If the AI clearly sees who builds a privateer (or any other unit that you may have marked as hidden nationality in the Editor), will they still not know its nationality? That would be pretty funny if they didn't. And BTW, do any of you ever bother building privateers?
I do not build privateers. IMHO I think they are useless.
I have read though that you can build as many as you want. But the minute one of your say Aztec privateers attack say a Zulu galleon, all of the Zulu ships will magically know which privateers to attack and where they are originating (the aztec lands). However, relations will not suffer as a result.
Daaraa, are you saying that the AI will declare war on you? (They would have to do that to attack, unless they attack your privateers with their privateers.)
So let's see... Daaraa says if you attack with a Privateer, the AI magically knows who did it, but relations don't suffer. Civanator says relations suffer, but he never said anything about the other civ attacking you. Could someone clear this up for me?
I use privateers much more than I used to. They can attack without penalty to your reputation or starting a war. They can enter the AI zones of sea control without causing an incident which can permit you to form effective blockades with few units. All while maintaining peace with the AI. They are great for shadowing enemy units on the move and can preventing the AI from settling new areas by ship. Of course, later in the game their usefulness against modern ships is pretty much zip but they have a place and purpose in my games. Using offensive peace time units can really change how you can control the seas.
Privateers can attack units w/o repercussions, but they can also BE attacked w/o repercussions. (they are going after pirates not one of "your" units). The AI will try to sink privateers first so these can be useful to lure enemy fleets to destruction!
willj : Mad bomber pretty much summed it up. They are considered pirates and fair game. The ai just then knows who builds them and when and consequentially will pounch then minute one hits the water. Your reputation is not supposed to suffer.
The blockade idea is an interesting one. Perhaps I may give that a try....
OK, thanks Mad Bomber and Daaraa for clearing that up. That privateer blockade idea is a good one, Cartouche Bee. So could Civanator's relation suffreing have been a coincidence?
Know this probably off the topic. but I often use stacks of privateers in the late game to sink foreign transports. I add a battleship to the stack and has never been attacked.
Originally posted by thefrenchzulu Know this probably off the topic. but I often use stacks of privateers in the late game to sink foreign transports. I add a battleship to the stack and has never been attacked.
In my games with the Huge Real World Maps, I always make a bunch of privateers to hide my modern naval units. One of the things I noticed is that the AI will go after Privateers, but because they are in a stack with my modern Navy, my modern shis get to join the fight with no ill effect of war or sullied reputation. Case i point, I was Germany and was on my way to shoving the English out of the New World. I put two destroyers, three ironclads and a Battleship in a stack with 2 Privateers. The English turn around and attack the privateer/modern stack with 5 Man O War. The Privateers get sunk but then my modern Navy gets to fire back and sinks the whole English fleet clearing the way for the building of New Munich on the East Coast of America. I hadn't mentioned it until I saw this post and see that others are doign the same (I am using 1.21f BTW)....
Originally posted by mauiduck In my games with the Huge Real World Maps, I always make a bunch of privateers to hide my modern naval units. One of the things I noticed is that the AI will go after Privateers, but because they are in a stack with my modern Navy, my modern shis get to join the fight with no ill effect of war or sullied reputation. Case i point, I was Germany and was on my way to shoving the English out of the New World. I put two destroyers, three ironclads and a Battleship in a stack with 2 Privateers. The English turn around and attack the privateer/modern stack with 5 Man O War. The Privateers get sunk but then my modern Navy gets to fire back and sinks the whole English fleet clearing the way for the building of New Munich on the East Coast of America. I hadn't mentioned it until I saw this post and see that others are doign the same (I am using 1.21f BTW)....
Could this have been changed in 1.29? Intersting concept. And after the battle was over you were not at war??? I'll try that the next chance I get. Perhaps my strategy on privateers has been improved.
Originally posted by Daaraa
Could this have been changed in 1.29? Intersting concept. And after the battle was over you were not at war??? I'll try that the next chance I get. Perhaps my strategy on privateers has been improved.
Yeah I'm not sure about this either. I believe this may have been addressed in 1.29f but haven't tested it yet.
What I like to use privateers as is bait for the AI. If I am at war with an AI who has a strong navy I send out a couple of privateers followed a few tiles behind with some of my naval forces. Then when the ai attacks my privateers I ambush his units with my forces that I have kept close behind.
I've used a fleet of Privateers to blockade a small country to keep them from trading all of their luxuries to the larger Civs. It took a lot of boats to board up 5 cities, but it worked pretty well.
For about 20 turns.
By the time I had built all of those Privateers the target CIVs was close to getting Ironclads. I then watched all of my Privateers sink in about two turns.
My opinion: they could be useful if they were either stronger, or available earlier. (AND FIRAXIS: CHANGE THE REQUIREMENTS FOR BLOCKADE TO ONE UNCONTESTED SHIP IN THE CITY SQUARE).
I'm a bit confused because I've had similar "coincidences". Not once - three times in two different games. One game with 1.17f and one with 1.21f patch. These were the only games when I used privateers extensively (they are quite useful btw). Last time I sunk about half of the American fleet (mostly galleys and caravels) and they went rather quickly from polite to furious. I didn't want to start war and I decided to stop, my privateers started to weaken Zulu navy... and guess what happened - once gracious Zulus were annoyed after losing three or four ships. So I really don't know how it works. Were the AIs suspecting something ? Sure war didn't start but...
I think there is a misunderstanding of the privateers. Your relations will suffer if you sink ships with them, but using them will not result in war. The A.I knows who sent out the privateers but they can't "prove" it. Think of modern day terrorists, we 'know" that certain countries are supporting them but we don't do much about it unless we can "pin" it to a country or government. when I stated earlier that there would be "no Repercussions" I was talking about war & not relations, I apologize if I misled anyone!
privateers are useful if your relations are not that good w/ another CIV, but using them should change their attitude towards your civ.
Originally posted by willj OK, thanks Mad Bomber and Daaraa for clearing that up. That privateer blockade idea is a good one, Cartouche Bee. So could Civanator's relation suffreing have been a coincidence?
I'm currently using them for a thousand year blockade. Now if that civ gets up to ironclads during that time, then they will have to declare war to get through my battleships. I basically used them to give me the time to build a navy that can encircle their cultural corona.
Privateers 'are' pretty weak and I can't remember ever getting a reputation hit from using them but my understanding was that the units are not traceable back to your civ, that is why the AI attacks them on sight even when you are at peace with that civ.
If you want them stronger or available earlier, why don't you change them in the Editor? Though of course that could be considered a "crutch" that you might get dependent on, but hey, they would be useful.
Originally posted by Cartouche Bee I'm currently using them for a thousand year blockade. Now if that civ gets up to ironclads during that time, then they will have to declare war to get through my battleships.
CB
I'm confused. Does that mean you have or will have battleships in the same squares as the blockading privateers? If so, couldn't the battleships be considered to be blockading the city? Wouldn't that be an act of war (or whatever an action that makes the enemy want to declare war is called)?
No the battleships a couple of squares out from privateer blockade. [I don't want to rile the AI by tresspassing on their space.]
In this particular situation the AI is using it's entire production to build caravels that they sling against my privateers, I can easily replace those privateers if they are sunk. Even when the AI is succesful in sinking a privateer they return home to heal.
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