BTW, How many Sushi did the T team spread in the last 9 turns?
About as much as in the previous 10 turns
SGOTM 12 - Plastic Ducks
- Thread starter AlanH
- Start date
About as much as in the previous 10 turns
Does that list seem to make sense?
We will lose Ivory though
EDIT: assuming 1 tech/turn, this is 15~16 turns from now.
Yea I know. That's what takes so long, have to check every city every turn.
If you want, you can save time by pressing F1 and checking one of the city screens, it shows every specialist used.
Or modify the default F1 screen to include specialists.
Too lazy to do itI mean what to research in T6.
I mean the real number of Sushi and math behind it.
Just guessed that the curve looked to have increased by a factor of 2 or so.
Played and uploaded.
Game log
Game Report
A GM was born from Chita, In case there's something wield from Moscow, I sent him half way to London. He is only able to provide 2100g, while a GS could bulb 3000+ beakers.
Then a Gspy was born in Moscow with an odd of ~7% odd, again proved that the odd of GP from the screen is nothing. I did hire 1 engineer for 1 turn in order to complete R&R, it's good that GE have not born in the odd of 9/1400, although I did manage a Gspy in BOTM27 at 1% odd thanks to the city governor.
Here's the forces we have now.
And the forces to invade Indian are in position, we can fire the war next turn.
With the obsolete of Ivory and the Emac unhappiness, Some of the cities are unhappy, I should complete ET as soon as possible, but not chase the failed wonder cash. We have 2 Aluminum resources, they are not handy, we need a couple turns to connect it -- the one near Ros.
I made a micro mistake -- destroy the only town in our capital since that worker was the last one in rotation and I forgot to cancel it's action after entering a tons of city screens.
Issues for the next set.
1. Trigger the 4th GA immediately? I guess we don't have other choices since we need to switch to CS.
2. How many more and what kind of military units we need to build next.
3. Since Aluminum needs a couple turns to connect, do we want to learn Rocketry and start the Apollo project immediately or wait for the bonus?
Game log
Spoiler :
Game Report
A GM was born from Chita, In case there's something wield from Moscow, I sent him half way to London. He is only able to provide 2100g, while a GS could bulb 3000+ beakers.
Spoiler :
Then a Gspy was born in Moscow with an odd of ~7% odd, again proved that the odd of GP from the screen is nothing. I did hire 1 engineer for 1 turn in order to complete R&R, it's good that GE have not born in the odd of 9/1400, although I did manage a Gspy in BOTM27 at 1% odd thanks to the city governor.
Spoiler :
Here's the forces we have now.
Spoiler :
And the forces to invade Indian are in position, we can fire the war next turn.
Spoiler :
With the obsolete of Ivory and the Emac unhappiness, Some of the cities are unhappy, I should complete ET as soon as possible, but not chase the failed wonder cash. We have 2 Aluminum resources, they are not handy, we need a couple turns to connect it -- the one near Ros.
Spoiler :
I made a micro mistake -- destroy the only town in our capital since that worker was the last one in rotation and I forgot to cancel it's action after entering a tons of city screens.
Issues for the next set.
1. Trigger the 4th GA immediately? I guess we don't have other choices since we need to switch to CS.
2. How many more and what kind of military units we need to build next.
3. Since Aluminum needs a couple turns to connect, do we want to learn Rocketry and start the Apollo project immediately or wait for the bonus?
In fact I am very happy to play the next set, my favorite war of Bombers + cossacks.
The war with Roosevelt let me feel sick.
hehehe
Well done.
Let's break his back without breaking a sweat!
Agree to trigger GA right now, we kinda need it
Also I prefer to finish last SS parts losing 1~2 turn of GA than having 1~2 turn GA too long.
We could always wait 1 turn and cash in on the GM now to give us better production for SS parts.
Civics: CS, we should consider Nationhood: +2 happy for barracks, -143 gpt upkeep. We lose 43H in Moscow and 34*2.6 beakers. Seeing as we already have 8 unhappy people, that's a definite gain overall I think.
War with Gandhi: idiot parked his fleet in an easy to destroy place
Instead of peace deal, we would have to use a cease fire to give him the ice city. DoW him right back to take last city same turn. Not sure this is really worth it though, we might suffer unhappiness from the war (I tend to get it even if I lose 0 units, go figure) and 4 more turns of anger because he refuses to talk might not be worth it. Especially given that we might have finished (or almost) with research at that point...
