Random disasters: THE VOTE.

[MeatWad]

What about earthquakes and tsunami?

 

[masterofdragons]

Just take a look at Africa, Europe, and Asia, and its past 75 years, the Modern Era. "Ethnic cleansing" has happened repeatedly in both Europe and Africa, where 100,000+ (up to 1,000,000) people are killed in a year or less each time. Over 5,000,000 people have died in floods in Asia alone over the past 75 years. Earthquakes worldwide have had a similar death toll. We are in the middle of an AIDS epidemic that has killed millions. These should definitely be a factor in a Civilization game that stresses "standing the test of time", Nature and Man's own destructiveness included.

 

[sir_schwick]

Just take a look at Africa, Europe, and Asia, and its past 75 years, the Modern Era. "Ethnic cleansing" has happened repeatedly in both Europe and Africa, where 100,000+ (up to 1,000,000) people are killed in a year or less each time. Over 5,000,000 people have died in floods in Asia alone over the past 75 years. Earthquakes worldwide have had a similar death toll. We are in the middle of an AIDS epidemic that has killed millions. These should definitely be a factor in a Civilization game that stresses "standing the test of time", Nature and Man's own destructiveness included.

5000000 sounds like a lot until you add it up and realize that 5 million is less than 1% of the population of China alone, much less Asia. Ethnic cleansing has not really done much to curb population growth. Overpopulation is the major ailment of the modern era city. But, yes I still think their should be one good sized Epidemic in the modern era, Typhoid or something.

 

[Pariah]

Thanks for voting, folks. Nice to see that the majority are willing to contemplate at least some level of natural catastrophism in the game: it shows that, even if we are gamers at heart, we are prepared to live in the real world.

 

[Stid]

im all in favour of disasters so long as there are certain warnin signs even if they are years prehand.and enviromentalist advisor maybe who warms you of increasing pollution and possible effects within ur empire.it would be annoyin gettin so far n then gettin totally ****ed by something u hav no control over as mentioned above.

 

[sir_schwick]

I think it would be a lot more fun if severe weather was represented by pseudo-units as I will explain. They will be silly, considering weather usually lasts less than a week, but movement rates are already silly.

Hurricanes:
They start in the middle of the ocean and move towards a random coast.
They start at strength one. Each full unit of strength past the first adds one to the radius. Here is the rate at which they gain/lose strength based on terrain the eye passes over. They move at one square per turn.
-Ocean- +.2
-Sea- +.1
-Coast- 0
-Land- -1.0
-Hills or Mountains- -2.0
Ships hit by a hurricane are bombarded at (B/F) (S+2)/4 lethal.
Units in the path of a hurricane cannot move.
Terrain squares cannot be worked.
Roads and railroads are flooding, nullifying their connection and movement effects.
Cities halt production and excess food production. All sea squares produce nothing.
After the hurricane passes the city, the city must build a 'reconstruction project'. This porject can be built or paid for in gold. This project can use shields allocated toward the current project. Reconstruction costs are equal to 5% of the total shields of improvements in the city. If shields from the current project are not used, then that project can be restarted at the point it was discontinued.

Tornadoes:
Has 6 MP a turn. Ends as soon as it hits a coast or a mountain. Moves erractically.
Terrain squares hit by the tornado cannot be used the turn they were hit.
Units are stopped if hit by a tornado.
Cities hit by a tornado have to build a reconstruction project or pay the equivalent in gold.

Locusts:
Swarms have different size, but look like a flock of flies. They move 2MP per turn. Any square they hit does not produce food that turn. You can combat them with workers once you discover Scientific Method.

Wild Fires:
Fires take a certain amount of time to ignite another square. Here is a terrain table.
Terrain Type-Ignition Exposure Time-Burn Time
Forest-5-20
Jungle-8-20
Marsh-15-10
Plains-20-5
Grassland-16-8
Hills-20-5
Mountains-30-5
Crossing rivers doubles the ignition time. You can use workers with the appropriate techs to try and fight fires or create blocks that will increase ignition time.
Fires burn all improvements except roads/railroads. They raze cities.

 

[crimson238]

I would like to see Volcanos. A lot of gemstones are found in the remains of volcanos, so the draw of that luxury could cause you to build near a mountain. All mountain/hills that have a gemstone on them have a % chance of being an active volcano. If it is one, when the lava erupts (at a random time in the game.. it may even happen while you're not there), the flow would move away from mountains for 1 square. It would destory all units, infostructure, or cities that it hits (so if oyu build on the plains next to the mountain, and the lava flowed that way, you're in trou ble, but if you built on the plains to the opposite side of where it went you're fine), and convert the terrain. if there was a forrest/grassland there, it woudl turn it to plains, plains would stya the same, also, the mountain where the volcano erupted woudl be converted to a hill (symbolizing both that the ash in the aftermath is more fertile {more food} and that in many cases {mount saint helens} the blast severly decreased the size of the original dome)
But, as I voted, i think this should be an option able to be trurned off. As far as weather goes, leave it out, else you'll be going bonkers when you can't bombard due to cloud cover. As far as things like an influenza pandemic, or the black death; they're interesting ideas, but, they shouldn't be implemented on any mass scale. if anything it will only effect the 1 city where it originates and the cities immidiatly surrounding it.. then die off.
my 2 cents.

