Progressive transfer of production from mines to industries

[xartah]

Are resource bonuses going to be cumulative to make it worth mining two sources of the same resource? It seems much better to just have one iron mine for example and build other improvements over any additional iron deposits so that you'll have a guaranteed source of iron in the future. How about recycling? Ocean extraction?

Is it possible to get a world that has completely run out of iron?

 

[Afforess]

Are resource bonuses going to be cumulative to make it worth mining two sources of the same resource? It seems much better to just have one iron mine for example and build other improvements over any additional iron deposits so that you'll have a guaranteed source of iron in the future. How about recycling? Ocean extraction?

Is it possible to get a world that has completely run out of iron?

Perhaps, perhaps no. The world could run out of iron, but is it possible to imagine a world that runs out of iron? We could *theoretically* use it all up. A world with much less iron than ours could run out.

It would make for an interesting game, no?

 

[os79]

Perhaps, perhaps no. The world could run out of iron, but is it possible to imagine a world that runs out of iron? We could *theoretically* use it all up. A world with much less iron than ours could run out.

It would make for an interesting game, no?

Clarification time...

You mean that the resources will fade away randomly and after a certain amount of turns? So what about military units that got there because of the resources? Will these units fade away or will their strength decease due to no longer having resources? Or will it be still default status for the units produced with the resource that faded away?

 

[Afforess]

Clarification time...

You mean that the resources will fade away randomly and after a certain amount of turns? So what about military units that got there because of the resources? Will these units fade away or will their strength decease due to no longer having resources? Or will it be still default status for the units produced with the resource that faded away?

No. Resources will fade if they get a improvement built on them. Which simply means you exhausted the resource supply at that location. So the buildings and units you built already have the resource that you used up, and will be unaffected.

However, Vicinity buildings are now checked each turn in each city, and if you lose the resource in the vicinity, they shut down. However, if you regain the resource (perhaps your culture shrunk, then expanded), they will re-activate.

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

No. Resources will fade if they get a improvement built on them. Which simply means you exhausted the resource supply at that location. So the buildings and units you built already have the resource that you used up, and will be unaffected.

However, Vicinity buildings are now checked each turn in each city, and if you lose the resource in the vicinity, they shut down. However, if you regain the resource (perhaps your culture shrunk, then expanded), they will re-activate.

Good, so claiming territory with iron on it via fixed boarders will have the correct affect

 

[civ_king]

If we are doing this then the logical extension is to make units require a certain amount of resources and buildings too. so each mine would have an amount of units (of the resource) so it stock piles it in the cities, making a building or unit consumes a certain amount of resource but when you disband a unit in a city the city partially get refunded the resources, also buildings when are sold resources are refunded and you would import a certain amount of resources from the AI a finite quantity which you could increase later

note this probably would fry the AI

 

[Afforess]

If we are doing this then the logical extension is to make units require a certain amount of resources and buildings too. so each mine would have an amount of units (of the resource) so it stock piles it in the cities, making a building or unit consumes a certain amount of resource but when you disband a unit in a city the city partially get refunded the resources, also buildings when are sold resources are refunded and you would import a certain amount of resources from the AI a finite quantity which you could increase later

note this probably would fry the AI

There was a stock pile ModComp a while ago, but it doesn't work with BTS, and yes, the AI would basically need to be rewritten. This way involves minimal AI changes.

 

[Civ Fuehrer]

I just saw this thread am willing to reskin a mine to make it look different, but i'll have to re-install all my programs since i just updated to Windows 7.

 

[os79]

I just saw this thread am willing to reskin a mine to make it look different, but i'll have to re-install all my programs since i just updated to Windows 7.

Join the club . Had to reinstall several programs that I simply had to have but it was tedious task . Just am glad it is done with .

 

[Civ Fuehrer]

Miraculously Gimp didn't need to be re-installed some how but I think i have the mine reskin complete... now i just need to finish re-installing Civ IV to test how it looks.

 

[little_cyclone]

Just as an observation, this will change the usefulness of certain corporations that depend on resources that are mined, especially if all the copper/iron/gold/coal/silver/etc begins to disappear.. All of a sudden my Mining Inc is useless..

Interesting idea indeed. I'm worried about the effect on productivity though. Can we at least increase the frequency of resoirces appearance?

I'd have to 2nd this request, as very rarely in my extended games do I ever see any non-new resources spawn in formerly 'empty' tiles.

 

[Civ Fuehrer]

Okay I uploaded the reskinned mine here. I was gunna just link it to my dropbox but then thought why not share it?

 

[Afforess]

Just as an observation, this will change the usefulness of certain corporations that depend on resources that are mined, especially if all the copper/iron/gold/coal/silver/etc begins to disappear.. All of a sudden my Mining Inc is useless..

Interesting idea indeed. I'm worried about the effect on productivity though. Can we at least increase the frequency of resoirces appearance?

