Regent Help Needed!

Jagus

Chieftain
Joined
Sep 3, 2008
Messages
5
I picked up the simply packaged version of CIV3 years ago at Walmart, but moved shortly after buying it. I recently found it in a box while unpacking. I don't have any literature on this game. I started on Chieftain and scored cultural, domination, and space race victories. Then I moved to Warlord, experienced some frustration in several games during later periods, but was able to score many domination victories. So I jumped to Regent and nearly broke my computer. I've read this site many times for tips and tried to implement them. But no matter what I do there is always something out there mucking up my game. My last great start saw me leading the way in culture and science with a decent reserve of cash (as opposed to my other games). I thought I had the computer at this level finally. But my ONE weak point was defense. And raging barbs of 24 units hit my two expansion cities that were protected from the other civs as I did a backward expansion with a strong front and no ships on the screen. They stole all my cash and I finally registered on this site to get some tips. I've tried several civs, but I am most comfortable with Americans.

I'm now starting an American Standard Regent Pangaea (land mass choice is the furthest left option) with a normal climate, temperate temp, and 4 bil. It'll have roaming barbs, 7 opposing random civs, and all defaults checked but accelerated production. It's on the east of a land mass with a bordering river. The nine tiles are: Grassland, Mountain, Coast, Mountain, Hills, Coast, Grassland, Moutain, Coast. The city is on the hills tile. Total values of the tiles are: Food-7, Shield-6, Gold-10.

I'll be saving several versions of this scenerio to get a grip on Regent. The big guns are out now :).

Quick questions: 1. Why/should I be changing the palace? I've never done this. 2. What early wonders should I make a priority? I've always liked the idea of getting Pyramids (to avoid building granaries) and storm my tech tree toward the Great Library. But everyone wants Lit (or luxuries) when I do this, and often starts wars with me when I don't cave. 3. I'd relish tech tree advise as I do the above or take the lowest cost usually. 4. If you have the G. Library do you get the tech advances of civs that you haven't contacted yet? example: I'm on an island with two other civs and get the library. 5. Why do some of my cities take so long to build things, and can I control that to my benefit?

My style: I usually try to expand quickly and keep two def in a city with an intial def of 1. I utilize catapults as defense on border cities and man them with a sword/horse combo to strike at attacks before they get to my city while hurting them when they attack. I build a worker for each city (maybe too quickly as they are done within three rounds of building with another def and a temple/library. I try to build temples, libraries, and univ. quickly to get culture, expand borders, and swing other civ cities to me. I do prebuilding out of common sense, but usually lose out on the prebuild toward a wonder to another civ and lose a lot of wonders that are a turn or two away to really tick me off. I'm not afraid of war, but they last a lot longer than I want them to.

Any help will be greatly appreciated. And I apologize for the looooong post, but wanted my first post to be as detailed as possible.
 
Quick questions: 1. Why/should I be changing the palace? I've never done this. 2. What early wonders should I make a priority? I've always liked the idea of getting Pyramids (to avoid building granaries) and storm my tech tree toward the Great Library. But everyone wants Lit (or luxuries) when I do this, and often starts wars with me when I don't cave. 3. I'd relish tech tree advise as I do the above or take the lowest cost usually. 4. If you have the G. Library do you get the tech advances of civs that you haven't contacted yet? example: I'm on an island with two other civs and get the library. 5. Why do some of my cities take so long to build things, and can I control that to my benefit?

I'll start with your questions: 1. If your palace is on a coast, you don't get full benefits from it. Moving it inland where it is the center of 2 or more rings gets the biggest benefits. 2. No wonders, early wonders use up production that slows your growth. You suffer from Wonder Addiction. However, wonders are fine if you want a 20k victory, just build them all in one core city after rushing a temple. 3. Research expensive techs horizontally and use them to trade for other tribes cheaper techs, sometimes Alphabet can get you all first tier techs and Writing can get 2nd tier techs. Government techs are also very valuable to the AI. 4. No, you only get techs from 2 known tribes having a tech. 5. Corruption causes shield waste, red shields which do nothing to help builds. Build the Forbiden Palace in a potentially productive area away from your capital, that creates a second core of low corruption. Rush it with a leader, preferably. Also build Courthouses and Police Stations. Hope that helps.
 
I would say that the Great Lib is probably not a good investment at Regent as you should be able to out research the AI. They will not provide you with techs at a fast enough rate to allow you to stop your own research.

Stopping your own research is the only reason to build the GLB in most games. Build more troops and workers instead.
 
