I concur with option 1 as well.
I like this idea as well.
We have two civs out there that we know about. Are we sending a Warrior towards Carthage and an Axe towards Mali?
SGOTM 06 - Xteam
- Thread starter AlanH
- Start date
We have two civs out there that we know about. Are we sending a Warrior towards Carthage and an Axe towards Mali?
Jimmy Thunder
King
I agree with option 1.
I think we should send our warrior to Mali in order to locate the civ borders. This will allow our single axe to get there in the minimum number of turns. Once our warrior reaches Mali he shouldn't enter but rather can scout southward toward where Carthage might be and then fortify on a forest hill next to Carthage.
I like CP's suggestion for builds and worker turns
Frederiksberg's settler ambush is also worthing keeping up our sleeve for the future.
ShannonCT
Deity
OK, as everyone seems to be on board with the single axe gambit, here is my specific plan for turns 25-40:
Turn 25: move worker to copper, work bananas, build warrior
Turn 26: mine copper
Turn 31: Agri->AH, copper mine completed, begin working mine, start axe
Turn 33: Start chopping forest hill
Turn 36: Send warrior2 SE if safe (or NE?)
Turn 37: Chop finished, work bananas for growth
Turn 38: axe done and sent NE, worker moves to forest next to cows
Turn 39: warrior 3 done and pulls guard duty, start axe, start chopping
Turn 40: Pop2, switch to worker
At that point, we would have 5 hammers stored in the axe (we need 7 to be able to whip him, so he would be 2 turns away in case of danger). We would be 5 turns from AH. The chop would be done in 4 turns, and worker 2 would be done in 8 turns with the chop, 12 without. I think I optimized the MMing but let me know if not.
Here's Leif's Test5 save fast forward to Turn 25:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/87280/SGOTM06_Test5_BC-3250.CivWarlordsSave
And here's what it would look like after my plan:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/87280/SGOTM06_Test5_BC-2800.CivWarlordsSave
I'll plan on playing in about 8 hours unless there is some objection.
Warrior 2 could be sent NE around Turn 36 instead of SE. Any earlier and we risk having our copper pillaged and everything thrown off kilter.
Turn 25: move worker to copper, work bananas, build warrior
Turn 26: mine copper
Turn 31: Agri->AH, copper mine completed, begin working mine, start axe
Turn 33: Start chopping forest hill
Turn 36: Send warrior2 SE if safe (or NE?)
Turn 37: Chop finished, work bananas for growth
Turn 38: axe done and sent NE, worker moves to forest next to cows
Turn 39: warrior 3 done and pulls guard duty, start axe, start chopping
Turn 40: Pop2, switch to worker
At that point, we would have 5 hammers stored in the axe (we need 7 to be able to whip him, so he would be 2 turns away in case of danger). We would be 5 turns from AH. The chop would be done in 4 turns, and worker 2 would be done in 8 turns with the chop, 12 without. I think I optimized the MMing but let me know if not.
Here's Leif's Test5 save fast forward to Turn 25:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/87280/SGOTM06_Test5_BC-3250.CivWarlordsSave
And here's what it would look like after my plan:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/87280/SGOTM06_Test5_BC-2800.CivWarlordsSave
I'll plan on playing in about 8 hours unless there is some objection.
Warrior 2 could be sent NE around Turn 36 instead of SE. Any earlier and we risk having our copper pillaged and everything thrown off kilter.
I agree.
With ambushing settlers, don't set your axe stack right next to the city or they'll go on an archer building spree and you'll face a town with 10 plus archers in it. Which is almost impossible to capture prior to getting cats.
With ambushing settlers, don't set your axe stack right next to the city or they'll go on an archer building spree and you'll face a town with 10 plus archers in it. Which is almost impossible to capture prior to getting cats.
"At that point, we would have 5 hammers stored in the axe (we need 7 to be able to whip him, so he would be 2 turns away in case of danger). We would be 5 turns from AH. The chop would be done in 4 turns, and worker 2 would be done in 8 turns with the chop, 12 without. I think I optimized the MMing but let me know if not."
