SGOTM 09 - Fifth Element

BLubmuz · Apr 29, 2009

Mesix said:
We are all a bunch of old guys playing games to act like kids...huh?

Basically, i'm a seasoned teen. Ask my wife.

Some comment about my discovery?
The CFC members stats, i mean, not the fresh water.

As promised, here the comparison between LB Edu or settle the 3rd GS. In both i even managed a 4th one, settled FYI, the 5th GP was a GE. Always in both i took my beloved 2.5 turns detour to calendar, to build my MoM.

Code:

    LB Edu: Edu turn 71 - Lib  98, after 11 turns of research
GS settled: Edu turn 79 - Lib 103, after  8 turns of research

This demonstrates that:
1) Mesix is not always wrong

2) I'm so smart and humble to admit my mistakes :king:

3) representation is great for research :goodjob:

4) the 10 turns you apparently save on Edu are actually 8, since a settled GS with Academy, library and (partially) representation gives a respectable output
5) what i continue to affirm, that the turns you cut to Edu are not all cutted to Lib

You can still confute: OK, but Lib arrives 5 turns later.

So i can answer: true, but we got only one city that can afford Paras by then: LP.
I can also add that the benefit of 27 raw :science:

for some more 90 turns is noticeable, not to mention the additional 3 :hammers:

Arer you with us, GB?

unclethrill · Apr 29, 2009

So I hit 24 hours on my PPP in about 3 more hours. Do I have the green light to go then as described? If not it will be another 24 before I can take my turns.

BLubmuz · Apr 29, 2009

unclethrill said:
So I hit 24 hours on my PPP in about 3 more hours. Do I have the green light to go then as described? If not it will be another 24 before I can take my turns.

UT, the green light was on since yesterday.

The few other members' comments are positive, thus GO ON!!!

Good Luck, and play slowly, optimizing the last atom.

unclethrill · Apr 29, 2009

My PPP is to:

Finish Paper, start Edu
Watch for trades
sign OB with Stalin giving him Fishing and waiting 1-2 turns
Gently not give in to any demands

As far as cities go:
LP will finish forge, Pyramid and will keep at least 1 sci at work, if possible an eng too.
Athens: worker, finish forge.
Blubz: CH - library- New palace

Workers:
Build a road to the wheat, then farm wheat>road.
the one now roading the corn can stop and WM
one can finish the mine, then go road 1N of wheat
the other on the uranium can go N to chop right outside LP BFC

Airship will go back to Blubz, recon south, then back in LP. Scout the island and the barb borders.

Religion:
Revolt to Judism to make Hammy happy 1 turn before MIds finished

Civics:
Revolt to Representation once we'll get Pyramids (if we manage them: I have an MBA. I can manage anything).

World Map: Never trade it unless we can get an early peace to a losing war.

Espionage:
I think we can set to 1 for all, 2 for the AI we just meet. Then, we'll switch to 1 for the other continent and 2 for the AI(s) on ours.

In 24 hours I will play my turn set and if there is no response then I will assume that everyone agrees with my non-strategic decisions.

I played my set.

Turn Log:

Spoiler :

Highlights:
Cities:

LP: Finished Forge. Switched to Mids. City Grew to 10 (Happy cap will increase with Rep to cover unhappy) Added 1 Engineer to the 1 Scientist.

Athens: Switched from Forge to worker. Finished Worker. Working on Forge Again

BLubz: Continued CH. Queued up Library after CH

Workers:
Moved worker to Hill to continue WM. Still working on it.

Moved worker to forest outside of LP. Chopped one forest. Moved him 1E to begin chop of second forest.

Finished Ur. mine. Moved to 1N of Wheat. Built road. Moved to Wheat and started Farm.

Moving new worker to same forest for chopping.

Recon:

Rebased AS to BLubz. Recon-ed south. Saw nothing but Met Joao. Traded OB with him. Rebased to LP. Recon-ed due E to attempt Circum-nav. Located Barb City on other landmass. Rebased to St. Petersburg. Recon-ed due W but located no new city. Recon-ed SW and found Novgorod. (A rebase there and one recon should yield another city from which we can circum-nav.)

