Realistic Dates by Era

[strategyonly]

Is there anyone out there that wants to tackle the dates in C2C. They are currently not working correctly, and lot of people need/want better dates set in accordance with the era.

If you want to tackle this, lets give it a try, what you say? Maybe even just ONE "era" at a time if you want, but something is better than nothing, PLUS it also needs to be done by gamespeed to balance things out, i believe.

 

[Dissonance]

As mentioned before, I don't do coding (at least yet) but I'd like to help.

From your post, it sounds like you want to have the dates affected by the era, as opposed to the current arbitraty "5000AD". Is that correct?

 

[strategyonly]

As mentioned before, I don't do coding (at least yet) but I'd like to help.

From your post, it sounds like you want to have the dates affected by the era, as opposed to the current arbitrary "5000AD". Is that correct?

Actually they need to completely MATCH up together, i am tired of having Musketmen in 3000 or even 300 BC when it should be around the 14th century Medieval times or so, except for Japan of course.

 

[SargontheGreat2]

So these might be aprroximate dates

50000 B.C- 6000 B.C Prehistoric
6000 B.C- 600 B.C Ancient
600 B.C- 500 A.D Classical
500 A.D- 1500 A.D Medieval
1500 A.D- 1800 A.D Renaissance
1800 A.D- 1900 A.D Industrial
1900 A.D- 2000 A.D Modern
2000 A.D- 2200 A.D Transhuman
2200 A.D- 5000+ A.D Galactic

 

[Hydromancerx]

I think this is a loaded questions. Realistic dates to whom? Lets take the 1500's. Cortez of Spain was on the tech tree around Early Renaissance. He had early guns and could cross the ocean in ships. Montezuma on the other hand also was alive then and for the Aztecs I would say were still behind in the Classical era of the tree. They had Calendar and City Planning, but had not had techs like Iron Working or anything related to Horses (because there were none).

So where would the date be set at? For the player or the leader? If I am Montezuma is the date in the 1500 AD or 500 BC when I meet Cortez? Because if its by say the Greek Classical Era I would be in around 500 BC, not 1500 AD.

 

[SargontheGreat2]

I think the most advanced Civ, because history is written by the winners

 

[Dissonance]

Actually they need to completely MATCH up together, i am tired of having Musketmen in 3000 or even 300 BC when it should be around the 14th century Medieval times or so, except for Japan of course.

I'm afraid I don't understand what this means. I'll hazard a guess - figure out what period the Ages should describe, and tailor the tech (number of, and cost of) to usually appear at that age. Did I get that right?


Alternatively, have you considered splitting away from Civ's date tracking alltogether? I don't know if that's even *possible* but it could be interesting if changing of date tracking. For example, prehistoric tracking could be "Year of Winter", "Season of the Wolf" etc. Moving into Ancient would set the date to 0, reign of the leader/capital. Moving into Classical would once more reset the age to 0, with maybe a third reset into Medieval and a final reset into Trans-Human.

 

[SargontheGreat2]

That would be cool, however, the team is backlogged enough. That idea would be very far down on the priority list. But that would be AWESOME!

 

[ls612]

How bad are the dates? I know that after Industrial things get a bit ridiculous, but before that I was under the impression that things were pretty good, which is why I haven't changed the dates since last fall.

Here are my general targets for timelines

Prehistoric: 50 KBC - 8000 BC
Ancient: 8000 BC - 1000 BC
Classical: 1000 BC - 500 AD
Medieval: 500 AD - 1300 AD
Renaissance: 1300 AD - 1800 AD
Industrial: 1800 AD - 1950 AD
Modern: 1950 AD - 2020 AD
TH: 2020 AD - 2200 AD
Galactic: Post 2200 AD (I don't remember where the timeline ends)

 

[Hydromancerx]

I think the most advanced Civ, because history is written by the winners

Ok then so lets take China or the Middle East during the Dark Ages of Europe. They would be considered in the Renaissance era then. And if you were playing as a European civ during this the date would be in say 1500s (because of the leader) instead of say 1200's which would be more historically accurate for your tech level.

Also what happens if a leading civ dies? Will time just stop? Or even go backwards if say Montezuma destroyed Spain?

 

[SargontheGreat2]

Ok then so lets take China or the Middle East during the Dark Ages of Europe. They would be considered in the Renaissance era then. And if you were playing as a European civ during this the date would be in say 1500s (because of the leader) instead of say 1200's which would be more historically accurate for your tech level.

Also what happens if a leading civ dies? Will time just stop? Or even go backwards if say Montezuma destroyed Spain?

Each timeline is different, what can I say, time marches on.

 

[Dissonance]

Hmm... If this helps at all, let me try to think of iconic Western civilizations and look at their timelines. I'll post links here, and try to put it into a spreadsheet later.

