Rolling Rolling Rolling

[Toxitalk]

Finally got a computer that would play civ4, so I went out and got the complete version.

WOW.

Now I have falling into the trap of many civ 3 players coming to 4 for the first time (Not building workers straight away).

I don't get time to play often (maybe once a week) so im looking for points in the right direction before tonights game.

Now I have read the thread about the worker,worker,settler strategy.

A couple of questions this brings.

1) May workers auto after creation, im presuming I cant do this if I want them to chop?

2) My idea was to worker, worker, settler. then from the new city do the same again, and then repeat. Will this idea fall over before I run out of space to expand into?

3) I was worried about the idea of lots of undefended cities, so after the 1st city has produced its first settler, I was going to create 3 defensive units (1 for the first city, 1 for the 2nd and 1 ready for the third, with the idea after this point, the city producing the settler for the next city, would have a defensive unit on hand to protect to new city, prior to departure, without slowing down the production of workers or settlers.). This idea is then repeated.

4) Is there a point where you can auto your workers, or can that never be an option.

Cheers

 

[dutchfire]

Automating is never the best thing to do (although it is easy )

I think Worker - Warrior(s) (while growing) - Settler is preferred. Worker first is usually the best. You usually want to build a settler only when your city has grown a bit.

I usually keep 1 unit in every city, or else the city will get unhappiness.

 

[dubrown]

1. Putting a worker on auto is almost never a good idea. You get much more out of it if you manually control them. However, you can que up orders so you don't have to micro the worker after each finished task.

2. Worker first is often a good idea. But it all depends on how the terrain looks. Will the worker have something to do when it's finished? Is there seafood in the bfc and you have fishing, then a workboat first might be better. I often do worker, warrior/scout, warrior, worker, settler or something like that in my landlocked starts. Almost always the worker first atleast, if you have an AI nearby, you might be able to steal the second worker from him and with that get a worker for the cost of a warrior.

3. I wouldn't recommend having any undefended cities, you can safely leave your first city undefended as the AI will not take it this early unless you declare war on them immideately and animals won't enter cultural borders. But as soon as you settle your second city, barbarians starts to appear and then you need defense (unless of course you already have the great wall.)

4. There's only one point in the game when I auto workers, it's after getting railroad, then I put all my spare workers on auto to create trade networks.

 

[troytheface]

Workers on automated will chop unless you go to the options box and click
"automated workers don't chop" or something like that. There is another option that gives "automated workers leave old improvements". If your automating then i suggest clicking those two options unless you want them to chop.

In so far as build order- expansionistic gives a wrker bonus, and of course wrkrs are india's uu. I suggest wrkr first with these- but with anyone else i say warrior, scout.
And your undefended cities are asking for it unless you priortize the Great Wall (the best wonder in the game) and even then enemy AI will be enticed to come and kill you.

 

[Toxitalk]

So the my concept is sort of sound then

city 1(Worker, worker, settler, warrior (for city 1), Warrior (for city 2), warrior (for city 3))

City 2 (gets warrior from city 1, worker, worker, Settler, Warrior (for city 4))

City 3 (gets warrior from city 1, worker, worker, Settler, Warrior (for city 5))

From this point on all new cities have a warrior ready to protect them prior to the creation of the city.

This then creates a new question, are 2 workers per city enough in the early game? (I.E. after this initial build, can I then go on with the normal process if city upgrades etc...)

 

[Quotey]

I'm gonna go with no on the build order. Obviously you don#t wnat the all purpose thing, and you need to be flexible.

Secondly, building 2 workers and a settler will keep you at pop 1 Which means a settler will take around 30 turns with no chopping. A good basic plan (and change it if you need) would be worker, warrior, warrior (chopping out another worker sometime before the settler), until at least pop 3, then 2 workers chopping out a settler. Course, if you have a lot of land you might just go for settlers and let new cities build their own workers.

Oh, and sendng out settlers undefended (by either having no fog around them or no unit on top of them) is a bad, bad idea. In Civ 3 this was a-ok assuming there were AIs about to stop barbs on transit, as barbs could not capture cities.

 

[Yxklyx]

Yeah, sending out a settler by himself is dangerous unless the entire route is fogbusted - use hills intelligently for scouting the area that he's moving to. Leave a scout on a hill for instance. If you want really rapid expansion maybe try to get some chariots that can move 2 along with the settlers. Move settlers one square at a time and end a turn on a hill so that he can see around him. I usually only build one worker in my new cities in the early going.