Thanks for some input. I'll try to adjust to this advice by avoiding GLB first. However, it seems that no matter what civ I've used on Regent the AI always has more tech than me. Admittedly, I'll be trading more often as that seems to be the reason. And knowing that I only get the perks from known civs makes a huge difference to my gameplan. Funny update: In the game I started above I've got 3 civs capitals within 12 tiles of mine. Not the best starting point considering I only get 2 cities before they are squeezing me into the corner and forcing me into an early war to get land :).

One follow up question: When I get a leader I always use it to make an army for the Heroic Epic, but don't really see results as I don't get that many GLs despite waging wars with many elites. Would you suggest sticking with this or bypassing the HE to hurry a wonder?
 
You can't hurry wonders with a leader in C3C, but can in C3 or PTW. So, if you are playing a version that allows wonders,, that is usually the best move.

The HE is so so small wonder in a non AW (Always War) game, so I would rush it, only if I had nothing else and could not make another army, due to city count. In an AW game, I want the HE a lot more than a normal game.

If you are being being out researched at Regent, you are doing a few thing less than optimally. 1) you should at least match them in expansion 2) you should be able to manage workers better than the AI 3) you should do a smarter job of managing your towns 4) a better job of waging war.

I am sure that a look at your save would reveal a) too wide of a spacing and probably too much open space in your empire b) too few workers and some doing task that are low priority c) too many spear type units as opposed to attackers d) too many towns building structures they do not need right now and cannot afford.

These are nearly always what one sees in Regent games that are not being won. In the main you do not have to fear the AI on Regent, so no real need to make spears or at least not so many.

Do make vet units, when you make troops after the first few scouting units. Do get out of despotism asap. Do check on the towns after growth to see if citizens are working the correct tiles. The gov will shuffle pop around and often put them on tiles that do not met your needs in that town.

If you are still struggling, make a save at the very start of 4000bc, before you even settle. Play some turns, 40-80 and save again. Post those and get some feed back.

We can surely get you beating the stuffing out of a Regent game.
 
Oh, I remembered something else. Make sure your game is fully updated so that we can use your saves. I believe you want version 1.29f for Vanilla, 1.27f for PTW and 1.22 for Conquests. They are available on the downloads part of this site, but you'll need high speed or access to it.
 
My 2 cents:

First, hit the War Academy. Here are a few articles that I typically recommend for players trying to improve their game:
  • Cracker's Opening Plays
  • Warmongering 101: A Tactical Primer
  • The Four Rules of Wonder Addiction
  • Deity Settlers
Second, when you start a game, figure out how you want to win. Having a victory condition in mind will help you make build and tech decisions. If you want a cultural victory, you're going to need temples & cathedrals. If you're going for conquest, you won't.

Third, play your next game on continents. A Pangaea map increases contact between AI civs and let them trade among themselves. Switch to continents and the AI most likely won't make any contact between the two major continents until significantly later in the game. You, on the other hand, can use suicide galleys to make yourself a tech broker.

Fourth, visit the Succession Games forum. Read some of the SGs and you'll see lots of discussion on strategy & tactics. Very educational material.

Fifth and finally, post a save and some screenshots. Saves will let some of the players around here take a detailed look at your game. I suspect that you're making some of the mistakes that vmxa mentioned. Those are fairly typical in the "Newbie needs help" threads. Screenshots will let people who can't download a game (either because they're playing a different version, or because they're at work) to offer advice based on what they can see in the shot.
 
I appreciate the help so far everyone. The city management was something I was certainly overlooking and the worker were usually automated. I took the first advice and applied it very successfully at the two sizes below standard. By keeping my concepts in tact from this initial thread I added more attackers, kept my defense of two the same, but got them quicker. Things are looking up, although I did suffer a diplomacy loss once. I continued to mess around with the save to alter the UN vote of the 3rd civ, but couldn't. As a test I even offered all my cash (only 350), 2 techs, and every city I owned but my capital (I was the biggest nation) only to have England decline it. That was interesting!
 
*shudder* I hate victory by diplomacy. The computer never sides with the player, it seems.

Many good points in there. Many times on regent I like to get the Great Library more than any of the ancient wonders, esp. if I know a lot of other Civs. You can simply move your science slider to zero and collect bills while the computer gives you free techs!

On that note... you are adjusting the tech slider, right? In the domestic advisor screen, thats the little thingy up top that makes a lot of difference. If you work it right, you will end up with hundreds more gold every few turns. In fact, if you are friendly with other Civs in the middle and late stages of the game, I find it more useful to keep it at zero and just buy new techs off the computer every three turns or so. I can usually beat them to the wonders I want through smart pre-building, at least on Regent. In any case, make sure to consider the sliders in your gameplay. DO NOT leave the science slider in one spot!!
 
capnvonbaron I would say that in a Regent game, one should not stop self researching. The AI is too slow and you do to need to pile up cash at this level.
 
