SGOTM 08 - Fifth Element

[greatbeyond]

It does seem like there is a lot to discuss. I will try to fashion the last several posts into some kind of plan for my TS and then we can pick it apart and fine tune it. I'll get it posted tomorrow afternoon, about 18 hours from now.

Work, sleep, work.... time is not on my side.

 

[WastinTime]

Realistically a t135 contact with multiple AI to the West. So there will just by default need to be something we self research in the wait. But what?

Optics in 4 turns, caravel 1 turn. Contact 5 turns later....t125

I would research Paper.

 

[Mesix]

I think that Paper and Education should be prioritized. We need to get the prereqs for Liberalism, and gaining the ability to build universities will be good. We need to keep our research coming along a a good clip to be able to get a competative finish date with the majority of the wonders.

I think 3 maces will easily take Shaks's first city, and two more should arrive soon after. Brining the axe from the iron mine is a good idea too. Maces should be enough to take Shaka out. The capitol builds them in about 3 turns and Parma builds them in about 6. His first city should fall on the next TS and the capitol on the TS after that. Then it will just be cleanup. I see no benefit to suing for peace.

Once the MS are finished, I think Marbles will be a good city to wonder spam. A few key infrastructure buildings and then wonder after wonder there. We should prioritize the later wonders and let the AI players build the early wonders for us to capture.

 

[Mesix]

Sorry, duplicate post.

 

[culdeus]

Optics in 4 turns, caravel 1 turn. Contact 5 turns later....t125

I would research Paper.

I guess the gameplan is to astro slingshot via liberalism again?

Another thing is that I would probably raze the isthmus city and perhaps what ever is to the SW. The upkeep is too high for us when we have hardly any cottages going. The isthmus has nothing going for it but rice really and we can grab that later.

 

[WastinTime]

I guess the gameplan is to astro slingshot via liberalism again?

Another thing is that I would probably raze the isthmus city and perhaps what ever is to the SW. The upkeep is too high for us when we have hardly any cottages going. The isthmus has nothing going for it but rice really and we can grab that later.

We are not razing any cities (ok maybe a city with no food). TGLH makes them all a huge boost to our empire. We'll whip (slavery) out library, courthouse in each.

We'll have our shrine in ~10 turns for more money.

Trade for Currency in 10-20 turns = more $.

Astro sling is a good thought. I did Communism sling in my test. State Property makes it easy to keep every city we conquer. (and +1 food for workshops, and +10% hammers in ALL cities.)

 

[culdeus]

Man looking over this map it just makes my eyes bleed. Someone is just begging you to go scorched earth. J doesn't have a ton of costal cities at this point. S might have just the two. You are right, forgot about GLH effects on it. Should be able to overcome the maintenance.

I overlooked an incense at due N of J on the left finger. So there's one more happy out there.

I guess the slingshot depends on the speed we want to finish at. Faster finish in less turns astro, more wonders more time communism.

 

[greatbeyond]

Well here's the first draft:

Research : Finish Optics (5T), Start Paper (10T)

Trades: Joao - Compass for Monarchy and Farming. He doesn't seem to want to give us Archery as well. OR.. do we wait for contact with other Civs? It will be 5 turns for Optics and 2 turns for a Caravel and most likely a minimum of 3 for us to meet our first CIV. In that ten turns we can put both Farming and HR to good use.

Production: The turn estimates based on current production, to be fine tuned during play.

Fifthburg - Finish Trireme (1T), Mace (3T) Caravel (2T) Mace (3T) Mace (3T) Mace (3T)
Parma - Finish Mace (1T), then Mace (8T) or Lighthouse (7T) we need faster growth
Stoneopolis - Library (3T), Lighthouse (10T), Temple (14T) or Forge (20T)
Marbles - Finish MS (19T)
Engineering - Finish HG (8T), Forge (10T)

Workers:
Stoneopolis: Mine Hill, Mine Hill, road forest 2E

Parma: Mine hill 1E or Chop/mine Hill 1NE of Fifthburg. I am leaning toward this as it will give us Hammers to produce several 2T/1T maces and Parma won't be able to work the Hill unless we get rid of our Priest. I am OK with that. It would take us longer for our GP but I don't see that as a priority (can a GP research Philo? It might save us several turns of Research)
Alternatively they chop the nearest Forest to get Hammers for more Maces ASAP.

Engineering Workers: After finishing the road, build a Workshop in the only tile now clear. They could chop the Forest adjacent to the freshwater to speed up the HG by 2 to 3 turns.

City Production notes:
Instead of the GM in Engineering, have him work the freshwater for quicker research.

War: I'm thinking we go ahead and attack Shaka now. we may lose 1 Mace. Move the Axe from the Iron to assist the Maces.
Mace from Parma Moves to assist in the attack.
Warrior goes to Parma.

 

[WastinTime]

GP is almost out-- 11 turns I think. Fire the priest after.