I'd have to 2nd this request, as very rarely in my extended games do I ever see any non-new resources spawn in formerly 'empty' tiles.

Yeah, I will boost the chances of Mining Resources appearing. No problem. It will probably need some play testing to get balanced right.

Okay I uploaded the reskinned mine here. I was gunna just link it to my dropbox but then thought why not share it?

Thanks! It looks perfect for the job!

 

[civ_king]

Yeah, I will boost the chances of Mining Resources appearing. No problem. It will probably need some play testing to get balanced right.


Thanks! It looks perfect for the job!

maybe resources or techs could boost chance even more?

 

[Retrospect]

This is an excellent idea, however I have spotted a few possible problems:

1. Forts can also be used to harvest/mine resources

2. What about mines on resources that are supplying said resource but not being worked, or similarly outside of the city radius and will never be worked.

I'm a big advocate of this idea so would like to see those few problems solved.

 

[Retrospect]

Also I quick idea... you could tie a lot of this into random events also.

 

[Afforess]

This is an excellent idea, however I have spotted a few possible problems:

1. Forts can also be used to harvest/mine resources

2. What about mines on resources that are supplying said resource but not being worked, or similarly outside of the city radius and will never be worked.

I'm a big advocate of this idea so would like to see those few problems solved.

Indeed. This idea has quickly sprouted many leaks. Instead of constantly revising the game to fix them. I'm scrapping my original ideas, and replacing this with a much more elegant, and more random system I worked up while bored in class today.

Okay, many improvements have a chance for them to cause a resource to appear. I will add an exactly similar XML tag for them to cause specified resources to disappear. That way, the resource with that improvement has a X/10000 chance each turn of disappearing. (With X being the number I choose, probably 50.) This will simulate resources being consumed.

At the same time, improvements will be marked with a tag "iDepletionChance" , again, a number out of 10000, which will give improvements a chance at consuming all useful materials at the location, and replacing the improvement with a depleted mine. However, the mine will not deplete if there is a resource that the mine is mining (like Gold). The gold has to deplete via the above method before the mine can deplete. If a new resource appears on the plot that could be mined, and there is a depleted mine (or was a depleted mine) at the spot, players will be able to build a new mine. (This will simulate the discovery of new minerals in older mines, making them worth working.)

This way, mines can still be pillaged, replaced by workers, affected by events, amongst other things, without causing exploits. It's also much more random.

 

[Retrospect]

Indeed. This idea has quickly sprouted many leaks. Instead of constantly revising the game to fix them. I'm scrapping my original ideas, and replacing this with a much more elegant, and more random system I worked up while bored in class today.

Okay, many improvements have a chance for them to cause a resource to appear. I will add an exactly similar XML tag for them to cause specified resources to disappear. That way, the resource with that improvement has a X/10000 chance each turn of disappearing. (With X being the number I choose, probably 50.) This will simulate resources being consumed.

At the same time, improvements will be marked with a tag "iDepletionChance" , again, a number out of 10000, which will give improvements a chance at consuming all useful materials at the location, and replacing the improvement with a depleted mine. However, the mine will not deplete if there is a resource that the mine is mining (like Gold). The gold has to deplete via the above method before the mine can deplete. If a new resource appears on the plot that could be mined, and there is a depleted mine (or was a depleted mine) at the spot, players will be able to build a new mine. (This will simulate the discovery of new minerals in older mines, making them worth working.)

This way, mines can still be pillaged, replaced by workers, affected by events, amongst other things, without causing exploits. It's also much more random.

So the chance for the resource would be active from the moment the improvement (including forts) was placed on it even if said improvement was not being worked?

Since reading through a lot of the threads on the AND forum it has given me quite a few ideas for events. I think I may take my first steps into the modding world by trying to give life to them. I understand that they are one of the more basic aspect to modding?

 

[Afforess]

So the chance for the resource would be active from the moment the improvement (including forts) was placed on it even if said improvement was not being worked?

Yes. Even if it wasn't being worked, it is unlocking units and buildings for the player to construct, so in a sense, it's always being "worked"

Since reading through a lot of the threads on the AND forum it has given me quite a few ideas for events. I think I may take my first steps into the modding world by trying to give life to them. I understand that they are one of the more basic aspect to modding?

Random Events can be as simple or complex as you want them to be. More complex ones involve python scripts, which are still not that hard to do. There is a really good guide to Random Events in Kael's guide to modding BTS.

 

[Retrospect]

Yes. Even if it wasn't being worked, it is unlocking units and buildings for the player to construct, so in a sense, it's always being "worked"



Random Events can be as simple or complex as you want them to be. More complex ones involve python scripts, which are still not that hard to do. There is a really good guide to Random Events in Kael's guide to modding BTS.

Great stuff, I really cant wait to see that in effect, it's been something that has gnawed at the back of mind since first playing civ 4.

I'm currently reading solvers guide but I will check Kael's guide out when i've finished.