You'll have the best feel for the game situation, but I'm mindful that the axe will not only require a turn to whip but also two turns to get to the cows, so you may want to delay second worker one more turn.
Regarding whether to send the warrior NE or SE: I'd vote for SE based on all the info it will provide, plus the potential to ****** Hannibal sooner, but it's a close call.
BTW, I'm playing at Prince level in the BTSGOTM right now, and have captured three unattended workers from the same city. The AI doesn't protect them, even when they are obviously vulnerable. I move my chariot away from the city, come back in a few turns, and there's another worker trying to build a road, and he just keeps on building until I capture him.
You'll have the best feel for the game situation, but I'm mindful that the axe will not only require a turn to whip but also two turns to get to the cows, so you may want to delay second worker one more turn.
Regarding whether to send the warrior NE or SE: I'd vote for SE based on all the info it will provide, plus the potential to ****** Hannibal sooner, but it's a close call.
BTW, I'm playing at Prince level in the BTSGOTM right now, and have captured three unattended workers from the same city. The AI doesn't protect them, even when they are obviously vulnerable. I move my chariot away from the city, come back in a few turns, and there's another worker trying to build a road, and he just keeps on building until I capture him.
Jimmy Thunder
King
Since the warrior is only free to explore on turn 36, not much is gained by going 2 turns in front of the axe to Mali. I agree that warrior SE is best - to scout for city sites and to park up next to Carthage.
ShannonCT
Deity
Remember we will still have two warriors in our borders at that time. If we felt the need to whip an axe because of multiple threats, we can send both warriors to arms and leave London empty for 1 turn without it being in any danger.
I'll try to send our warrior zigzagging east of London for the few turns I'll actually be moving him (It would be nice to know about future city sites over there anyway). The next player will have to just make a judgement call about whether the warrior is needed to help find Mansa or whether he should circle south to find Hannibal. We really don't know much about the land yet, so it's all speculation anyway. Either of our opponents could be due East, or they could be mostly north and south. The map could look like Leif's Test5 map or completely different.
In all the maps that I checked, the pattern of AI start locations was similar. The magic number was 14. If there were two other civs on our continent, they were also separated by about 14 tiles, as the diagram below shows when those civs are to our east, the solid square would be our start. When there was only one other civ, it was nearly straight out from our starting location, as in the diagram to the south.
The number of tiles does vary based upon map conditions. The city sites move when there is water where they should go or a mountain. SO there are variations.
In our case, assuming Mali to the north and Carthage to the south, look for Mali 14 tiles east and 7 or so tiles north of our start. Carthage 14 tiles east and 7 tiles south of our start. Good hunting!!
Frederiksberg
Deity
ShannonCT said:
I know it's a lot of turns but I wonder if you should play through until we have AH researched (5 turns more). That would give us knowledge of any nearby horses which could be used to plan my turn set. I think we have those 5 extra turns planned already anyway so why not go for it?
Yes, if you are able, please play through Animal Husbandry's discovery or we'll have to stop early in the next turn set to figure out what we're going to do. Thanks.
Frederiksberg
Deity
leif erikson said:
The number of tiles does vary based upon map conditions. The city sites move when there is water where they should go or a mountain. SO there are variations.
In our case, assuming Mali to the north and Carthage to the south, look for Mali 14 tiles east and 7 or so tiles north of our start. Carthage 14 tiles east and 7 tiles south of our start. Good hunting!!
Couldn't the Mali be 14 tiles due north? And Carthage 14 tiles Due south? or would that only be the case if there are 2 other civs to the east then?
ShannonCT
Deity
So the warrior and axeman could move like such:
That shouldn't be a problem.
Yes, it could be the case. It depends upon the shape of the land mass. If you get a chance, please load up the 2800BC save Shannon posted. Then go into worldbuilder. The cities built thus far are quite visible on the minimap, so they are easy to find. Persepolis is in the north, Carthage is 13 tiles south and Karakorum is 14 tiles south of Carthage. On the other continent, Mecca is 13 tiles east and 10 tiles north of Cuzco, probably due to the shape of the land. This has been the pattern in the several other maps created and checked. Of course, Gyathaar could have moved them about, but I am trying to approximate where they are to cut down search time.
