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Discussion in 'Civ5 - Game Of The Month' started by AlanH, Sep 18, 2010.

  1. Browd

    Browd Dilettante Administrator

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    Since the file name is GlobaDefines.xml, why the requested clarification in 3? Is there some rampant misapprehension among community members that some files ending in .xml are, somehow, not xml files?

    On the other hand, removing "other" from 4 is a good change. And I would delete "unfair" if it were up to me -- if a mod gives any advantage, it should be prohibited, rather than opening up debates about whether the advantage is benign or "unfair."
     
  2. beetle

    beetle Deity

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    I am requesting the clarification because I am trying to figure out, in hindsight, if there is any phrasing that might have alerted me to the fact that I was effecting GotM save files without intending to do so.

    I read the OP before my first GotM submission. That group of rules is clearly about not hacking. I was not hacking. I never gave them a second thought. And maybe I had already changed GlobalDefines!

    On a scale of one to ten, with using the MODS menu button being a 1 (in difficulty) and crafting an actual-but-trivial mod being a 10, I would put changing a number in GlobalDefines at about a 2. I also would not have ever expected my GlobalDefines file to effect a saved game, since I assumed that only effected the initial map generation, and not the in-play game rules. I would like for OP to provide more clarification about how sensitive shared files are. (OTOH, you might not exactly want to advertise how very easy it is to “hack” game play.) The way OP is written did not connect the dots for me, and I do not think I am a particularly stupid person.

    I am recommending that you call out GlobalDefines specifically because if a person is temped to changes only one file, that is probably the one they touch. Plus, you know, modern OSs hide the file extension by default. That GlobalDefines is XML can easily be overlooked, especially by someone just trying to change a game play setting that feels like it belongs in the menu options.
     
  3. Browd

    Browd Dilettante Administrator

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    Candidly, I have little sympathy for your position. GlobalDefines is the file that specifies nearly every parameter that affects the game, from food consumed by each citizen, base research rates per citizen, and the parameters for city growth and cultural border expansion, to happiness per luxury and per natural wonder, unhappiness per population and per city, unhappiness growth penalties, great general range and many, many other key parameters (see http://modiki.civfanatics.com/index.php?title=Civ5_GlobalDefines). it sounds like you tinkered with one element of GlobalDefines (city spacing), but you could have chosen to transform the game in myriad other ways -- would your excuse still have been "oh, I changed GlobalDefines many months ago, so shouldn't I get a pass"?
     
  4. beetle

    beetle Deity

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    I broke the rules, intent does not matter, and I am not asking for a pass. But I am sure it that you did not mean for the rules to be so easily broken by accident. It is too late for me, but I am asking for additional clarity in OP so that someone who does the most trivial changing of game settings might see enough detail to trigger a clue to the effect, “Oh yeah, that applies to me!”
    Is that not all the more reason to call it out specifically?
    Why even qualify it with the word “advantage” at all? The qualifier “advantage” is just as subject to debate as “unfair”. The rule could simply be:
    4. Using mods.​
     
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2016
  5. beetle

    beetle Deity

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    I also read the OP after I learned that I had changed the behavior of GotM files. I wanted to see, with the benefit of hindsight, if (1) that I should have realized that GlobalDefines changes files that others generate, and (2) if the rules forbid what I did.

    (1) is still no, I think, sorry. But OP is probably not the right place for that sort of information.
    (2) is yes, but I had to read it twice even after I knew about (1)!

    So my opinion is OP could and should provide additional clarification.
     
  6. AlanH

    AlanH Mac addict, php monkey Moderator Hall of Fame Staff Supporter GOTM Staff

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    I don't understand why globaldefines.xml has to be called out specifically. I've said any xml file. Surely that covers it?
     
  7. beetle

    beetle Deity

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    Yes, from a lawyerly perspective, you have covered it. But the phrasing is not as helpful as it could be to the more casual ‘modder’.
    Because you are trying to help amateurs avoid mistakes and an example would be illuminating.
     

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