Rallying call for all interested: Colonisation of the Moon mod!
- Thread starter JBG
- Start date
It will most likely help me as well to go back to the tech tree. When I did it at first it was simply to get the mod playable. I shoe horned in a lot of stuff and made some judgement calls. 
Most likely with more feedback and playtesting the whole thing could be changed.
Most likely with more feedback and playtesting the whole thing could be changed.
GeoModder
Deity
- Joined
- Nov 29, 2005
- Messages
- 7,512
Belizan said:
It happened on the road between two bases, at the start of the turn. How do you mean capped? Can a civ only have one at the time? Another GG spawned due to another combat the turn before I think. And at that time there was already one military academy in a base.
JBG
Prince
We have had a series of reports from players (corroborate by myself) about the civ selection screen.
If you click on 'play now!' rather than 'custom game' when you get to the Leaderhead selection screen, some civs experience display problems due to their long names.
Is it possible to force the game to insert a line break if the civ's name makes the text box too big? If it's too big then it forces the text box to expand, sometimes completely obscuring the leaderheads menu. This is not a crippling error, but it would be nice to fix it. I fear that locking and fixing the text box size is a python issue, however...
If you click on 'play now!' rather than 'custom game' when you get to the Leaderhead selection screen, some civs experience display problems due to their long names.
Is it possible to force the game to insert a line break if the civ's name makes the text box too big? If it's too big then it forces the text box to expand, sometimes completely obscuring the leaderheads menu. This is not a crippling error, but it would be nice to fix it. I fear that locking and fixing the text box size is a python issue, however...
Ok, so the idea behind Lunacy is that it is a mod broken up into 4 phases (which may or may not coincide with eras).
In phase 1, you land on the moon, to colonize on behalf of one or another terrestial-based organization, group or movement (just like SOM is setup now).
When you land, you have a satellite shot of a 5 tile radius around your landing zone. You land with a base constructor (colonist), a pair of rovers, a salvage team, and 4 Great People--1 Scientist, 1 Engineer, and 2 based on your civ. You would start with your map centered and to scale (we know what size the moon is, after all. The moon would be divided into two parts, a "light size" and a "dark side". Sadly I'd probably have to do this with some sort of weird terrain trick, since I can't override the terrain tooltips.
In phase 1, the game is all about you trading with Earth. Your techs have a lot to do with developing your relationship with earth. Contract: He3. Contract: Paladium, etc. Others are research projects you can conduct for profit, assuming you have built the necessary facilities. Low-G botany tank, Low-G particle accelerator, etc. I have long ago forgotten whatever I knew of "real" science of this nature, so I'd have to research some things that didn't sound stupid 8). Other buildings would be facilities that would generate food or power, happiness/health or commerce or grant you the ability for more people to work in your base (more specialists). You could also develop adaptation technologies for jury-rigging certain types of equipment together with the limited materials available, and developing limited material fabrication and refining capabilities moon-side at great expense in time and money and materials.
There would be no military units to speak of in this era or colonist units. Just engineers and espionage units. Every civ would have the option to build ICBM nuclear or conventional, but use of them would draw immediate repurcussions from Earth. Civs would also be able to launch primitive satellites which could be tasked to give them imaging information on nearby parts of the map. They could also be tasked to provide synchronous coordination granting any units you had in their area promotion-based combat bonuses to strength and to withdrawal.
You would start with access to radar, radio and power towers/stations (buildings) and radar, radio and power relays (improvements). There would be no culture generation. In my view, culture represents your civ's influence on the ambient population. There is no ambient population on the moon. Instead, culture represents your power grid (which is why you can only build improvements in your cultural radius). Depending on the size of your generator and infrastructure, that determines your city's cultural radius. Your power grid is extended by power relays. Radar controls your view range, as well as providing units under radar coverage a bonus. Radio would provide your units with an in communication/incommunicado bonus. Early scouts couldn't move out of your radio range (and remember there is no atmosphere to bounce off of), because they are unmanned. Units in radio range also gain a withdrawal bonus.
Terrain would cause attrition scaled by tiers (out of power grid radius, out of radar range, out of radio range, with a special multiplier if just revealed). Attrition would represent small amounts of damage, limiting your units ability to go wandering off. Mechanical units which attrited themselves to death would leave salvageable wrecks that could be recovered by salvage teams. Similar the map would start with a series of goodies--impact craters, crash sites and salvageable probes and rovers. Salvaged units could be reactived or converted to production/coins.