 

[MyOtherName]

2) My idea was to worker, worker, settler. then from the new city do the same again, and then repeat. Will this idea fall over before I run out of space to expand into?

Depends on:
. Difficulty level
. The amount of space you're filling
. How rapidly you can develop a functional economy.

The key point to observe is the difference between Civ 2/3's mechanics of corruption and Civ 4's mechanic of city maintenance: corruption was bounded by the amount of commerce your city procued. Maintenance knows no such boundary....

 

[Fezzik]

This then creates a new question, are 2 workers per city enough in the early game? (I.E. after this initial build, can I then go on with the normal process if city upgrades etc...)

The general rule of thumb is 1.5 workers per city. But it depends how developed the cities you have already are.

If you have...
a) unimproved tiles you are currently working, cities that aren't connected, or forests you'd like to be chopping, and
b) your current workers will take too long to get to it
...then you need more workers. Simple as that.

I wouldn't build worker-worker-settler in every city. For example, my second city is often a production city near copper. If it has maybe 3 river tiles and lots of hills (low-food), I'd prefer to let it grow while building infrastructure/military and instead make workers in the capital, where there is often 3 food resources. Because the capital has no problem growing and can produce them quickly, especially with whipping. So produce workers/settlers in high-food cities, not necessarily every city.

 

[CivCorpse]

In the beginning I like an average of one worker per city to start unless it is seriously forrested and I can not mine hils or build cottages unless i chop a clear space. In that case 1.5 usually works for me. Two for any city that is trying to chop out a wonder.
If you want to move a settler faster than his warrior escort give him 2 scouts and let a warrior catch up. Until barbs get the blitz promo you can usually get there ok.

 

[Si_Lurker]

You're still in CIV3 rex mentality.

In CIV4 you don't need as many cities to win. You can win emperor space race or noble pangea conquest with just one city.

Building two workers, couple of warriors, scouts, improving land, growing to size 3-5 and then building a settler is a good plan. Spamming settlers after you have 3-4 cities without economy to support it is wrong. you don't want as many cities, you want couple of good core cities. A high production (food, hills) city, great people city (food, some hills to build wonders when not farming), commerce city (floodplains, rivers or green+food). Your 3-4 core cities will build the most military, science, gold for the most of your game.

You only want to grab military resources early and have good cities with resources early on. Rexing is only viable if you play for cultural victory and want to grab 6 cities peacefully early on and then build up culture.

WRT to settler escort, you send warrior first and have settler catch up with him at the city spot roughly. If you're playing multiplayer you will want couple of archers or axemen at the spot before sending out settler and have your workers build road towards the spot in advance. A new city without road connection defended by single archer is too sweet target to pass.

 

[pangu]

In the beginning I like an average of one worker per city to start unless it is seriously forrested and I can not mine hils or build cottages unless i chop a clear space. In that case 1.5 usually works for me. Two for any city that is trying to chop out a wonder.
If you want to move a settler faster than his warrior escort give him 2 scouts and let a warrior catch up. Until barbs get the blitz promo you can usually get there ok.

Man, nice idea! I never thought of that... Basically, 2 scouts escort > 1 archer escort... Faster speed and Higher chance of settler survival.

Thanks for the tip!

 

[Piemaster]

I've never seen the point in building 2 workers off the bat. Your first city won't grow fast enough to work all the tiles improved by 1 worker, let alone 2.

 

[reknaw]

City 2 (gets warrior from city 1, worker, worker, Settler, Warrior (for city 4))
City 3 (gets warrior from city 1, worker, worker, Settler, Warrior (for city 5))

I'd have to say it's a bad idea to let a new city build it's own workers, it won't grow at all in the time it takes to build them. New cities are better off getting a Granary up ASAP, as well as a Monument if you need to border pop and don't have Stonehenge, a religion (w/missionaries), or Caste System.

 

[vale]

I've never seen the point in building 2 workers off the bat. Your first city won't grow fast enough to work all the tiles improved by 1 worker, let alone 2.

But when it does grow it will be into improved tiles always.

The workers can also chop out that first Settler quickly while building warriors and then be ready to connect it and improve it asap. Your second city will frequently be hooking up copper and the faster that is accomplished the faster you can have your army up.

It is situational and not always the optimal play but in some starts I think it works pretty well.