 

[CiverDan]

I like the concept of other random events.

Ice Age: I like the concept of changing climate, as climate has changed over the 1000's of years Look at teh last millenimum, where Places like greenland were setted early, then 1400-1700, climate was cooler and those places became uninhabitable.
Having terrain change from plains to tundra, arsh to ocean(this is happing near New Orleans now) would add a new element to the game.

Asteroid & comet impacts: Also Plausable. The Tunguska even in Russia is sometimes forgotten because it happened in Siberia. This could have flattened a city if it happened elsewhere, or at least ruined good farmland.

UFO's: No. Even today it is unrealistic to be able to stop such a thing. Forget ID4 and junk like that.

Earthquake, hurricanes, floods, etc.: Definately. I would also like to see these more frequently in earlier times, due to the time passing quicker. I think this would slow tech progress (like if I have to rebuild my library 3 times in 100 turns) and expansion (damn my granary got flooded out).

 

[CowCapone]

Disasters would be cool. As long as you have the option to turn them off and on. Have it set up sort of like alpha centauri where good and bad happens.

 

[ManOfMiracles]

Fires burn all improvements except roads/railroads. They raze cities.

That would mean a forest fire could destroy the Pyramids.
Other than that, I like your suggestions.

 

[sir_schwick]

That would mean a forest fire could destroy the Pyramids.
Other than that, I like your suggestions.

Oh yeah, it would be a real problem if wonders were in a city you could not save. An obvious solution to that is make certain, or all wonders since it helps gameplay, immune to bombardment, razing, fires and other such events. If the city around a wonder is destroyed, it belongs to whoever owns the territory it sits on.

But, as I voted, i think this should be an option able to be trurned off. As far as weather goes, leave it out, else you'll be going bonkers when you can't bombard due to cloud cover. As far as things like an influenza pandemic, or the black death; they're interesting ideas, but, they shouldn't be implemented on any mass scale. if anything it will only effect the 1 city where it originates and the cities immidiatly surrounding it.. then die off.
my 2 cents.

I do not like 1 city effects because they are rather abstract and hard to predict. A hurricane on the other hand you will see coming for many many turns, especially if you have weather satellites up. Historically weather was a very important part of war. Extreme blizzards and the winter in general protected Russia two times from invasion(it did not help them against Barbarossa). Typhoons(hurricanes for simplicity in a Civ 4 model) protected Japan from mongol invaders(in myth) twice. A prudent commander would use weather and insect swarms to his advantage when attacking or defending.

 

[bob rulz]

I created a topic in here that was a bunch of random Civ4 ideas of my own, but as far as I can tell no one responded to it! It had a lot of good ideas on natural disasters in there (and others as well).

FLOOD-Lasts 2 or 3 turns, occurs along the enbankments of a river, can kill several citizens of a city, but not destroy a city. Destroys irrigation ditches, mines, railroads, roads, etc. After the flood there is a chance of disease. Sanitation and a hospital in the city reduce the chance of disease considerably. Some sort of advance warning. Can be controlled by building a dam on cities along that river.

GREAT FLOOD-Extreme versions of floods. Can completely ruin an empire's agricultural heart. Some sort of advance warning. Dams can control them, but they may burst.

EARTHQUAKE-Split into three different intensities ranging from minimal damage (destroy a couple of city improvements, trigger a few landslides) to extreme damage (flatten smaller cities and ruin larger cities, trigger multiple landslides).

VOLCANO-Explode periodically, causes pollution in nearby squares and degenerates health in nearby cities from smoke clouds. Multiple intensities. Volcanoes can also spawn minimal-intensity earthquakes.

DROUGHT-Ruin food produciton over a large area and a long time.

ICE AGE-Tundra creeps toward Equator. Icebergs and sea ice creep toward Equator.

GLOBAL WARMING-Caused by too much pollution and cutting down too many forests and jungles. Can melt sea ice and flood coastal areas (including possibly creating new islands by cutting off isthmuses and forcibly disbanding coastal cities).

WILDFIRES-Degenrates health by creating smoke clouds. Burns forests, grasslands, and plains. Can spread over a large area if not controlled. Can be controlled by building a fire station in nearby cities. Before fire stations come around there is little you can do.

 

[socralynnek]

I would like to see Volcanos.
my 2 cents.

Volcanos are already in Civ3 Conquests

 

[sir_schwick]

I created a topic in here that was a bunch of random Civ4 ideas of my own, but as far as I can tell no one responded to it! It had a lot of good ideas on natural disasters in there (and others as well).

FLOOD-Lasts 2 or 3 turns, occurs along the enbankments of a river, can kill several citizens of a city, but not destroy a city. Destroys irrigation ditches, mines, railroads, roads, etc. After the flood there is a chance of disease. Sanitation and a hospital in the city reduce the chance of disease considerably. Some sort of advance warning. Can be controlled by building a dam on cities along that river.