While contact with Earth was maintained, similar to Colonization, you would be able to request reinforcements from Earth. New specialists could be hired, as well as additional materials, convoys with food/production on them, building kits, etc. Availability based on contracts negotiated (researched) contacts assembled, commerse rate, civics, civ faction and difficulty level, and would be purchased with gold.
Phase 1 of the game ends when Earth implodes in a massive war, leaving the fledgingly colonies suddenly cut off and desparate to try and survive. All the phase 1 techs abilities granted are rendered obsolete, as well as most of the buildings (which really, afterall, represented the facilities to transport materials to and from earth), although headstarts are given to certain Phase 2 techs based on previous experimentations, etc. In Phase 1, the Scientific expeditions has a head start on achieving the First to Discover bonus generating research techs, the Commercial enterprises had a headstart on the commercial contracts techs, and the Independents had a start on the Pioneer techs, which involved adaptation and while the weakest by far in Phase 1, put them in the best position in Phase 2. The height of the Pioneering techs in phase 1 is Independence, which acts as a religion that spreads, when your civ has sufficient support for the idea of declaring Independence, you can take the Independence civic, which partially severs contact early, and lets you get a head start on the adaptation and domestic production/survival techs of Phase 2.
Phase 2, then, is survival. Here we have a fast attempt, first to survive, and second to bootstrap up a self-sufficient, sustainable industrial base. Most of what we have for the Moon Mod currently would fit into what I call Phase 2. The colonists, forced to adapt to survive, begin working with really minimal starting resources and populations to try to make life possible in the Harsh, Barren landscape of the Moon. This is where we have the 100 turns to upgrade bacteria farms that don't produce food, and the like. Also, remember, we have a steady stream of impact events, occasional moonquakes, solar flares, not to mention the possibility of the odd Earth-origin'd event. The idea here though, was that all the events occur with lead time, so you can attempt to mitigate the damages. AT-SAT tech is developed, creating the possibility for a battle of supremacy in lower moon orbit, and a series of check and counter check techs are introduced (ground based orbital canon for shooting down sats tasked too close, etc.).
Phase 3 starts with the introduction of Lunacy. I had some other ideas which I didn't write down so I've spaced them, and this is sort of one of them. I recall it being some sort of... Lunar Supremacy ideology. Something borderline crazy but with a logical sounding theme. Horrid but potentially believable, like the Nazi theory of Arian supremacy. The part I do recall, is that as Lunacy spreads, you have the choice to either convert your civ to Lunacy or "fight it". By default I expect most AIs to convert. This creates immediate conflict between the Loonies and the Lunar-based earthlings. The Lunatics start developing strange godless genetic-experimentation based technologies with their own hybrid tech tree. The terrestrial factions maintain their classic dry science path as far as I can manage to extend it. This is a war of ideology and eventually of murder and atrocity. But wait! It gets worse.
Because in Phase 4, Earth re-emerges. They take one look at the Moon and immediately attempt to re-establish control. When the Phase 4 event is triggered, all earth phasing colonies which have not developed the appropriate shielding technologies (and built the shields) controlled by the Lunatics are lased into oblivion. Then, ala Colonization again, the Earth-derived military units start showing up to reassert control.
Each player's interface with their former home faction depends on the path they've taken up until now. Those who declared independence on their own previous to loss of contact are in the best position, because there is already a tacit acceptance of their independent standing. Those who resisted Lunacy and remained terrestrially focused have to deal with their faction trying to reassert control. They can either try to buy them off, buy time, paying lip service and sending tech/materials down or fight. Those who went for the sci-fi fun techs of Lunacy are facing all out war with all 5 earth factions.
This is the final phase of the game. Can you survive the reunification of the Moon? Will Lunacy and Lunar Supremacy keep hold of the great rock above Earth's heads? Will Earth nuke the moon into a radioactive heap? Will the Lunatics destroy Earth's ecology and doom their mother planet to extinction? Will you manage to survive as an Independent, proud and free, pioneer of the last great frontier (until the mars mod comes out). Lots of possibilities. It's in Phase 4 that we determine victors.
The triggers for Phase 1-2, 2-3 (and if there will be a Lunacy phase at all), and phase 3-4 would be settable via map options at the beginning (certain turn, predetermined tech, random after so many turns, any other benchmark we came up with).
Anyway, this is sort of a rough description of the mod which has been poisoning my mind when I look at SOM.
In phase 1, you land on the moon, to colonize on behalf of one or another terrestial-based organization, group or movement (just like SOM is setup now).