Relations:

Met Joao. Got OB

Gave Fishing and Alphabet to Stalin. Got OB

Traded Currency to Wang Chung for his map. This revealed Stalin's city for recon and Currency is not in line for Lib so it should not affect our free lib tech.

I have no screen shots because the Alt-Prt Scn combo in Linux is not completely functioning on my 'puter right now.

The save is posted BC0240_01

BLubmuz · Apr 29, 2009

Good one UT. Not opened the save, of course, but good.
Maybe currency is a bit much for a WM, even if we need it to circumnavigate.

Joao? that SoB? he's not aggressive by trait, but often i found him around the same as Shaka.
Once i choose him and Whilelm on a Rainforest map, so thay could make good use of their UU and UB. A nightmare. He expands like crazy and when he feels stronger he declares.

Oh we'll need our Paras, then let's see what he can do :evil:

unclethrill · Apr 29, 2009

BLubmuz said:
Good one UT. Not opened the save, of course, but good.
Maybe currency is a bit much for a WM, even if we need it to circumnavigate.

Joao? that SoB? he's not aggressive by trait, but often i found him around the same as Shaka.
Once i choose him and Whilelm on a Rainforest map, so thay could make good use of their UU and UB. A nightmare. He expands like crazy and when he feels stronger he declares.

Oh we'll need our Paras, then let's see what he can do

I thought it might be a bit steep but I figured getting his WM for it is better than getting nothing when he researches it on his own or trades for it.

Sweetacshon · Apr 30, 2009

unclethrill said:
I thought it might be a bit steep but I figured getting his WM for it is better than getting nothing when he researches it on his own or trades for it.

Except that we now have -4 traded with worst enemy mods for Stalin and HC. Please check worst enemies before every trade!!

Now that the map is filling out, it does look earthlike, doesn't it? We seem to be in North America, and it would seem that Joao came from South America. I actually dislike him, he's stingy and a bit of a backstabber. We could consider <--

giving gifts to Joao for +ive mods.

A note on MM, don't be afraid to give some of those nice GFPs to Athens, as LP still has other good tiles to work. Let's get rexing!

edit: Our only nearby oil is out on furry island.

BLubmuz · Apr 30, 2009

Opened the save.
Yes the map seems earthlike. We started in north Canada, Blubz can be boh? Chicago or Kansas city. Wang is in China and HC in Vietnam/Cambodia. So Stalin is probably in Russia. We can't see Africa if the map has it.
Next move for the airship can be Novgorod, scout NW to try to locate another base. SW is to appease our curiosity, but can be delayed. Also no cities there.
After circumnavigation is also important to recon near home, so better finish to clean the furs/whales/oil island to decide where to settle. For what i can see now, i think 2N of whale can be a good spot. Also a platform after plastics can be nice.
We need also to recon the Rockies an S of the southern iron.

Noticed LP has 1 angry citizen, thanks to the corn. Pyramids should be completed in 1-2 turns and next turn we'll see next GPerson.
If GS, settle. If GSpy, keep for a GA. In the remote possibility he's a GE, keep him at sleep: he's Mister Mining Inc.
We must start REX right after Pyramids.
After the GP is born, i suggest to take a detour to calendar to build MoM. You can't imagine the benefits of 27 turns of GAge. We're now on turn 69, planning to launch around 195, so 126 turns from now. Just imagine over 1/5 of time in strategically strated GAges.

Sweetacshon · Apr 30, 2009

We're planning on 3 GAs?? Calendar, I'm not convinced. Tell me, where would you put the MoM, Blubz? We have too much else to build, imo.

That :mad:

in LP was mentioned in the turn report as being fixable by rep, but it is a bit inefficient. Spilt milk, and all that....

