SGOTM 16 - Misfit Gypsy Nuts

[Ozbenno]

Or maybe our maker was so evil to deny us both copper and horses, forcing us to tech IW, instead of stealing it?

This.

PPP until AH is learned.

Swap tiles next turn so that both growth and warrior are 1 turn, then swap to Settler.

Warrior 1 to continue southwards, Warrior 2 to explore around pigs.

Worker to continue mine and then one chop into settler.

Paris to work corn, silk and floodplain at size 3 until mine built and then corn, silk and mine (1F2H1C is better than 3F1C for a settler no).

 

[Ronnie1]

Questions

Why explore towards Pigs? There is no defensive terrain to protect the warrior, East of the Pigs is coast I can tell from fog gazing.

The settler needs 2 chops to be walking T37.

 

[adrianj]

PPP looks good to me! As Ron suggests, perhaps clarify that you mean to do 2 forest chops.

1,2 vs 3 is identical for building the settler.

(Only time are better than for workers/settlers is if your city gets some %bonus to , eg, leader is Exp/Imp, forge, bureau, etc.)

@Ron - wouldn't it still be interesting to know if there is seafood off the eastern coast?

 

[Conquistador 63]

On Sheep vs Wheat as city2.

Wheat city will help us more in the ways of fogbusting, as our east and west flanks are already pretty safe from barb spawning. With a little luck, north shouldn't be spawning too many barbs either. Of course, there is still the horse factor to be considered.

@adrianj: Brennus can be a good friend, but we need that holy city of his. Question is, do we let him build the shrine for us or do we take it from him before that?

 

[Ozbenno]

Confirmed double chop for settler.

I doubt we want to move the warrior too far from home as I assume barb warriors/archers will appear soonish, so heading to the fog SE is too far away from home for my liking, we can fog bust the coast to see any seafood and head back towards home to act as sentry.

 

[Ronnie1]

If we are worried about sentry also, then I would want warrior 0 to head east and clear the black to our south. There is a clam there that with another food source or with horses would make that a viable 2nd city also.

@Ron - wouldn't it still be interesting to know if there is seafood off the eastern coast?

I guess all those plains tiles are just unappealing to me this early. I much prefer the river side to the west.

 

[Grifftavian]

PPP looks good to me. Good Luck, Oz!

 

[Grifftavian]

If we are worried about sentry also, then I would want warrior 0 to head east and clear the black to our south. There is a clam there that with another food source or with horses would make that a viable 2nd city also....

I like this exploration route for Warrior 0.

With the road that I inadvertently completed, Warrior 1 (when built) could get to the grass tile 1S of the Pigs in 3 turns to see if there is any additional Seafood off the coast. He could then head back to Paris in another 3 turns for Sentry duty, or head N & NW to see if there is anything else interesting with the northern Deer resources.

 

[adrianj]

I'd just like to point out that from a barb defence point of view, sitting inside our own borders isn't the best way. Better to stand out in neutral lands fog busting to prevent barbs spawning in the first place.

This strategy does require a good number of units standing around though. Another reason to keep warrior 0 close to home instead of travelling long? As with everything in this game, it is a balance. In this case we're balancing the benefits of locating AIs versus the cost of insufficient fog busting. We could always leave the distant exploring duties to a future workboat.

@adrianj: Brennus can be a good friend, but we need that holy city of his. Question is, do we let him build the shrine for us or do we take it from him before that?

I'm happy with either. It's not that I really like the guy, just that as far as neighbours go, he is better than most. I'm sure we will probably declare war on him eventually.

 

[Ozbenno]

Think that the plan for warrior 0 to head east and then north sounds good, will adopt this. Look to playing in 7-8 hours or so if everyone happy.

 

[Grifftavian]

Think that the plan for warrior 0 to head east and then north sounds good, will adopt this. Look to playing in 7-8 hours or so if everyone happy.

I'm Good Luck!

 

[Ronnie1]

I agree with AJ that the best barb defense is good fog busting and less spawning! Especially with the Creative trait, our best fog busting is more cities!

Play away!

 

[timmy827]

Sounds fine Oz.