(Unrelated interesting link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_group)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homo_sapiens
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_human_evolution

First migration of Homo sapiens around 60,000 BC. Second around 50,000 BC and final (major) migration around 40,000 BC. Sounds like a good start date.
Neanderthals went extinct around 25,000 BC. By this point humans would have started advancing noticeably.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sedentism
For transition into Ancient age. Early settlements occured at APPROXIMATELY 10,000 BC. More common settlements occured around 5,000 BC

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stone_Age

Lasted for an extremely long time, ending between 4,500 BC and 2,000 BC - as a result of metalworking. So, middle Ancient Age.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Egypt

Iconic Ancient Age civilization. Lasted from approx. 3,150 BC to 300 BC.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Babylon

Babylon settled around 1900 BC. Lasted until about 500 BC. Had technologies such as masonry, stone tablets, writing, basic astronomy, chariots, composite bows.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Greece

From about 800 BC to 600 BC. Major cultural developments akin to very late Ancient/early Classical

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_ancient_Rome

Iconic Classical Age civilization. Approximately 700 BC to 600 AD

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byzantine

Classical to Medieval empire, 300 AD to 1200 AD

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Roman_Empire

Fairly iconic late Medieval Age empire. 900 AD to 1500 AD.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottoman_empire

Late Medieval to late Renaissance (lasted longer, but covers a major period) 1300 AD to 1600 AD

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Republic_of_Venice

One of the spots for Renaissance, APPROXIMATELY 1500 AD to 1800 AD (may need clarification)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Agricultural_Revolution

Early Industrial age, taking roots in 1,400 AD and all the way into 1800's

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Factory

Industrial Age, circa 1,700 AD

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microchip

Modern Age, 1949 (same as ls612)


There, a LOT of links and dates for references.

 

[Dissonance]

Ok then so lets take China or the Middle East during the Dark Ages of Europe. They would be considered in the Renaissance era then. And if you were playing as a European civ during this the date would be in say 1500s (because of the leader) instead of say 1200's which would be more historically accurate for your tech level.

Also what happens if a leading civ dies? Will time just stop? Or even go backwards if say Montezuma destroyed Spain?

What if the first age advance sets the date? This way, if the leading civ dies out or falls behind, the NEXT person to advance into the next age will control the flow of time.

EDIT: I believe Civilization: Call to Power did just that with ages. The first to discover a relevant technology set the whole world into that age Epoch.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Hmm that would be better. However how slow would time progress then? Let's say a lead civ dies right before the next era? And the only civ that can catch up is an era behind? Would the timer keep breaking down into smaller and smaller time but never reaching the next era's date?

 

[SargontheGreat2]

It should advance at a steady rate

 

[Yudishtira]

Hmm that would be better. However how slow would time progress then? Let's say a lead civ dies right before the next era? And the only civ that can catch up is an era behind? Would the timer keep breaking down into smaller and smaller time but never reaching the next era's date?

I don't think there's any danger of an era coming late! And if it did, I personally wouldn't mind as it would make quite a change - which really is as good as a holiday sometimes!

The Ancient era seems to come at about the right time, although I guess mid-late 5th millennium BC might be more ideal than 7th or 8th. After that things really speed up, so that you are pretty much guaranteed to be in the Medieval while still in the BCs.

This is going to be affected by difficulty level, and I don't think there's anything you can do about that. I suggest the balancing should aim to 'fix' Monarch or Emperor. Then again the AIs are playing at Noble, are they not?

Since I always start on Noble or below and work my way up, I'll shut up now...

ETA: (now how to work one of MY pet peeves in here...oooh I know) And the first thing you can fix is the early circumnavigation given by Catamarans. You can compete for the earliest circumnavigation by all means, but it should not repeat not be before 2000BC!

 

[strategyonly]

How bad are the dates? I know that after Industrial things get a bit ridiculous, but before that I was under the impression that things were pretty good, which is why I haven't changed the dates since last fall.

Here are my general targets for timelines

Prehistoric: 50 KBC - 8000 BC
Ancient: 8000 BC - 1000 BC
Classical: 1000 BC - 500 AD
Medieval: 500 AD - 1300 AD
Renaissance: 1300 AD - 1800 AD
Industrial: 1800 AD - 1950 AD
Modern: 1950 AD - 2020 AD
TH: 2020 AD - 2200 AD
Galactic: Post 2200 AD (I don't remember where the timeline ends)

Now i like these date, but i am playing on SNAIL, i am in Renaissance Era and still it says BC?? see attached??

 

[DRJ]

I am playing Deity/Eternity and I just researched Philosophy around 4000 BC...


I think the numbers of turns is fine but once tech trading sets in the progress comes quicker thats why a few thousand years are cut maybe.

 

[strategyonly]

I wonder if THIS would be better???

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=12610009&postcount=437

 

[Thunderbrd]

Time for the annual re-balancing act on our ages eh? lol... staying out of this one. I did one of the earlier ones and was quite a complexity. ls612 did quite well with this last time but it has drifted off that course, which is quite normal.