PBEM in 3.19

[AlanH]

UPDATE

On 7 Dec 2009, at 18:30, support@aspyr.com wrote:

Hello,

We are not receiving any other support requests for this issue.
Does the problem you are describing make cross platform play impossible?

Thanks for contacting Aspyr Media.

I am surprised you have no other players reporting this issue. At least one other user claims to have raised a ticket for PBEM, and has reported that his ticket was closed without comment, like mine. See posts 10 and 13 in this thread in the CivFanatics forum: <http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=341652>.

It makes cross-platform play with a locked assets game impossible. If you don't lock the assets then there is nothing to stop a competitor in the game using a mod that changes game rules to his/her advantage. So this makes cross-platform play impractical outside a trusted community.

Regards

Alan

Please make sure you report issues to Aspyr. If they don't know about them they can't fix them. I'm not a player, so I am not even reporting first-hand experience.

 

[Copterman]

Put in my ticket last night.

What do you mean you're "not a player."

 

[AlanH]

What do you mean you're "not a player."

I mean exactly that. I used to play Civ3, I try to support Mac users here and in the Civ3 forum, and I help to run the GOTM series of competitions. I own every version of Civ3 and Civ4 for Mac and Windows so that I can help. But I don't play Civ4.

UPDATE

On 8 Dec 2009, at 18:31, support@aspyr.com wrote:

Hello,

And this is something that you have a considerable number of people expressing concern about?
You have actually seen instances of the Mac community using mods to manipulate multi-player games?
If so, what mods? And how does one apply these mods to the Mac version of the game?


Thanks for contacting Aspyr Media.

Mods can be applied to the Mac version of the game simply by adding them to one of the two Mods folders installed by the software. A single XML file can be used to change the attributes of a unit type, a building, or a Civ. Players cannot use this to manipulate results in well-managed multiplayer games, because those games have the assets locked. A Mac player will simply not be able to join in such a game because the Windows versions of the game believe they are playing with non-standard sottware.

It was my understanding that, up until the release of version 3.19, you were supporting the major features of Civ4 and its expansions, including locked-assets cross-platform play. If this is no longer the case, and you do not intend to do anything about it, then please just say so, rather than closing my tickets with no comment or explanation.

Regards

Alan

AND ...

On 8 Dec 2009, at 22:02, support@aspyr.com wrote:

Hello,

We do not support the use of mods in any way, shape or form with any of our games. We do not test them, therefor we cannot support any adverse effects of the application of mods. If a Mac player who has used mods (any mods) and therefore cannot connect to another multiplayer game because the addition of these, this is not we do not support.

Thanks for contacting Aspyr Media.

I absolutely, explicitly told you in my original ticket that my testing for this compatibility issue was done without any mods. The whole point of the Locked Assets feature is to prevent the use of mods in a multiplayer game.

Let's try this one more time,.

1. Player #1 starts a PBEM game using a plain, unmodded copy of Civ4 BtS version 3.19. He locks the assets when he starts the game, which causes the game software to calculate a checksum across various key files and save the result in the saved game file.

2. If any of the PBEM competitors try to use a mod to gain an unfair advantage, then their game software will calculate a different checksum value, and will refuse to load the saved game. This protects the players against cheats, and is a basic capability of the Civ4 family of products.

3. Player #1 plays his first turn and passes the saved game to Player #2.

4. Player #2 is also using a plain, unmodded copy of Civ4 BtS version 3.19 and attempts to load the saved game to play his turn. This ought to work, as both players are using plain, unmodified copies of BtS version 3.19.

There are now three possible combinations of Mac and WIndows software to consider:

5. If Player #1 and Player #2 are both running Windows software from Firaxis, then the checksums will agree and the save will load.

6. If Player #1 and Player #2 are both running Mac software from Aspyr, then the checksums will agree and the save will load

7. If one of them is running Mac software from Aspyr and the other is running Windows software from Firaxis then Player #2's software calculates a checksum that disagrees with the one saved in Player #1's saved game file, and Player #2's software will NOT load the saved game file.

This problem only exists with BtS version 3.19. If the players use any version of Civ4 older than BtS version 3.19, then the save will load OK in Step #7.

Regards

Alan

I don't know if I can keep up this level of patience in the face of blind obstinacy/stupidity.

 

[dr_s]

Alan, do you have a ticket number that I can reference when I file a bug report?

 

[AlanH]

My original ticket was:

[aspyr #ASU-80404-370]: BtS 3.19 will not read Windows Locked Assets files

The latest one was:

[aspyr #LBZ-80061-252]: BtS 3.19 Cross-platform incompatibility

Today, I have finally received a relevant response to my messages:

We have tested this out and have only NOT been able to play a PBEM game when you set the game up with a password. This happens with or without the locked assets option enabled.
All other MP aspects of the game work fine.
Again, the only time we get a failure in PBEM games is if the user created a password for the game. When we do not create a password, we are able to play PBEM without issue. So as far as we can tell, the issue has more to do with a password being created than turning on or off the locked modified assets option. We were able to play PBEM games with or without the "Lock Modified Assets" option turned on.

The tool tip for "Lock Modified Assets" actually says:
"Sets a random admin passwords so that debug tools cannot be used, and he game assets cannot be modified. Only for Single Player games" (see attached screenshot).
It actually does NOT create a random password. The functionality (as far as we can tell) is set up to merely warn the player that some files differ from their opponents. This does not prevent you from playing the game.

When we played a LAN game we did get the warning tag that some files were different between the Mac and the PC even when none of the files were modified. Even when we got this message, we were still able to play the game. Receiving this message in any instance did not prevent us from continuing to play the game.

I recommend not creating a password for PBEM games or not using this option at all since it doesn't seem to make a difference in game.
The files are flagged as different even if no files have been added or modified.

You guys may want to take this onwards, as I don't know what problems the above restrictions will cause in a real multiplayer situation.

 

[Copterman]

Here's their response to me.

Hello,

Thank you for your patience.

It appears that there are conflict problems with the patch and the Play by Email. We are looking into this issue and hopefully will have a work around for you soon.

Again, thank you for your patience.

Looks promising!

 

[thetattoo]

Received the same response from Aspyr this morning. At least there appears to be some movement.

Hello,

Thank you for your patience.

It appears that there are conflict problems with the patch and the Play by Email. We are looking into this issue and hopefully will have a work around for you soon.

Again, thank you for your patience.