Problem with scientific advance
- Thread starter pwiecek
- Start date
...4 is DEFINITLY more than enough in my opinion.
If you try to get it lower than that, you'll be wasting thousands of gold getting it down by a turn or two - which is pointless.
If you're trying to catch up to the other civs, instead of wasting gold on that tiny science gap buy the techs from them.
If you try to get it lower than that, you'll be wasting thousands of gold getting it down by a turn or two - which is pointless.
If you're trying to catch up to the other civs, instead of wasting gold on that tiny science gap buy the techs from them.
MAS
Deity
4 turns is the lower cap, the only way to have a faster tech rate, is to trade with other civ, the tech you didn't research.
The upper cap is 40 turns in vanilla and PTW, and 50 turns in C3C.
I'd lower the SCI slider a bit (without changing the 4 turns to 5 or something) and get some extra cash out of it, else your commerce will be wasted.
I disagree with metamike though, if it where possible to go below 4 turns, I'd definitely try it! Though it isn't possible.....
The upper cap is 40 turns in vanilla and PTW, and 50 turns in C3C.
I'd lower the SCI slider a bit (without changing the 4 turns to 5 or something) and get some extra cash out of it, else your commerce will be wasted.
I disagree with metamike though, if it where possible to go below 4 turns, I'd definitely try it! Though it isn't possible.....
civverguy
Emperor
You can mod the game to get it below 4.
Thanks
In addition, when the turns-til-advance counter reaches 1, I go back in and move the slider down as far as it can go without increasing the number of turns. This gets you a few extra gold each advance. If you can slide it all the way to 10% and it is still at 1 turn, try backing up one turn and sliding it down as far as it will go while maintaining 2 turns.
In addition, when the turns-til-advance counter reaches 1, I go back in and move the slider down as far as it can go without increasing the number of turns. This gets you a few extra gold each advance. If you can slide it all the way to 10% and it is still at 1 turn, try backing up one turn and sliding it down as far as it will go while maintaining 2 turns.
It seems like they're always trying to gouge me. Are their offers really fair?
Welcome to CFC, pwiecek!
The best way to get game specific advice is to post a save, and let others download your save so that they can really get a look at what's going on in your empire. It would help to know what difficulty you're playing on, map settings, etc.
In my opinion, if you're not going to war/not about to advance an era then I always accept their offers/modify them to be offers of tech. and I give them just large amount of money which my commerce brings me back in 5 turns or so, so it's just like learning tech through wasting commerce, but by trading gold for it (as long as it's not a large amount of gpt), you have the option to do other things with that money.
I don't know if that made any sense =/
I don't know if that made any sense =/
They all make a difference. It also is valuable when you can trade techs around.
Here's the decision making process I learned many moons ago and I think it helps:
1. Can I afford it? Maybe the AI owns it as a monopoly and if you wait others will bring the value down. Will it hurt the economy in a bad way?
2. Do I need it? Maybe it's a tech that won't help right now. For instance, Ceremonial Burial. Do you really need to build temples in the early game (if ever really)? If you don't need it right away the price may come down.
3. Can it be traded profitably? IE Buy can you buy one tech and get two, three or four techs, a lux, some gold or gpt in return?
If only 1 of these 3 qualifies then it's a bad trade. If it's 2 of 3 it's acceptable and if it's 3 of 3 it's excellent.
TheOverseer714
Overseer
Your rep needs to be sterling or near to it to do those trades, and there are some techs that they want both arms and a leg for, or will not trade until the tech is long past its worth. Usually for me it is any of the governments, Nationalism, Espionage, Military Tradition, and Free Artistry.
Your rep needs to be sterling or near to it to do those trades, and there are some techs that they want both arms and a leg for, or will not trade until the tech is long past its worth. Usually for me it is any of the governments, Nationalism, Espionage, Military Tradition, and Free Artistry.
Creepy, you just listed almost every single one of those which I research myself instead of buying.