Sleepless - good catch on EP, there is definitely at least one other AI. I'd venture at least two more - Brennus has 3 EP on us; I'm no expert on how the AI assigns it but I think he wouldn't give us an odd EP number with only two AIs, he'd go 2/2 or 0/4 presumably (?)

 

[Ozbenno]

A couple of turns in we meet someone else

He came right up to our borders so maybe south and west of us?

AH came in and what do you know

I was pretty convinced there wouldn't be any...

Also a good city site discovered south, pig and 2 gems.

Settler is out next turn so horses it is, worker finished second chop so can pasturize the horses straight away and road it up

Log

Spoiler :

Turn 35, 2600 BC: You have discovered Animal Husbandry!

Turn 36, 2560 BC: Clearing a Forest has created 20 ℤ for Paris.

 

[Grifftavian]

Good job, Oz!

The turn set roster order is....

1) Grifftavian
2) Ozbenno Just Played
3) timmy827 Up Now
4) Ronnie1 On Deck
5) Conquistador63
6) Sleepless
7) McArine

Turn Set Player Emeritus & Team Advisor
adrainj

 

[Sleepless]

Mmm have to decide where to settle again now if we want the horses asap? Grifftavian's original white spot on the hill 1W of the sheep seems much better now.

Looks like a nice couple of sites to the South but we will need IW for the pig/gems. Probably see why IW was one of the techs we need to steal from the mapmaker .

 

[Grifftavian]

I see that Brennus & Ramesses are the worst enemies of each other. Perhaps they are located pretty close to each other?

If we need to steal Iron Working from one of those two, we should decide which to target, and set all our Espionage points against that one.

 

[timmy827]

All right! I'm not going to post a PPP until we reach consensus on settling, so (re)starting that debate

I think this shows the suggested ones:

As sleepless mentioned, White-North looks more tempting with the horses.
I'm throwing out yellow as a potential horse-grabber for later. It can work those, two deer, and two grass hills; not strong but decent early production pump. This would be an option for city 3 IF we think we can delay horses. Obviously it would be nice to know if there happens to be furs/silver/anything else in the frozen north (not complaining; we just can't scout everywhere).

I personally still favor one of the white dots (not sure which one still) for current settler, using that city down the line as Great Person farm, and in near term to build Great Lighthouse. At this point in the game I think TGL is a stronger wonder for us than the Oracle; we have agreeable AIs to trade with and a lot of coastal city sites. And rather low commerce until the iron working gems.

In terms of AI competition - I looked back at the turn 1 save. The demographics indicated that two AIs have coastal capitals, so TGL is not risk-free but it is really powerful.


__________
One other point: we should focus our EP now. I'd assume Brennus since we met him first.
The total EP generated by Brennus and Ramsses we can see do not match, so there should be another AI.

 

[Ronnie1]

Nice going OZ!

Would we consider a play for the Great Wall and the EP from a Great Spy? It also makes barb incursion a non issue and allows settling at will.

I am inclined to settle SW for the reasons C63 stated earlier. I would hate to get boxed in up here in the north and have to fight our way to better cities.

 

[Grifftavian]

Re: t827's Yellow-Dot city site - could be a good location, but we'd need Hunting in order to put Camp's on the two Deer for that site to be viable. Between that and the fact that we don't know what's to the north, I'd hold off for now. OTOH, with no Copper to build Axemen, Hunting > Archery might be worth considering for Barbarian defense.

Getting the Horses hooked up ASAP addresses two needs: Chariots for both faster scouting & a better Barb defense unit (unless the Barbs come at us with a bunch of Spearmen). So I'm still inclined to put City #2 somewhere to get the horses.

If we do go to the SW with City #2, should we consider either the Yellow-Dot or Red-Dot in the attached screenshot? Yes, they're both off the river, but neither site's BFC overlaps with Paris. The riverside Plains Hill would have 4 tiles of it's BFC overlap with Paris.

The Great Wall is worth considering. It would be a great help in stealing IW. If we decide to go for it, we should switch research to Masonry now, since we have no Stone to work with. Also need masonry for the Great Lighthouse, if we go for it.

I think Brennus is more likely to go for IW before Ramesses, because Brennus needs IW to build his UU. So I'd vote to put all our Espionage points toward Brennus in hopes of eventually stealing IW.