Workers: when you have time, pre-chop and road all 5 forests in Rostov, we will use them to gain 1 turn of production on the second Engine. The ones in the BFC should be pre-workshopped.
For now, pull all available workers to Aluminium and road+mine (road takes 1 less turn than RR).
We have enough buildings to keep researching 1 tech/turn under the GA, we should just switch to full wealth/research mode. Buildings that can be done in 1 turn are ok if they add enough over 10 turns.
Techs: we should push back Plastics as much as we can, we're going to lose another 2 happy there from Fur.
I think I prefer Rocketry right away. We lose some hammers but Apollo will still finish faster if we start it 1 turn faster. Exception is if one city has as much OF available as its base production (which doesn't seem to be the case), in that case going for Genetics then Rocketry is better.
So I still think Rocketry next then Genetics>Satellites>Comp>Fiber O>Plastic>Comp>Fission>Fusion
???
Do we want to push Composites so far
???
There are fewer than 25 turns remaining in the game now for sure.
Army:
I think we'll have enough Bombers after this turn.
All we need are some more Cossacks for Churchill to absorb his SoD and start taking cities fast from all sides.
Well done.
Let's break his back without breaking a sweat!
Agree to trigger GA right now, we kinda need it
Also I prefer to finish last SS parts losing 1~2 turn of GA than having 1~2 turn GA too long.
We could always wait 1 turn and cash in on the GM now to give us better production for SS parts.
Civics: CS, we should consider Nationhood: +2 happy for barracks, -143 gpt upkeep. We lose 43H in Moscow and 34*2.6 beakers. Seeing as we already have 8 unhappy people, that's a definite gain overall I think.
War with Gandhi: idiot parked his fleet in an easy to destroy place
Instead of peace deal, we would have to use a cease fire to give him the ice city. DoW him right back to take last city same turn. Not sure this is really worth it though, we might suffer unhappiness from the war (I tend to get it even if I lose 0 units, go figure) and 4 more turns of anger because he refuses to talk might not be worth it. Especially given that we might have finished (or almost) with research at that point...
Workers: when you have time, pre-chop and road all 5 forests in Rostov, we will use them to gain 1 turn of production on the second Engine. The ones in the BFC should be pre-workshopped.
For now, pull all available workers to Aluminium and road+mine (road takes 1 less turn than RR).
We have enough buildings to keep researching 1 tech/turn under the GA, we should just switch to full wealth/research mode. Buildings that can be done in 1 turn are ok if they add enough over 10 turns.
Techs: we should push back Plastics as much as we can, we're going to lose another 2 happy there from Fur.
I think I prefer Rocketry right away. We lose some hammers but Apollo will still finish faster if we start it 1 turn faster. Exception is if one city has as much OF available as its base production (which doesn't seem to be the case), in that case going for Genetics then Rocketry is better.
So I still think Rocketry next then Genetics>Satellites>Comp>Fiber O>Plastic>Comp>Fission>Fusion
???
Do we want to push Composites so far
???
There are fewer than 25 turns remaining in the game now for sure.
Army:
I think we'll have enough Bombers after this turn.
All we need are some more Cossacks for Churchill to absorb his SoD and start taking cities fast from all sides.
hehehe
Well done.
Let's break his back without breaking a sweat!
Agree to trigger GA right now, we kinda need it
Also I prefer to finish last SS parts losing 1~2 turn of GA than having 1~2 turn GA too long.
We could always wait 1 turn and cash in on the GM now to give us better production for SS parts.
Civics: CS, we should consider Nationhood: +2 happy for barracks, -143 gpt upkeep. We lose 43H in Moscow and 34*2.6 beakers. Seeing as we already have 8 unhappy people, that's a definite gain overall I think.
I tend to agree on this at the 1st glance. However on a 2nd thought, stay on Bureaucracy might be better finally. With the support of the GM, we could maintain 100% science slider toward the end of the game since most of the city are finishing their military build this turn and are able to support full research from next turn. The cash saved from Nat might not be needed, but the extra beakers from capital might be critical to finish the last space tech 1 turn earlier. This issue also affect the city build, as long as the empire is able to support full science slider, I would not mind to build more science buildings like Univ even it's does not pay for the hammer cost in the rest of turns.