For example: Because of my enemies being Scientific/popping huts nearby them that give them goodies and not me on higher levels, I usually waste 100 gold and around 2 gpt at just to get half-way through the Ancient Age by buying all the ones they found, and trading in-between nations tech for tech.
Then, I put all the commerce I have left over which is buy the time around 600 gold, and 40-50 gpt to get to Monarchy as fast as possible, get Polytheism, get Monarchy, and then trade Polytheism/Monarchy to construction and the other techs needed to get to Middle Age, from one person, and trade Poly/Monarchy to all the other people for money.
That way, I start out Middle Age as fast as everyone else, with around 100gpt, and 1000 gold?
Then I use THAT money to trade any Scientific empire that might've gotten Feudalism as a prequisite, and still have around 80 gpt.
At that turn, I'm having around 50 gpt self income, and 30 gpt income for the next 20 turns, which I use to in those 20 turns get around 3 techs all of which I monopolyse and sell for insane amounts of money, luxuries, right of passages, gpt, and all the other techs they might've researched at that point.
Then I sit back, at this point 100-150 gpt and not half-way through Middle Ages, let the treasure flow in, and give petty change in exchange for the techs needed to finish middle ages.
Start Indus. Ages, trade for Nationalism which some lucky fellar got, then go straight to Communism.
Rines and Repeat.
edit: In case you were wondering, I usually play continent games, and tend to make sure that the person on my continent has NO contact to the outside world, and annihilate him before Ancient Ages end while doing all this trading with the other continents, and I do THAT by rushing to Map Making, which I also forgot to mention.
MAS
Deity
The AI will usually go for the cheaper tech (to the left side of the tech tree) first before moving up the tech tree (moving to the right actually)
Therefor, to be able to trade in a profitable way, you are best off going straight up the tech tree (to the right, that means) and trade the more expensive tech for multiple cheaper ones.
This works especially well since the AI will trade their tech around with each other in the mean time, this will bring the price of their tech down.
Example:
you research alphabet-->writing --> code of law --> philosophy--> republic.
The AI will research/trade all their starting tech, plus, some will have Iron working, mysticism, and horseback riding.
Now there are a lot of tech the AI has but you don't and a few you have but none of the AI, so....
Then you trade Writing for 2 different starting tech with civ1,
writing for 2 other starting tech, plus gold with civ2 and
writing for one more starting tech plus some gold with civ3
Then code of law for Iron working with civ2 again,
then Iron working for mysticism with civ3 and
code of law plus iron working for horseback riding and and some gold with civ1.
Now you have all the AI tech, plus all their gold, and you still have some tech left the AI still lacks.... Despite the fact some of these trades appeared rip-offs if you look at them one at a time. Especially that last trade I mentioned.
Therefor, to be able to trade in a profitable way, you are best off going straight up the tech tree (to the right, that means) and trade the more expensive tech for multiple cheaper ones.
This works especially well since the AI will trade their tech around with each other in the mean time, this will bring the price of their tech down.
Example:
you research alphabet-->writing --> code of law --> philosophy--> republic.
The AI will research/trade all their starting tech, plus, some will have Iron working, mysticism, and horseback riding.
Now there are a lot of tech the AI has but you don't and a few you have but none of the AI, so....
Then you trade Writing for 2 different starting tech with civ1,
writing for 2 other starting tech, plus gold with civ2 and
writing for one more starting tech plus some gold with civ3
Then code of law for Iron working with civ2 again,
then Iron working for mysticism with civ3 and
code of law plus iron working for horseback riding and and some gold with civ1.