When you land, you have a satellite shot of a 5 tile radius around your landing zone. You land with a base constructor (colonist), a pair of rovers, a salvage team, and 4 Great People--1 Scientist, 1 Engineer, and 2 based on your civ. You would start with your map centered and to scale (we know what size the moon is, after all. The moon would be divided into two parts, a "light size" and a "dark side". Sadly I'd probably have to do this with some sort of weird terrain trick, since I can't override the terrain tooltips.
In phase 1, the game is all about you trading with Earth. Your techs have a lot to do with developing your relationship with earth. Contract: He3. Contract: Paladium, etc. Others are research projects you can conduct for profit, assuming you have built the necessary facilities. Low-G botany tank, Low-G particle accelerator, etc. I have long ago forgotten whatever I knew of "real" science of this nature, so I'd have to research some things that didn't sound stupid 8). Other buildings would be facilities that would generate food or power, happiness/health or commerce or grant you the ability for more people to work in your base (more specialists). You could also develop adaptation technologies for jury-rigging certain types of equipment together with the limited materials available, and developing limited material fabrication and refining capabilities moon-side at great expense in time and money and materials.
There would be no military units to speak of in this era or colonist units. Just engineers and espionage units. Every civ would have the option to build ICBM nuclear or conventional, but use of them would draw immediate repurcussions from Earth. Civs would also be able to launch primitive satellites which could be tasked to give them imaging information on nearby parts of the map. They could also be tasked to provide synchronous coordination granting any units you had in their area promotion-based combat bonuses to strength and to withdrawal.
You would start with access to radar, radio and power towers/stations (buildings) and radar, radio and power relays (improvements). There would be no culture generation. In my view, culture represents your civ's influence on the ambient population. There is no ambient population on the moon. Instead, culture represents your power grid (which is why you can only build improvements in your cultural radius). Depending on the size of your generator and infrastructure, that determines your city's cultural radius. Your power grid is extended by power relays. Radar controls your view range, as well as providing units under radar coverage a bonus. Radio would provide your units with an in communication/incommunicado bonus. Early scouts couldn't move out of your radio range (and remember there is no atmosphere to bounce off of), because they are unmanned. Units in radio range also gain a withdrawal bonus.
Terrain would cause attrition scaled by tiers (out of power grid radius, out of radar range, out of radio range, with a special multiplier if just revealed). Attrition would represent small amounts of damage, limiting your units ability to go wandering off. Mechanical units which attrited themselves to death would leave salvageable wrecks that could be recovered by salvage teams. Similar the map would start with a series of goodies--impact craters, crash sites and salvageable probes and rovers. Salvaged units could be reactived or converted to production/coins.
While contact with Earth was maintained, similar to Colonization, you would be able to request reinforcements from Earth. New specialists could be hired, as well as additional materials, convoys with food/production on them, building kits, etc. Availability based on contracts negotiated (researched) contacts assembled, commerse rate, civics, civ faction and difficulty level, and would be purchased with gold.
Phase 1 of the game ends when Earth implodes in a massive war, leaving the fledgingly colonies suddenly cut off and desparate to try and survive. All the phase 1 techs abilities granted are rendered obsolete, as well as most of the buildings (which really, afterall, represented the facilities to transport materials to and from earth), although headstarts are given to certain Phase 2 techs based on previous experimentations, etc. In Phase 1, the Scientific expeditions has a head start on achieving the First to Discover bonus generating research techs, the Commercial enterprises had a headstart on the commercial contracts techs, and the Independents had a start on the Pioneer techs, which involved adaptation and while the weakest by far in Phase 1, put them in the best position in Phase 2. The height of the Pioneering techs in phase 1 is Independence, which acts as a religion that spreads, when your civ has sufficient support for the idea of declaring Independence, you can take the Independence civic, which partially severs contact early, and lets you get a head start on the adaptation and domestic production/survival techs of Phase 2.
Phase 2, then, is survival. Here we have a fast attempt, first to survive, and second to bootstrap up a self-sufficient, sustainable industrial base. Most of what we have for the Moon Mod currently would fit into what I call Phase 2. The colonists, forced to adapt to survive, begin working with really minimal starting resources and populations to try to make life possible in the Harsh, Barren landscape of the Moon. This is where we have the 100 turns to upgrade bacteria farms that don't produce food, and the like. Also, remember, we have a steady stream of impact events, occasional moonquakes, solar flares, not to mention the possibility of the odd Earth-origin'd event. The idea here though, was that all the events occur with lead time, so you can attempt to mitigate the damages. AT-SAT tech is developed, creating the possibility for a battle of supremacy in lower moon orbit, and a series of check and counter check techs are introduced (ground based orbital canon for shooting down sats tasked too close, etc.).