. . . . DO NOT leave the science slider in one spot!!
To this I would add: As a general rule, do not research at ~50%. IMO, you should either run a very low (0-20%) science slider, with an eye to buying techs, or you should run a high science slider, and be a seller of techs. The middle ground is too slow to sell techs well and leaves you too poor to buy them.
 
capnvonbaron I would say that in a Regent game, one should not stop self researching. The AI is too slow and you do to need to pile up cash at this level.

Depends. In my version on regent, I play with the max number of civs and on pangea and continents the computer shares techs with each other a lot. Usually this means they outgun me. However, they still sell techs for fairly cheap, especially if they're friendly toward you. You can even 'broker' techs by buying them off one guy for a bunch of gold and sell it to a third-tier civ a few turns later for all of their cash, maps, or resources. And, when you sell to one civ, may as well sell to all civs since they'll just buy and sell amongst themselves for a lot greater discount.
 
capnvonbaron I have never seen a Regent game of any type of map that they could keep their tech pace up to mine after they get out of the AA. The later the game the farther they are behind.

My response was to building the GLB and stopping science, if I did that I would have to wait on them to give me techs and for what? I will not need to pile up gold. Eventually the GLB expires and I have to research anyway.

When you say max civs are you talking about 30 or just the default for a given map size? The larger the map size the higher the tech cost are, so the AI tends to do less well.

To me the only time that I think the GLB is a good idea and will pay for itself is when you are playing Sid or AW. I do not even build it on Deity as its life span is too short. Lower levels I will not stop my science as I do not want to wait on the AI.
 
I usually play large-size maps, max players = 14 if I remember correctly. I don't know about your version, but whether I give techs away or not, the computer always manages to out-research me. Even if all my techs take the minimum 4 turns to research, at least one other civ always has the tech I just got done researching. So my defense is to go after economic wonders like smith's trading and hoover dam and let the computer take the techs. As long as I'm even with the comp players, I can always out-produce them at regent level and beat them militarily and culturally. Plus, since I *have* gold reserves, I can do fun stuff like hurry buildings and conduct espionage...
 
Darn I was running a std map 8 civ game to see if my memory worked. I got to 1575BC and they are down 5 or 6 techs to me now. I used the Americans as I figured they did not give a lot of help like AG or Sci or Comm.

Large maps will just make it easier for the human. I think the default is 12 civs, so do you use an editor to make it 14?

I cannot image a Regent AI doing 4 turn research. I would be surprised if they manage 8 turns.
 
With the americans you can at least hurry scouts out and get stuff from goody huts. And being industrial at least your workers get your infrastructure intact quickly. Americans aren't bad to start with.

Yeah it might be 12, I was just going from memory. Huge is probably 14? Whatever it is, yeah the computer seems to race ahead with techs early on. Later in the game yes, I usually hold even or surpass them, but never by more than a tech or two, and usually I have to backfill and buy things like recycling or advanced flight even then. So, like I said, whatever is going on, I can't run away with techs. I rely on better production, more money, and military prowess. But now we've run away with poor Jay600's thread, maybe its time to quit picking on each others' style of gameplay?
 
Huge is 16 civs, if you are not out researching them by the middle of the Middle Ages, you have done something wrong. Huts are not a big factor on a std continents map as you will not get that many. On a large map you can get a lot more and it is a large factor. If you played out with domination, I would expect to be nearly a full age ahead.

They would never see Recycle, I would not expect them to get much past the IA.
 
What you are saying is what is happening to you, but you should be able to do much better than that. The AI is very inept and without the boost from being above emperor, it just cannot keep up.

It does not matter if you play builder or war style, it will be hapless. If it war, it will fare a lot poorer.

As I said the bigger the map the easier it is for the human. Std map is the best for the AI as that is what the game was designed for. Even going down in size is harder for the AI, that is why you see tiny deity games getting smoked very fast by humans.
 
With the americans you can at least hurry scouts out and get stuff from goody huts. And being industrial at least your workers get your infrastructure intact quickly. Americans aren't bad to start with.

I had not realized at the time you posted thism that you were in vanilla. In C3 Industry was a very strong trait. In C3C it has been reduced so the workers are not as fast as in vanilla. All civs have some useful traits. Huts of course are not a large factor in a std map as you will not have that many and could be blocked by other civs.
 
Back
Top Bottom