No lighthouse in parma

Probably no temple/forge in Stoney, but that's future anyway.

Let's get cottages up for the captiol soon, but I can see you may want to prioritize HG chopping. We're so close to getting it now, we should shave off a couple turns.

Looks good!

 

[WastinTime]

Are Perm. Alliances turned on?
Seems like a wise move if they are.

 

[culdeus]

Looking at the map there are some clear cities he's put out in the fog. Not clear where they are, but easy to guess. Here's the general marching order I'd suggest. He's stashing an extra city somewhere. Perhaps towards J or down the middle finger.

 

[BLubmuz]

A GPro can bulb medi, mono, Christ. Lib, not Philo.

Directly mine the hills, then some cottage.
If you cottage the tiles that can be in Marble BFC (after open them for marbles) you can considerebly speed the MS.
We need a trireme south, i suggested to build it in Stone.

Don't attack right now, wait for reinforcements.
As WT said, you can move the Mace in parma in the inherited turn, we have no problems of happiness there.

Go ahead, good luck.

 

[Sweetacshon]

Sounds good, and I agree with Blubmuz about trireme in Stoney after lib. What about med (1 turn) after optics so we can put in a monastry in 5th?

 

[Mesix]

5th should crank out units until the war with Shaka is over.

 

[culdeus]

I don't think we perhaps should trade for monarchy till after HG is in. Or at least wait to convert to monarchy+slavery till after HG is here. This also allows less delay in getting maces built and moved in.

I think once we have 8 maces building a worker in 5th is probably called for. There are so many unimproved tiles to work. Either that or go fetch stone's worker via galley.

The second mace in parma will finish in about 5T once the GH is mined.

What is the diplomatic plan with Joao? What demands will we allow? Anything? Nothing?

 

[WastinTime]

Marbles builds all the worker/settlers.

The capitol can squeeze in a harbor.

Don't forget to put the capitol back on its Fish.

 

[greatbeyond]

Draft two:

Research : Finish Optics (5T), Start Paper (10T)

Trades: Joao - Compass for Monarchy and Farming. He doesn't seem to want to give us Archery as well. OR.. do we wait for contact with other Civs? It will be 5 turns for Optics and 2 turns for a Caravel and most likely a minimum of 3 for us to meet our first CIV. In that ten turns we can put both Farming and HR to good use. Only one comment so far against this. Anyone else?

Production: The turn estimates based on current production, to be fine tuned during play.

Fifthburg - Finish Trireme (1T), Mace (3T) Caravel (2T) Mace (3T) Mace (3T) Mace (3T) WTSays: The capitol can squeeze in a harbor. I wouldn't do so until after the Caravel.
Parma - Finish Mace (1T), then Mace (8T) or Lighthouse (7T) we need faster growth. Mace then Mace it is
Stoneopolis - Library (3T), Trireme, Lighthouse (10T), Temple (14T) or Forge (20T)
Marbles - Finish MS (19T)
Engineering - Finish HG (8T), Forge (10T)

Workers:
Stoneopolis: Mine Hill, Mine Hill, road forest 2E

Parma: Mine hill 1E or Chop/mine Hill 1NE of Fifthburg. I am leaning toward this as it will give us Hammers to produce several 2T/1T maces and Parma won't be able to work the Hill unless we get rid of our Priest. I am OK with that. It would take us longer for our GP but I don't see that as a priority (can a GP research Philo? It might save us several turns of Research)
Alternatively they chop the nearest Forest to get Hammers for more Maces ASAP. Mine Hill near Parma then Head to Fifthburg, keep the Priest

Engineering Workers: After finishing the road, build a Workshop in the only tile now clear. They could chop the Forest adjacent to the freshwater to speed up the HG by 2 to 3 turns.

City Production notes:
Instead of the GM in Engineering, have him work the freshwater for quicker research.

War: I'm thinking we go ahead and attack Shaka now. we may lose 1 Mace. Wait until Mace from Parma and Axe from engineering get there. Move the Axe from the Iron to assist the Maces.
Mace from Parma Moves to assist in the attack.
Warrior goes to Parma.

Demands: This is why I would rather trade Joao than have him demand it. Acceding to a demand gives us better relations, but if we are going to attack him soon, we won't need them. A trade should give us some of the better relations and get us techs in return.

Think about these and let me know, I'll play in anywhere from 8 to 12 hours.

 

[culdeus]

looks good. Would certainly chop something around eng. One worker can keep pace with the improvements there.

 

[MacBalt]

Not sure if anyone's already mentioned it, but I just glanced at the save and it looks like we are flirting with unhappiness in a couple of cities.

 

[MacBalt]

Not at all, I was just noting what needed to happen after the mids was BIDL. You did well.

No problem -- sorry if I seemed cranky. I was kicking myself for not using the capital's extra seafood to grow faster and for leaving the island city (Marbles?) without a garrison.

Way to handle the invasion Mesix. Glad it didn't happen on my watch (this time!).