Phase 3 starts with the introduction of Lunacy. I had some other ideas which I didn't write down so I've spaced them, and this is sort of one of them. I recall it being some sort of... Lunar Supremacy ideology. Something borderline crazy but with a logical sounding theme. Horrid but potentially believable, like the Nazi theory of Arian supremacy. The part I do recall, is that as Lunacy spreads, you have the choice to either convert your civ to Lunacy or "fight it". By default I expect most AIs to convert. This creates immediate conflict between the Loonies and the Lunar-based earthlings. The Lunatics start developing strange godless genetic-experimentation based technologies with their own hybrid tech tree. The terrestrial factions maintain their classic dry science path as far as I can manage to extend it. This is a war of ideology and eventually of murder and atrocity. But wait! It gets worse.
Because in Phase 4, Earth re-emerges. They take one look at the Moon and immediately attempt to re-establish control. When the Phase 4 event is triggered, all earth phasing colonies which have not developed the appropriate shielding technologies (and built the shields) controlled by the Lunatics are lased into oblivion. Then, ala Colonization again, the Earth-derived military units start showing up to reassert control.
Each player's interface with their former home faction depends on the path they've taken up until now. Those who declared independence on their own previous to loss of contact are in the best position, because there is already a tacit acceptance of their independent standing. Those who resisted Lunacy and remained terrestrially focused have to deal with their faction trying to reassert control. They can either try to buy them off, buy time, paying lip service and sending tech/materials down or fight. Those who went for the sci-fi fun techs of Lunacy are facing all out war with all 5 earth factions.
This is the final phase of the game. Can you survive the reunification of the Moon? Will Lunacy and Lunar Supremacy keep hold of the great rock above Earth's heads? Will Earth nuke the moon into a radioactive heap? Will the Lunatics destroy Earth's ecology and doom their mother planet to extinction? Will you manage to survive as an Independent, proud and free, pioneer of the last great frontier (until the mars mod comes out). Lots of possibilities. It's in Phase 4 that we determine victors.
The triggers for Phase 1-2, 2-3 (and if there will be a Lunacy phase at all), and phase 3-4 would be settable via map options at the beginning (certain turn, predetermined tech, random after so many turns, any other benchmark we came up with).
Anyway, this is sort of a rough description of the mod which has been poisoning my mind when I look at SOM.
JBG said:
The Play Now! scripts are not in Python, AFAIK (at least not in files we have). You can try to insert newlines (try <br/> or maybe \n) into the text constants for those factions in the XML and see if that works.
Otherwise, I believe there is nothing I can do.
Your Lunacy sounds good so far Belizan. It's up to JBG how we proceed with the polishing. Now that I have a better understanding of how powerful Python is and what you and Matt can do with it most everything is possible and it's likely we can remove some of the XML shortcuts we tried.
When is Debris coming?
When is Debris coming?
From my source file notes here....
# Dance Card:
# Caravans
# Great Statesman -- Free Civic
# Terrain Attrition
# Granted Promotions by Range from Improvement
# Granted Promotions by Range from Unit
# Granted Promotions by Range from Building
# He3 Exchange
# Events--
# Impacts
# Meteorite Storms
# Solar Flares
# Bore Mine accidents
# "Dust Storms"
# Moonquakes
# SATs/ASATs
# New Goody Types--
# Crash Site
# Impact Crater
# Salvage
# Introduce Breakdowns (from Attition of mechanical units)
#
# Dance Card:
# Caravans
# Great Statesman -- Free Civic
# Terrain Attrition
# Granted Promotions by Range from Improvement
# Granted Promotions by Range from Unit
# Granted Promotions by Range from Building
# He3 Exchange
# Events--
# Impacts
# Meteorite Storms
# Solar Flares
# Bore Mine accidents
# "Dust Storms"
# Moonquakes
# SATs/ASATs
# New Goody Types--
# Crash Site
# Impact Crater
# Salvage
# Introduce Breakdowns (from Attition of mechanical units)
#
JBG
Prince
Wow, Belizan. I like what you suggest very much, although... 
that's a lot to get through.