GREAT FLOOD-Extreme versions of floods. Can completely ruin an empire's agricultural heart. Some sort of advance warning. Dams can control them, but they may burst.

EARTHQUAKE-Split into three different intensities ranging from minimal damage (destroy a couple of city improvements, trigger a few landslides) to extreme damage (flatten smaller cities and ruin larger cities, trigger multiple landslides).

VOLCANO-Explode periodically, causes pollution in nearby squares and degenerates health in nearby cities from smoke clouds. Multiple intensities. Volcanoes can also spawn minimal-intensity earthquakes.

DROUGHT-Ruin food produciton over a large area and a long time.

ICE AGE-Tundra creeps toward Equator. Icebergs and sea ice creep toward Equator.

GLOBAL WARMING-Caused by too much pollution and cutting down too many forests and jungles. Can melt sea ice and flood coastal areas (including possibly creating new islands by cutting off isthmuses and forcibly disbanding coastal cities).

WILDFIRES-Degenrates health by creating smoke clouds. Burns forests, grasslands, and plains. Can spread over a large area if not controlled. Can be controlled by building a fire station in nearby cities. Before fire stations come around there is little you can do.

I kinda like WILDFIRES, see if you like my model from earlier.
GLOBAL WARMING, this is kinda already implemented in C3C.
ICE AGE, unrealistic, since the last ice age was only 10000 years ago. It could be fun though, creeping tundra and all.
DROUGHT, kinda debalitating. I personally prefer locusts, mostly becuase of the sound effects you could use.
EARTHQUAKE, random and game-ruining, no thank you. Disasters should not destroy anything, but rather maek life difficult for a few turns. That is why my hurricanes do not destroy, but rather require reconstruction.
FLOODS, playing SimCity a lot huh? FLoods should only not allow use fo the terrain for a few turns. They should not kill citizens or destroy terrain improvements. Could even be on a rough schedule, one an opponent could use to plan attacks.
GREAT FLOODS, once again, SimCity? Same issues, only this is really game-ending. Great for a simulation, but not Civ 4.

 

[Haradrim]

No 'Ice Age' should be implemented. Ice Ages would last longer than the game itself. Play a cool climate game instead. Moderate climate fluctuations would be better. These may shift 1 or 2 grassland tiles to tundra tiles. Hot year would cause deserts to creep north. Wet year would cause marshes and jungles to grow, etc.
It would all need to be implemented in a dynamic map.

 

[bob rulz]

Oh yes, I forgot to say on my post that you should have an option to turn them off, and also have a calm world (few natural disasters, no great floods or intense earthquakes), moderate world (more like Earth), and severe world (lots of natural disasters). Also, I should have put hurricanes in there. Multiple squares and multiple turns, moving from ocean to land and then dissipating, with multiple intensities (tropical storm, hurricane, cyclone), and tornadoes, one square and one turn but bad damage. Calm worlds would have no powerful hurricanes or devastating tornadoes either.

EDIT: And calm worlds would not flood cities or isolate them into islands in case of global warming either.

 

[sir_schwick]

I do see your point that Ice Ages shoudl not be so extreme, but I would like to see climate shifts last longer than a couple turns. Your advisors could say, 'The Oracle said the cold spirit of the north will descend further upon this land'. 'Scientists believe that the Earth is getting colder'. Etc. Then each turn one square of tundra would creep north or south from the source. The creep should only extend a couple squares in either direction, but it would take awhile for all squares that could to creep.

You could also have Natural or Man-made warming, probably before or after a cool-down. It woudl be the reverse, with plaina sand grassland creeping on the tundra land. Since these climate shifts only change one square at a time, you would notice the effect over a few dozne turns.

You would also have natural forest expansion. This would occur near already existing forests and on flat, fertile ground. Any square completely surrounded by forest automatically is forested/jungled. Squares with 4 or more forest neighbors have a 50% chance. 2-3 neighbors is 10%. 1 neighbor is 1%.

Deserts would creep at 1 square every turn for every 5 squares in a particular desert. If less than 5 squares, no creep. Thus only large deserts would creep, but deserts cannot creep into forests, mountains, and hills.

 

[bob rulz]

I actually think that there should be certain types of mountains and hills (desert hills, tundra hills, normal (grassland) hills, and forested hills for example).

 

[Paradigne]

I like the ideas, but ALL should be able to be turned on and off. Not only whether they happen at all, but to what magnitude. I also like (God help me) the UFO angle. It could actually have 2 consequences, damage your terrain (or city), and possibly provide a new tech
"A UFO crashes into Moscows cathedral completely destroying it. Upon investigation scientist discover VELCRO"

 

[sir_schwick]

I like the ideas, but ALL should be able to be turned on and off. Not only whether they happen at all, but to what magnitude. I also like (God help me) the UFO angle. It could actually have 2 consequences, damage your terrain (or city), and possibly provide a new tech

I am sorry, but this seems a bit too much like SimCivilization.