mining resources and 1 on them once they're improved with mines?
, where if you got a religion you were happy, anything else was just a cherry on top. Now pantheons are primarily a source of other yields, especially .
I think there are several reasons for this:Its interesting that people view God of War and Commerce so negatively because those use to be solid, popular choices. I think what has changed is pantheons went from being primarily a source of
Its interesting that people view God of War and Commerce so negatively because those use to be solid, popular choices. I think what has changed is pantheons went from being primarily a source of
This one in particular. It used to be that the maximum number of religions in a standard map size, 8-civ game, was four (Byzantium aside). Now that it is at 5, a human player can go for a less faith intensive pantheon and still found comfortably. This should be even easier now that the handicap procs no longer grant production to the AI; their shrines should take longer to set up.
production modifier.I do think map script is a big factor. For example, my communitas_79 maps love to make beautiful klondikes, so stars is just a godly pantheon.
I'd support reverting God of War to 300%.I'm curious now if reducing the number of religions back to 4 would bring back the pantheons that don't grant culture as solid options.
On a note, one patch in 2018 reduced the faith output of God of War from 300% of the killed unit's CS to 200%. As a compensation, the pantheon gained the +10% unit
I think there's room for pantheons to be a 'plan B', and expanse can do that fairly well. I've used it a lot with tradition, you get a lot more yields with the cheaper border growth. Its viable with progress or authority too, its a decent at generating faith without much commitment, especially if you have culture from somewhere (like a UI). Of course its much worse than 2 culture to all councils though.
this is just not my experience. I tried it with Authority recently where I even had the big culture NW in my 2nd city, so in theory should have had great border growth. Still couldn't found with it (all founding by Turn 106). Not saying its unfoundable, but I do feel like it needs solid commitment to make it work, like the faith UW, or shrine first play, kind of thing. With tradition, sure its easy to found with the faster borders and the +3 faith (most pantheons are a lot easier to found with on tradition because of that), but I still question why go for it over other better pantheons.
With tradition it gives like double the yields if not more. It isn't working just because of the 3 faith, you could remove that and still get there. Sovereignty's border reduction is crazy. Later on a tradition capital will grow borders every single turn, this is just a flat 20 faith per turn.
yes I think some of these are very influenced by map script, as in my games Open Sky is extremely niche. Rarely ever looks like a good pick. While Stars and Sky is almost always top tier for tundra starts.
It's funny, I actually like this as the primary way of evaluating pantheons. I think it's somewhat consistent that a pantheon affects you most (and feels the most meaningful) when it alters your build order. Going Something Else first over Monument, or Something Else second over Shrine. So when you evaluate any of the yields of a particular pantheon, you can value it based on the building-equivalent it gives you for free. For terrain that still works out, it's just a building you don't need to build that gives you yields: hammers and faith.
This has already been done, except it's 2Goddess of the Hunt:
1
Logic: If you have a lot of camps you want to build the lodge, this is a simple change to accomodate the newly added building.
to lodges, not 1 to lodges.
for every 2 featureless flat tiles worked. +1 to Pastures
from this pantheon. Its just ridiculous, who cares if jungle is somewhat weak in food or hammers, while the other guy spends hundreds of hammers on libraries you just enjoy already having the science. Way too much science and it gives culture too. I think the design is off too, the market bonus makes little sense here. It also contributes a lot to the whole 'never chop/improve bananas' thing. It requires a lot of micromanaging as 1 forest 1 jungle won't give the bonus.
in a city.