As I mentioned, there are three major conflicts that I have/am written/writing into the backstory. In rough chronological order they are:
World War Three: A coup in China results in a massive military buildup. The man who led the coup could (perhaps) for the sake of simplicity be described as a communist Hitler, and the three other Asian superpowers (Russia, India and Japan) start getting wary. WWIII is fought by China, Indonesia, North Korea, and a rebellious faction in Russia, against pretty much the rest of the world. Chines forces overrun much of eastern Russia (with the aid of the rebels), and reach as far as the Black Sea before the UN can effectively stop them. A number of major battles are fought, including the first major Chinese defeat at the Siege of Mumbai (where the Indians were assisted by European and American forces), the Battle of the Bismarck Sea (where the Royal Navy and American forces help prevent a Chinese/Indonesian invasion of Australia), the Battle of Denver (where the Chinese spectacularly overreach and land on mainland USA - they are far too overstretched and the US armed forces overrun and obliterate them at Denver) and the climactic St George's Day Landings where a vast UN force led by America, France, Britain, Russia and India lands at Hong Kong and decapitates the Chao regime, bringing WWIII to an end. The conflict essentially scuppers China and Japan as major powers, and also half-bankrupts the US. Europe, which is the only area never really affected by the war, gains in importance while the playing field is slightly more leveled between the US and the rest of the world. India and Russia start exhibiting superpower properties too.
The First and Second Islamic Wars of Unification are a pair of extremely nasty conflicts in the Muslim world, affecting an area from Morrocco to Pakistan as squabbling Islamic sects war amongst themselves. While reasonably contained (insofar as a conflict in an area 6,000 miles across can be called contained) they rock Africa and the Middle East, and are a direct and catastrophic result of decades of terrorism, incompetence on behalf of the West, and general economic and social stagnation.
WWIII, incidentally, does not go nuclear due to swift Russian occupation of the majority of Chinese nuclear facilities, and the general fear of nuclear war on both sides.
Any of those three conflicts could be significant enough to make the world forget about the Moon - although I would be inclined to go with WWIII myself. Following the war a long period of depression ensued, and it's only until hydrogen and fusion power becomes widely accessible that the world begins to recover - only to be hit by the increasing effects of global warming. 'tis not a pretty future we have, I fear...
that's a lot to get through.As I mentioned, there are three major conflicts that I have/am written/writing into the backstory. In rough chronological order they are:
World War Three: A coup in China results in a massive military buildup. The man who led the coup could (perhaps) for the sake of simplicity be described as a communist Hitler, and the three other Asian superpowers (Russia, India and Japan) start getting wary. WWIII is fought by China, Indonesia, North Korea, and a rebellious faction in Russia, against pretty much the rest of the world. Chines forces overrun much of eastern Russia (with the aid of the rebels), and reach as far as the Black Sea before the UN can effectively stop them. A number of major battles are fought, including the first major Chinese defeat at the Siege of Mumbai (where the Indians were assisted by European and American forces), the Battle of the Bismarck Sea (where the Royal Navy and American forces help prevent a Chinese/Indonesian invasion of Australia), the Battle of Denver (where the Chinese spectacularly overreach and land on mainland USA - they are far too overstretched and the US armed forces overrun and obliterate them at Denver) and the climactic St George's Day Landings where a vast UN force led by America, France, Britain, Russia and India lands at Hong Kong and decapitates the Chao regime, bringing WWIII to an end. The conflict essentially scuppers China and Japan as major powers, and also half-bankrupts the US. Europe, which is the only area never really affected by the war, gains in importance while the playing field is slightly more leveled between the US and the rest of the world. India and Russia start exhibiting superpower properties too.
The First and Second Islamic Wars of Unification are a pair of extremely nasty conflicts in the Muslim world, affecting an area from Morrocco to Pakistan as squabbling Islamic sects war amongst themselves. While reasonably contained (insofar as a conflict in an area 6,000 miles across can be called contained) they rock Africa and the Middle East, and are a direct and catastrophic result of decades of terrorism, incompetence on behalf of the West, and general economic and social stagnation.
WWIII, incidentally, does not go nuclear due to swift Russian occupation of the majority of Chinese nuclear facilities, and the general fear of nuclear war on both sides.
Any of those three conflicts could be significant enough to make the world forget about the Moon - although I would be inclined to go with WWIII myself. Following the war a long period of depression ensued, and it's only until hydrogen and fusion power becomes widely accessible that the world begins to recover - only to be hit by the increasing effects of global warming. 'tis not a pretty future we have, I fear...
JBG
Prince
Oh, and as for the filegone link, I had exactly the same problems as I did with Matthewv's. I suggest you send me *only* the edited files, so as to restrict the size of the *.rar - it seems that it can't cope with files bigger than 16MB.
Ok, this one is 4Mb, let's try that. Just going to link it here for convenience.
http://www.filegone.com/m4xl
*sob* the Sun is coming up
http://www.filegone.com/m4xl
*sob* the Sun is coming up
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