BLubmuz · Apr 30, 2009

Sweetacshon said:
We're planning on 3 GAs?? Calendar, I'm not convinced. Tell me, where would you put the MoM, Blubz? We have too much else to build, imo.

That in LP was mentioned in the turn report as being fixable by rep, but it is a bit inefficient. Spilt milk, and all that....

Mentioned or not, with a good MM it could be avoided. I don't wanna mention not farming the corn. In all my tests i farmed it after Pyramids.

Where to put the MoM? In Athens, of course. That city needs water, which can be brought farming W of the river, then GLFor, than PFor. There's also a PFor right outside the BFC. MoM can be built in 9 turns after the forge.

Remember, it doubles with marble, and any chop will net us a big yield.

We can delay Edu and gain a tech to trade. It's only 2.5 turns of delay.
We can't build universities, we need workers and settlers.
We can probably go for 8 cities, if some resource is revealed near the Rockies.
LP can crank 2 settlers in 3 turns or 1 worker/turn. Building them in other cities is a waste.

Would you like to listen which path i propose after Lib/Rifling?
We'll trade for Poly/Mono before then.
I propose: Theo>DR>Nationalism.
We can build the HS in LP at the cost of 2 Paras (*), Versailles in some city South, Taj in some city which never pop a GPerson. And this is the first GAge.
Sooner or later we'll pop a Gspy. And this will be the second.
A 1-1.5 turn detour to communism will give us another GSpy. Together with a GPr or a GAr from Athens (if we build MoM there) we'll have the 3rd, to launch around the time we'll research Fusion.

With this strategy i further improved my test: launched on turn 187!!!
I must admit i has some luck here and there, but i can't see why we can't do the same in the actual game.
I almost not MM, went fast. It's a test after all.

(*) BTW, you can realize by this comparison how much a Para costs.

Simon_c · Apr 30, 2009

unclethrill said:
I have no screen shots because the Alt-Prt Scn combo in Linux is not completely functioning on my 'puter right now.

How do you play civ under linux ? I've never managed to get that working....

Sweetacshon · Apr 30, 2009

OK, I see your plan, however, Athens could also help build settlers or workers for the rex, and also needs... well almost all other buildings to aid science/cash, as well as defenders/MPs for the new cities, and, of course, paratroopers. All these delays and detours.. a few turns here, a few paratroopers there.. how will it affect the launch, is the $m question.

BLubmuz · Apr 30, 2009

Sweetacshon said:
OK, I see your plan, however, Athens could also help build settlers or workers for the rex, and also needs... well almost all other buildings to aid science/cash, as well as defenders/MPs for the new cities, and, of course, paratroopers. All these delays and detours.. a few turns here, a few paratroopers there.. how will it affect the launch, is the $m question.

You can be right.
This is the reason why i'm testing intensively.
Mesix was about settle GSs.

Now, i'll force myself to renounce to calendar/Mom and see what happens.
I can easily compare the 2 variants with autologs, starting somewhere before then.

Linux? is that guy foolin'round with an old cloth? :lol:

Greatbeyond, you're up
Can you post your PPP and play or do you prefer to swap?
Simon, please follow the thread, even if you don't swap you're up next

I haven't seen any comment about the player statitics thing. Have you oversighted it or do you think is not worth a row?

Simon_c · Apr 30, 2009

BLubmuz said:
Simon, please follow the thread, even if you don't swap you're up next

I'm following it. I don't have time to play test games of every option. I wouldn't even remember what I did differently anyway.
I just tend to watch from the sides and lob rocks in if I notice something that maynot have been considered.
Did you guys want more contributions from me ?

Should I be opening the save every turnset and commenting on people play plan ? (is that want PPP stands for ? Personal play plan ? )

I haven't seen any comment about the player statitics thing. Have you oversighted it or do you think is not worth a row?

Was that aimed at me ? if so I'm very confused.

Mesix · Apr 30, 2009

The one angy person isn't a big deal. It is actually good use of the extra food. Along with bonus :science:

, Representation will also bring +3

to our three cities. The Capital's happy cap is going to increase from 9 to 12 in about three turns.