Also, please note that Cyrus has Archers in the north while Carthage and Karakorum are about to get them.
Yes, I think that would be most efficient, especially if many of those jigs are on hills!So the warrior and axeman could move like such:
Frederiksberg
Deity
Maybe it would be an idea to switch back to working the bananas in turn 35. The axe will come at the same time and the warrior will be one turn delayed but London reaches pop 2 a couple of turns faster.
DJMGator13
Still breathing
Warrior1 is already exploring in the South, we can send him East now looking for CART border. Warrior2 could start the NE zigzag a few turns before Warrior3 finishes. This would give us an axe and a warrior to possibly use in attack against the MALI.
ShannonCT
Deity
The timing of the switch back to bananas was intended to coincide with the point where we had finished warrior 3 and were ready to build worker 2. Moving up the switch to bananas will make worker 2 come later (I think) and just add food to storage (which is useful, but not immediately so).
Finishing my turnset now...
ShannonCT
Deity
That would only give us 1 warrior at home. I think we need two minimum if we want to protect our improvements/workers and avoid having to whip an axeman when we're trying to grow to Pop3 soon.
Agree, risk not worth the reward.
ShannonCT
Deity
Finished!
Turn 25: move worker to copper, work bananas, build warrior
Turn 26: mine copper
Turn 27-30: nothing
Turn 31: Agri->AH, copper mine completed, begin working mine, start axe
Turn 32: Hannibal revolted to slavery
Turn 33: Start chopping forest hill
Turn 36: Send warrior2 East. I have yet to see an AI warrior.
Turn 37: Chop finished, work bananas for growth
Turn 38: axe done and sent NE, worker moves to forest next to cows. We meet Alexander's scout from the SE.
Turn 39: warrior 3 done, start axe, start chopping
Turn 40: Pop2, switch to worker
Turn 41: Warrior fends off bear with no loss. Mansa revolts to slavery.
Turn 42: Warrior kills lion with no loss. Promoted to woodsman I. Mali has been located almost due east of London. Axeman is beelining there.
Turn 43: forest chop done
Turn 44: warrior heading south rather than scaring Mansa.
Turn 45: AH finished (wheel put in as placeholder). A greek scout has moved onto our copper. I have made no unit moves on this turn.
The northlands:
The southlands:
Power graph:
Manufacturing graph:
The turnlog:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So going east with the warrior paid off. I dont think our axeman would have found Mali alone.
Notice Mali's high power graph but low maufacturing graph. Hmmm...
Save has been uploaded.
Turn 25: move worker to copper, work bananas, build warrior
Turn 26: mine copper
Turn 27-30: nothing
Turn 31: Agri->AH, copper mine completed, begin working mine, start axe
Turn 32: Hannibal revolted to slavery
Turn 33: Start chopping forest hill
Turn 36: Send warrior2 East. I have yet to see an AI warrior.
Turn 37: Chop finished, work bananas for growth
Turn 38: axe done and sent NE, worker moves to forest next to cows. We meet Alexander's scout from the SE.
Spoiler :
Turn 39: warrior 3 done, start axe, start chopping
Turn 40: Pop2, switch to worker
Turn 41: Warrior fends off bear with no loss.
Mansa revolts to slavery. Turn 42: Warrior kills lion with no loss. Promoted to woodsman I. Mali has been located almost due east of London. Axeman is beelining there.
Spoiler :
Turn 43: forest chop done
Turn 44: warrior heading south rather than scaring Mansa.
Turn 45: AH finished (wheel put in as placeholder). A greek scout has moved onto our copper. I have made no unit moves on this turn.
The northlands:
Spoiler :
The southlands:
Spoiler :
Power graph:
Spoiler :
Manufacturing graph:
Spoiler :
The turnlog:
Spoiler :
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So going east with the warrior paid off. I dont think our axeman would have found Mali alone.
Notice Mali's high power graph but low maufacturing graph. Hmmm...
Save has been uploaded.
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