War with Gandhi: idiot parked his fleet in an easy to destroy place
Instead of peace deal, we would have to use a cease fire to give him the ice city. DoW him right back to take last city same turn. Not sure this is really worth it though, we might suffer unhappiness from the war (I tend to get it even if I lose 0 units, go figure) and 4 more turns of anger because he refuses to talk might not be worth it. Especially given that we might have finished (or almost) with research at that point...
We'll see how's the WW looks like. Probably only 2 turns of refusal to talk.
Workers: when you have time, pre-chop and road all 5 forests in Rostov, we will use them to gain 1 turn of production on the second Engine. The ones in the BFC should be pre-workshopped.
Ros should be fine, there's enough time to send more workers to chop those forests. The bottle neck of SS engine production is Moscow, That's the reason why I have already started changing improvements in Moscow -- the 2 silks and hills are 1 turn from WS and mine.
For now, pull all available workers to Aluminium and road+mine (road takes 1 less turn than RR).
That's what the surrounding workers are doing, I even send the 2 workers in Moscow toward the Aluminum. Too bad that we are short of 1 worker to reach the hill this turn.
We have enough buildings to keep researching 1 tech/turn under the GA, we should just switch to full wealth/research mode. Buildings that can be done in 1 turn are ok if they add enough over 10 turns.
See my reason on top.
Techs: we should push back Plastics as much as we can, we're going to lose another 2 happy there from Fur.
I think I prefer Rocketry right away. We lose some hammers but Apollo will still finish faster if we start it 1 turn faster. Exception is if one city has as much OF available as its base production (which doesn't seem to be the case), in that case going for Genetics then Rocketry is better.
I start to think whether it's better to finish Genetics last if we could find another strong productive city to build the stasis Chamber, that's a dream anyway. We need careful plan now. There are 9 techs left, Our BPT is 8K at the moment under the GA, there's no doubt we are able to exceed 9K 10 turns later, therefore that 8.5K * 10 * 1.2 beakers in 10 turns, which is enough for all those 9 techs. So more precisely, we are at most 11 turns to complete the last tech and 14~15 turns to launch. Man, without the support of GA, Moscow seems not able to complete SS Engine in 3 turns.
So I still think Rocketry next then Genetics>Satellites>Comp>Fiber O>Plastic>Comp>Fission>Fusion
???
Do we want to push Composites so far
???
The raw hammer cost of SS casting is 1200/3.5 = 343H, City with the raw production of 70H could complete it in 5 turns, I guess it's not very difficult to find 5. Let's list them so that I could start to prechange the improvements around.
There are fewer than 25 turns remaining in the game now for sure.
Army:
I think we'll have enough Bombers after this turn.
We need 20 bombers in total, 16 for the war with Gandhi and 4 for the war with Washington and Stalin.
All we need are some more Cossacks for Churchill to absorb his SoD and start taking cities fast from all sides.
I could not resist to build 1 TANK from SP this turn!
If we want optimal, then there's a lot to be taken care of, I guess that's too tedious and let's leave more chance for OSS.
Moscow Engine: simple, we need to get Moscow to have max overflow. We can starve down any non-hammer tile (workshop every single tile!).
We can do 10k beakers any turn we want but we'll be building some military.
Our average beaker rate will be at least 9k bpt. We are getting another Merchant in 4 turns so we have 4k excess gold = 4k research.
I am pretty confident we can finish the tech tree in 9 turns.
Average tech cost is 10,400 beakers. That means 8,667 beakers/turn is enough with the 20% discount from pre-requisites.
As you said, we are already making 8,000 bpt... we can spend 2K hammers on wealth and 1K on research... voila.
Which is why we don't really need more infra...
Civics: fine with me. Gives us more flexibility anyway.
Bombers... 4 more this turn then.
No need to pillage the Oil, give it to Mao.
SS. Chamber: too much trouble, get Genetics earlier, it's not going to happen to find a 3rd fantastic city.
70H cities Casings: New York, Samara, Tours, Chey, Kras (it should be able to get 69H = 345H!)
are possibilities.
Optimal play: it's not really hard, we finish 1 tech/turn and build engines as fast as possible. With enough workers, we can just bulldoze every improvement and try to get as high possible base hammers. Also Moscow should be micro'd to achieve maximum overflow leading to Fusion so it gets a "free turn" of hammers. Rostov will have its forests to compensate.
Sell Lib to Gandhi/Church, some crap techs for Stalin's gold, etc.
The biggest headaches will be:
1) balance troops production and wealth/research
2) cleaning out the SF in time
EDIT: also, for specialists use the ones that will yield MAX(science+gold+hammers) as they are all equal to each other at this point. It will be mostly scientists I suspect as we have almost all science multipliers.
