Please make a generic unit (Not unique unit) that counters archers.

[Xanikk999]

Ive been wondering why there wasnt a generic unit that gets bonuses against archers ever since i got the hang of this game.

I mean axemen and macemen counter other infantry. Spears counter cavalry.

Cavalry can counter archers. But not when they are fortified on a forested hill usually. We need a unit that gets a bonus against them.

I think firaxis should make a generic unit that counters archers. Maybe you could call it a slinger? In age of empires slingers countered archers. I think this game should have something like that also.

Because as it stands only certain unique units get bonuses against archers without the cover promotion.

 

[ULTIMATEGP]

I agree. I was playing a game as Bismark and I was fighting Cyrus. I would attack him with stacks of swordmen. When I attacked it would take 3 swordmen to kill a single archer. In fact I couden't really fight them until I got knights. Which is all the way in the Middle Ages.

 

[Nooble]

Swordsmans could easily take on archers....also axemans....

 

[S.ilver]

If the archers are fortified on a forested hill, ignore them and sack the countryside. Archers can hold stuff well, but good luck attacking invaders with them. You basically have to wait for the enemy to come to you.

If they're hanging out in a city, its a simple matter of city raider units backed up with some catapults.

 

[Inqvisitor]

Archer units already tend to be weak for their time periods. The only time they do tend to have any chance of winning is when fortified in a city (or to a lesser extent, a hill). Swordsman have base strength of 6, axemen 5. With proper promotions its easy to take down archers with their measly 3 strength. Same thing with longbowmen. A specific anti-archer unit seems unnecessary.

 

[ULTIMATEGP]

If the archers are fortified on a forested hill, ignore them and sack the countryside. Archers can hold stuff well, but good luck attacking invaders with them. You basically have to wait for the enemy to come to you.

If they're hanging out in a city, its a simple matter of city raider units backed up with some catapults.

Catapults don't come for a while after archers are usable.

 

[S.ilver]

City raider units are still more than enough to do the job. If they insist on holeing in with tonnes of archers, again ignore them and pillage. Their economy will collapse. If your objective was to take the city, you should've done your homework before choosing your target.

 

[Norseman2]

I'm with the pillaging. Don't bother trying to take a town fortified with a large number of archers, just pillage everything in sight, and move on. Keep checking in on them to make sure they don't rebuild and come after you. As soon as you get catapults, go back to the town and raze it unless you want a lot of unimproved land to waste time with.

If it's the only enemy town remaining, or one of few, surround it/them with units. The workers will be unable to work, so all they will have is the citizen specialists with their 1 production (or other specialists if its a somewhat advanced city). Without food, the city will starve until its down to what little food the city itself can produce, which will support only 1 default unit on the city, and 1 specialist, and somewhere between 1 or 2 production per turn depending on what the city is built on. After a few years, you should have the technology to come back and raze the city, or capture it if you really really need it for something.

 

[Brighteye]

I think they should swap the abilities of swordsmen and axemen. Swordsmen were good against other infantry in the field, but when attacking a town what you want are big shock troops with heavy weapons: axemen!
Then there'd be a period in which city raiding units tried to take down cities and there'd be a real incentive to learn to ride horses to take out these raiders outside the cities or discover iron working, build swords and kill them with better infantry. It'd add something to the game, and make the timeline look normal.
At the moment you get axemen and then don't bother with anything (except maybe spears) until macemen.

 

[Willem]

With proper promotions its easy to take down archers with their measly 3 strength.

With their natural city defense bonus and 3 ranks of City Garrison, an Archer will have a city defense strength of 6.75. Not so measly! Add to that 25% for being fortified and some cultural defense and they're not always that easy to take down. A Swordsman without Catapults is going to have a hard time with those numbers.

 

[Guerra]

Promote your units, thats all, and use catapults, you don't need to wait until knights.

Swordsmen with city or anti ranged upgrades are sufficient, just don't attack unless you're certain of victory, or your enemy will get nice experienced troops.

 

[Elmstr]

a skirmicher could do the job

 

[Papa Lazarou]

I think they should swap the abilities of swordsmen and axemen. Swordsmen were good against other infantry in the field, but when attacking a town what you want are big shock troops with heavy weapons: axemen!

I agree totally!!

i guess it'll have to be modded...theyre unlikely to change it now

 

[Inqvisitor]

With their natural city defense bonus and 3 ranks of City Garrison, an Archer will have a city defense strength of 6.75. Not so measly! Add to that 25% for being fortified and some cultural defense and they're not always that easy to take down. A Swordsman without Catapults is going to have a hard time with those numbers.

Well its always important to outnumber your enemy when taking a city, especially without catapults. An axemen would have the same problem taking down well-fortified swordsmen, even though an attacking axemen has a great advantage countering swordsmen on the field. Neither archers nor longbowman have what it takes to handle much field combat against technologically identical rivals.

 

[Willem]

Neither archers nor longbowman have what it takes to handle much field combat against technologically identical rivals.

In the field, no they aren't a match. However put them in a city or on a Hill, especially forested, and that changes. They're naturals when it comes to city defense. Unless a unit has City Raider, like the Swordsman do, they're not that easy to take down. Longbowman especially are tough city defenders. Right away they have a strength of 9, plus First Strike.

 

[Inqvisitor]

In the field, no they aren't a match. However put them in a city or on a Hill, especially forested, and that changes. They're naturals when it comes to city defense. Unless a unit has City Raider, like the Swordsman do, they're not that easy to take down. Longbowman especially are tough city defenders. Right away they have a strength of 9, plus First Strike.

True so the niche they fill is that of city defenders. Swordsmen (and any unit with City Raider promotions) are thus an effective counter against them. Don't forget the Cover promotion either, which adds another 25% against archer units anywhere. If archers really bothers someone that much, they can play as Huayna Capac who starts with an effective anti-archer unit from day one.

 

[AL_DA_GREAT]

archers are way to powerfull. historically speaking knights are an effective wepond against archers.

 

[Nefelia]

archers are way to powerfull.

Lol.

With their natural city defense bonus and 3 ranks of City Garrison, an Archer will have a city defense strength of 6.75.

A Swordsman with 3 City Raider promotions will have a city attack strength of 11.5. So whats your point?

Archer units fill in a very specialized niche, that of city defence. As such, their natural counter is the Swordsman/Maceman with city attack. As such, their is already an anti-archer unit in the game. Its up to you to make good use of it.

 

[Lockesdonkey]

Lol.



A Swordsman with 3 City Raider promotions will have a city attack strength of 11.5. So whats your point?

Archer units fill in a very specialized niche, that of city defence. As such, their natural counter is the Swordsman/Maceman with city attack. As such, their is already an anti-archer unit in the game. Its up to you to make good use of it.

And if you have an inexperienced army? One where your units at most have CR 2?

 

[KrikkitTwo]

And if you have an inexperienced army? One where your units at most have CR 2?

Then you need more numbers
at equal experience levels, the city Raider exactly balance out the City Garrison
Fully Fortified Archer v. Swordsman at equal experience levels of Garrison+Raider=
City Defense: Archer Strength v. the swordsman (strength 6)
0: 4.95
20: 5.55
40: 6.15
50: 6.45 (Walled City)
60: 6.75
80: 7.35
100: 7.95

So in a newer city, The Swordsman beats the Archer, in Older cities the Swordsman loses.. but barely, so as long as you have 2 Swords/Archer you win (admittedly Swords Cost more, but that is so that Defense will be better than Offense..until Catapults)