Now you have all the AI tech, plus all their gold, and you still have some tech left the AI still lacks.... Despite the fact some of these trades appeared rip-offs if you look at them one at a time. Especially that last trade I mentioned.
wow this thread got pretty deep. The guy was just asking if there was a minimum turn requirement for research. back when I started modding civ3 to make it more fun for myself, one of the first things I did was lower the min tech time. Most of the time I put it to 2 turns. I guess in theory it might as well be 1. If you have enough science to research it in 1 turn, might as well. because that assumes you are either way behind and need techs as quickly as possible or are way ahead and the techs really aren't needed.
i hate having to trade for techs just because the AI always is unfair. now I know the AI is stupid in general, I just find it annoying that if I research a tech I can barely get a good deal, but if they get the tech first, they want 5 cities and all my gold.
i hate having to trade for techs just because the AI always is unfair. now I know the AI is stupid in general, I just find it annoying that if I research a tech I can barely get a good deal, but if they get the tech first, they want 5 cities and all my gold.
1940LaSalle
Warlord
Looks like a pretty fair strategy. One question, though: is communism necessary? Wouldn't this work equally / approximately as well with the republic or democracy?
Now I'll really reveal my ignorance: how does one manage to get something on the order of 100 gold/turn as you describe? That is, not necessarily the specifics but a general outline of procedure? I'm feeling flush if I can somehow manage 20 gold/turn, and anything beyond...call me J. P. Morgan. Guessing that part of the strategy is to build a lot of roads in the beginning and/or maybe locate one's initial city where it can develop a harbor, but I could be way wrong.
Sashie VII
Balance of Power
Marketplaces, big cities, Republic, lots of towns...these should start you off.
Here are the specifics:
Steps:
1) Expansion: more cities = more commerce, and I love having cities one space apart on useless lands (desert/tundra) for the 2gpt bonus with proper use of micro in all the towns
2) Monopoly : Sell a tech the civs tend to go for last in an era but end up needing most, a.k.a. Monarchy but not Republic
3) Commerce /defensive units but not offensive to stop civs from making gpt/lump sum threats
4) Republic: Switch to Republic for extra commerce bonuses.
5) Currency -> Banks: After all your banks are built in the towns in which it's actually worth building (not the 1 size towns) they'll balance out the maintanance cost and give you a higher income.
Then I usually tend to fight a war or two for more land, build some harbors on my surrounding cities, monopolize some Middle-Age techs, trade some spare luxuries.
Oh, and in early expansion I always go for the luxury towns first, as long as they're not half a map away from my capital
edit: I forgot the main one, overall micromanagement, I actually spent over a week reading articles and looking at GOTM examples to find out how to manage my towns better, overall I found that just better micromanagement causes economic prospert of at least an additional +20gpt.
Steps:
1) Expansion: more cities = more commerce, and I love having cities one space apart on useless lands (desert/tundra) for the 2gpt bonus with proper use of micro in all the towns
2) Monopoly : Sell a tech the civs tend to go for last in an era but end up needing most, a.k.a. Monarchy but not Republic
3) Commerce /defensive units but not offensive to stop civs from making gpt/lump sum threats
4) Republic: Switch to Republic for extra commerce bonuses.
5) Currency -> Banks: After all your banks are built in the towns in which it's actually worth building (not the 1 size towns) they'll balance out the maintanance cost and give you a higher income.
Then I usually tend to fight a war or two for more land, build some harbors on my surrounding cities, monopolize some Middle-Age techs, trade some spare luxuries.
Oh, and in early expansion I always go for the luxury towns first, as long as they're not half a map away from my capital
edit: I forgot the main one, overall micromanagement, I actually spent over a week reading articles and looking at GOTM examples to find out how to manage my towns better, overall I found that just better micromanagement causes economic prospert of at least an additional +20gpt.
1940LaSalle
Warlord
Metamike, when you say "micromanagement", I assume you're talking about working in the "Zoom to..." view where the squares and their occupants are shown. Now: got a recommendation of where to start reading about micromanagement? (Drat...wish there were a Civ III for Dummies text...)
Mirc
Not mIRC!!!
No.. micromanagement refers to managing all your workers individually usually, but also taking care of little details like wasted shields due to higher production than necessary.