We can do 10k beakers any turn we want but we'll be building some military.
Our average beaker rate will be at least 9k bpt. We are getting another Merchant in 4 turns so we have 4k excess gold = 4k research.
I am pretty confident we can finish the tech tree in 9 turns.
Average tech cost is 10,400 beakers. That means 8,667 beakers/turn is enough with the 20% discount from pre-requisites.
As you said, we are already making 8,000 bpt... we can spend 2K hammers on wealth and 1K on research... voila.
Which is why we don't really need more infra...
Civics: fine with me. Gives us more flexibility anyway.
Bombers... 4 more this turn then.
No need to pillage the Oil, give it to Mao.
SS. Chamber: too much trouble, get Genetics earlier, it's not going to happen to find a 3rd fantastic city.
70H cities Casings: New York, Samara, Tours, Chey, Kras (it should be able to get 69H = 345H!)
are possibilities.
Optimal play: it's not really hard, we finish 1 tech/turn and build engines as fast as possible. With enough workers, we can just bulldoze every improvement and try to get as high possible base hammers. Also Moscow should be micro'd to achieve maximum overflow leading to Fusion so it gets a "free turn" of hammers. Rostov will have its forests to compensate.
Sell Lib to Gandhi/Church, some crap techs for Stalin's gold, etc.
The biggest headaches will be:
1) balance troops production and wealth/research
2) cleaning out the SF in time
EDIT: also, for specialists use the ones that will yield MAX(science+gold+hammers) as they are all equal to each other at this point. It will be mostly scientists I suspect as we have almost all science multipliers.
Moscow Engine: simple, we need to get Moscow to have max overflow. We can starve down any non-hammer tile (workshop every single tile!).
I know it's doable for Moscow to complete SS Engine in 3 turns under GA and that's why I have 2 workers around Moscow all the time, which results in the destroy of the town.
We can do 10k beakers any turn we want but we'll be building some military.
Our average beaker rate will be at least 9k bpt. We are getting another Merchant in 4 turns so we have 4k excess gold = 4k research.
Yes, ideally a GM, could also be a GPriest or even a GArtist.
I am pretty confident we can finish the tech tree in 9 turns.
Average tech cost is 10,400 beakers. That means 8,667 beakers/turn is enough with the 20% discount from pre-requisites.
As you said, we are already making 8,000 bpt... we can spend 2K hammers on wealth and 1K on research... voila.
Which is why we don't really need more infra...
Civics: fine with me. Gives us more flexibility anyway.
Bombers... 4 more this turn then.
We have 8 currently, so 12 more this turn.
No need to pillage the Oil, give it to Mao.
Good idea, why didn't I?
SS. Chamber: too much trouble, get Genetics earlier, it's not going to happen to find a 3rd fantastic city.
70H cities Casings: New York, Samara, Tours, Chey, Kras (it should be able to get 69H = 345H!)
are possibilities.
Optimal play: it's not really hard, we finish 1 tech/turn and build engines as fast as possible. With enough workers, we can just bulldoze every improvement and try to get as high possible base hammers. Also Moscow should be micro'd to achieve maximum overflow leading to Fusion so it gets a "free turn" of hammers. Rostov will have its forests to compensate.
Sell Lib to Gandhi/Church, some crap techs for Stalin's gold, etc.
The biggest headaches will be:
1) balance troops production and wealth/research
2) cleaning out the SF in time
These headache is the part of optimal play, I'll try.
EDIT: also, for specialists use the ones that will yield MAX(science+gold+hammers) as they are all equal to each other at this point. It will be mostly scientists I suspect as we have almost all science multipliers.
Right, Merchants in 4 cities with bank, When building Project, wonders, and SS parts, Engineers and Priest, otherwise scientists mostly when the cash is able to support 100% science slider.
2 more issues.
1. On a 2nd thought, I think we should hold the war with Roosevelt until we launch, otherwise the WW from him could be deadly, easily over 5 for our big cities.
2. Do we want 1 or 2 airports, which is convenient for movement. Cities whipping RI this turn will have a large OF to build.
GP: well, we did get a GE at bad odds when we needed one, right?
Bombers: oh yea, I meant 4 more than what was already being built.
Roose war: agree to skip for now. 100 gold and ~100 beakers will not make a difference but 80 unhappy faces will.