BLubmuz · Apr 30, 2009

Simon_c said:
I'm following it. I don't have time to play test games of every option. I wouldn't even remember what I did differently anyway.
I just tend to watch from the sides and lob rocks in if I notice something that maynot have been considered.
Did you guys want more contributions from me ?

NP on this. More contributions we have, the better. But all must fit with RL

Should I be opening the save every turnset and commenting on people play plan ? (is that want PPP stands for ? Personal play plan ? )

No, only if you like to do. Mainly to appease your critical spirit.

PPP = Pre-Play-Plan
The plan any player posts before play

Was that aimed at me ? if so I'm very confused.

No, to all the team.
I think it's important, but not a single comment.

Sweetacshon · Apr 30, 2009

Player statistics? Did I miss something?

@simon: Yeah, I usually just open the save and examine the PPP - 1. I might find an error or be able to make a suggestion for improvement; 2. When it gets around to my turn again, I'm not bewildered by a game I haven't looked at for 50 turns.

It only takes a few minutes to do so, and any comments or critique will aid play, in my experience.

BLubmuz · Apr 30, 2009

Sweetacshon said:
Player statistics? Did I miss something?

This one.

nobody cares me

i'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me

Queen, maybe?

Sweeta, i'm testing without researchin' Calendar.
But since i've tried to be less greedy in trade, i managed to trade for it.
Can i build the MoM?
So i anticipated the HS, with a detour to Theo.
I also almost gave Theo to Hammu, hoping he will build the AP.

unclethrill · Apr 30, 2009

I could have delayed the city growth and run an extra specialist but as Mesix said as soon as we switch to Rep he will be will be happy again( the extra pop not Mesix). Even moving off the new corn, the new growth would just have occured on someone else's turn. (If I recall correctly, we had 24 food with the new corn so even not working the corn would yield 2 extra food towards growth.

My MM took all of this in to acct and I decided to not pawn the extra pop on the next person. Also, since our happy cap is going up by 3 with rep, the faster we get there the better the city will be. I think the trade off of 1 unhappy face for 3 turns is better than waiting 5+ extra turns to grow to the new happy cap.

As the statistics goes, I don't think we should use it and if we say anything to Alan then it should be in a PM so as not to let anyone who doesn't know about it to take advantage.

As far as Linux goes. I have an MBA but I also have a Computer Science degree and am working on a second Master's in Comp Sci. I have used linux for years and the key to getting Windows games to work in Linux is a good video card (mine is a 9800 series NVidia w/ 1 gb onboard). My laptop runs ubuntu 8.7 ( I believe. It's been a while since the install). I run wine for games. Because ubuntu uses so many less resources than windoze, my Civ IV runs smokin' fast. The down side is I have to manually look at each MF save since MF won't run it's gui and the prt src uses an odd key combo (like ctl-alt-prt scr I think) and the save popup opens under Civ so I have to close it to see if the popups are there. So if I used the wrong key combo, it's too late when I find out. All in all, linux is a much better solution for me but not necessarily for everyone but I'm not yanking anyone's chain, I do run linux exclusively and it works even better than in windoze.

Mesix · Apr 30, 2009

I run Windoze Vista because I am no a Computer Scientist. It is thr operating system that come preinstalled on my laptop.

As Unclethrill's current professor stated in his online class:

The latest version of Windoze is a combination of elements from three previous versions. Windoze CE, Windoze ME, and Windoze NT. When combined, they become Windoze CEMENT.

SGOTM 09 - Fifth Element

HoF Quattromaster

Why am I up right now?

HoF Quattromaster

Why am I up right now?

HoF Quattromaster

Why am I up right now?

In the foetal position

HoF Quattromaster

In the foetal position

HoF Quattromaster

Prince

In the foetal position

HoF Quattromaster

Prince

Obergruppenführer

HoF Quattromaster

In the foetal position

HoF Quattromaster

Why am I up right now?

Obergruppenführer

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