Airports: Sure if it's convenient. For example we could put one on an island and a few on mainland for quick worker movement. Any cities in mind?
Bombers: oh yea, I meant 4 more than what was already being built.
Roose war: agree to skip for now. 100 gold and ~100 beakers will not make a difference but 80 unhappy faces will.
Airports: Sure if it's convenient. For example we could put one on an island and a few on mainland for quick worker movement. Any cities in mind?
One more issue, probably the last one in my mind.
I think we should research Gen this turn to wait for the Aluminum bonus, the OF from CT this turn is big, which should allow Ros to finish Apollo Project in 3 turns, which is the same turn to build 1 turn earlier.
Any other thoughts?
I think we should research Gen this turn to wait for the Aluminum bonus, the OF from CT this turn is big, which should allow Ros to finish Apollo Project in 3 turns, which is the same turn to build 1 turn earlier.
Any other thoughts?
Checked numbers: definitely Genetics this turn, Rocketry after.
Apollo is 1600H
OF = ((101+13)*3-80)/3 = 87
Apollo: (87+101)*4 = 752H
(1600-752)/2 = 424
101*4 = 404H/turn
We're missing 20 Hammers, we need something smaller than a CT to do Apollo in 3 turns.
EDIT: or a second build to add OF.
Apollo is 1600H
OF = ((101+13)*3-80)/3 = 87
Apollo: (87+101)*4 = 752H
(1600-752)/2 = 424
101*4 = 404H/turn
We're missing 20 Hammers, we need something smaller than a CT to do Apollo in 3 turns.
EDIT: or a second build to add OF.
Suggestions:
a) build a barracks instead, will give 97 OF, build wealth 1 turn
10 OF = 40H on Apollo
(1600-792)/2 = 808
101*4 = 404
Equals 3 turns build
b) build CT, next turn build anything less than 260H to get maximum overflow (=100) (could be Airport for example)
804H on Apollo first turn.
End up with 3 OF after 3 turns of building...
a) build a barracks instead, will give 97 OF, build wealth 1 turn
10 OF = 40H on Apollo
(1600-792)/2 = 808
101*4 = 404
Equals 3 turns build
b) build CT, next turn build anything less than 260H to get maximum overflow (=100) (could be Airport for example)
804H on Apollo first turn.
End up with 3 OF after 3 turns of building...
Plan to the completion of Apollo Project.
Military
War with Gandhi only, no 2 part war.
Military units -- 12 more bombers and 2 Tanks from SP and Xian this turn. Will build 2 more galleons (need 4 galleons for the war with Stalin) and some cossacks.
Diplomacy -- Trade for cash as much as possible.
EP on Stalin
Tech
Genetics->Rocketry->Satellites>Comp>Fiber O
City management
Merchants in 4 cities with bank. When building Project, wonders, and SS parts, Engineers and Priest, otherwise scientists mostly when the cash is able to support 100% science slider. Finish current building and then a couple of airports. Build happiness building like CT and Theater if needed. Otherwise, mostly wealth.
IBT changes
Trigger the last GA
Switch to CS
GM commits the trade mission
Trade for cash with AIs
Adjust specialists in every city
Atl(Univ. lots OF, but 1H short to complete in 1 turn
)
Xian(tank)
Chita(Bomber)
Irk(Bomber)
SP(Tank)
Mos(ET)
BTW, what to do with a GA if it insists to be born in SP?
Military
War with Gandhi only, no 2 part war.
Military units -- 12 more bombers and 2 Tanks from SP and Xian this turn. Will build 2 more galleons (need 4 galleons for the war with Stalin) and some cossacks.
Diplomacy -- Trade for cash as much as possible.
EP on Stalin
Tech
Genetics->Rocketry->Satellites>Comp>Fiber O
City management
Merchants in 4 cities with bank. When building Project, wonders, and SS parts, Engineers and Priest, otherwise scientists mostly when the cash is able to support 100% science slider. Finish current building and then a couple of airports. Build happiness building like CT and Theater if needed. Otherwise, mostly wealth.
IBT changes
Trigger the last GA
Switch to CS
GM commits the trade mission
Trade for cash with AIs
Adjust specialists in every city
Atl(Univ. lots OF, but 1H short to complete in 1 turn
)Xian(tank)
Chita(Bomber)
Irk(Bomber)
SP(Tank)
Mos(ET)
BTW, what to do with a GA if it insists to be born in SP?
