SGOTM 22 - Anti-TSR

LowtherCastle said:
I think BW and GW(T37) is our safe route, both in terms of getting the GW and in terms of not getting overrun with barbs, but I'll go the other way, since that seems to be the consensus. Basically we're going to gamble on the optimal solution. Okay by me.
Click to expand...
What makes BW safer, exactly? Didn't someone argue earlier that getting early BW and not finding copper could be problematic? Or was that in the context of not having horses, and BW helps with whipping in any case, and we will have horses.

(Someone has to translate all this fifth dimensional stuff for the three dimensional readers ...)

Green Light from me, like I could ever give LC anything but ... ;)

dV
 
BW allows chopping and whipping (as you know). With chops, LC has been able to finish the GW ~4 turns earlier than without. So it's the safer GW path.

However, once we learn BW, warriors can no longer be used as MP units in the capital when founding/capturing a new city. So we'd either need to upgrade our warriors or build a bunch of archers/spears/axes in order to be able to settle city #2.
 
LowtherCastle said:
PPP
Tech: Masonry-Mysticism-TW (might as well focus on buildings for REX, if we fail on GW, we can still build the Great Warrior Wall)

MM: Per Pollina's plan

Warriors: be as safe as possible, collect cheap XP, move into sentry position. Forget about farming a slave from Hannibal.

Build: warrior (partial)-GW

Plan to play tomorrow if no major objections.
Click to expand...
Revised PPP

Pollina's MM
Spoiler :
nCEBdlp.jpg


Tech: Masonry-TW-Agri-Pottery-Writing-Alpha-Aesthetics-Polypath-Literature(T29)

Warriors: be as safe as possible, collect cheap XP, move into sentry position. Forget about farming a slave from Hannibal.

Build: warrior (partial)-GW
 
Turnset Report T19-42

T19

News! NWar (at Hannibal) moves SW, spots injured .6/1HP Darius scout recouperting on the flats. Golden opportunity to DoW Darius. Do we do it? I'm surely tempted. Odds of victory currently 100%.

T20

Masonry done.
*** Darius scout now CI .8/1HP 99.84% odds. We can now DoW and capture. ***

We spy magical fish 2S2E of deer. We could settle on the deer to get both gems and fish in our BFC.
Everyone gets T20 points for tiles. Hannibal had 7 tiles, Gilga had 8 tiles, all others had 9 land tiles in inner BFC. Zara had 6 tiles, Hannibal had 7 tiles, Gilga had 8 tiles, other 3 had 9 land tiles in inner BFC.

Zara (Aksum) finally grows to pop2.
Carthage build +2h to 15h. Working 2 food tiles evidently.
Darius adopts HeredRule. Took Monarchy with Oracle.

T21
I go to the Top-5 city screen and freak out, seeing The Great Wall on the World Wonders screen--we're building it. :crazyeye:

Mecca gets third cultural expansion, but only gains 2 land tiles. Evidently he has a total of 13 tiles now, having started with 9. :eek: Doesn't necessarily mean island though. Could be an isthmus. Weird, because Mecca is not coastal.
We can see Darius graphs now.
Code: 
Darius  population 
        1  2  3     4 
Hammers 4  6  7  8  9
Food    7  8 10  9 11
fhpt               12 = settler in 8t

          ar p2 rx p4 AH?
Power  17 20 21 24 25 27 
Start: archery+hunting+3xarchers?

T22
Darius/Persepolis gets its 3rd expansion and goes from 21 to 36 tiles. Completely inland.

T23
At least 5 AIs now have Mysticism!!! One of Zara/Gilga just got it, maybe both.

Zara land tiles went 6-12(T3).
Gilga land tiles went 8-15(T3).

I will try to minimize the fogbusting our warriors so that barb animals spawn as much as possible. When the Ais finally settle a city or two, we'll move the warriors into position.

T24
NWar moves next to 2 panthers. :cry:
SWar gains 2XP against a wolf.

Saladin gets Bronze Working.
Brennus has 21 land tiles in BFC.
Hannibal appears to have all land tiles in fogged BFC (15 total).

T25
NWar dies ignominiously. A search party fails to find any of his bones. There appears to be a brown stain on the jungle floor.
Saladin adopts Slavery, still threatens with an archer. He whips Mecca to pop4 (showed pop5 last turn).
Spoiler :
Uploaded to decide about fallen soldier. Note that I realized I messed up something with my demo analysis so take that stuff with a grain of salt. I'll fix it tomorrow.
Darius completes The Wheel, giving us +1bpt. :banana:

Status Report: Are AI Capitals growing?
Code: 
        1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 
Darius           p2               p3                   p4                         
Saladin             p2          p3                  p4       p5               ?>4 
Brennus             p2          p3                     p4                         
Hannibl                   p2    ---worker?---                      p3          p4 
Gilga                           ---worker?---          p2          p3             
Zara                            ---worker?---                   p2             p3
For the time being, it's hard to tell if anyone is building a settler. Saladin just whipped, but if he 2-whipped from p6>p4, then he was growing. Brennus and Darius should be about to grow to pop5 if they're growing. Only Saladin has BW so far. If he didn't whip a settler and only whips every 10t or so, then that's good for us.

MM Rome for +1f. Need to switch back next turn.

Gilga+Zara gained a combined 18 land tiles in their 3rd expansion.

T26
Sal completed an archer or barracks.

T27
Sal settles City #2. Sal owns 3 new land tiles in the process. Possibly connected isthmus to mainland.
Code: 
xxx  n
xoxxon
xxxxxn
Still threatens with archer, as do all others.
Time to complete warrior as per Pollina's advice.
The Wheel done.

T28
Mecca grows to pop5 instantly. :eek: Neither Persepolis nor Bibrachte have grown in the last 11t. :cry: Good for GW, bad for raw survival. :assimilate:

T29
Bibrachte finally grows to pop5. Did he build a settler in between? Doubt it.
Looks like either Darius or Brennus got BW. Sal still only threatens with archers.

T30
Crud! Brennus founds Vienne on a distant piece of dung. We have 3 warriors sentried and our chokepoint gets filled in 2t, hopefully.

T31
Cannibal techs Bronze Working

T32
Cannibal adopts Slavery
Judaism FIDL. We sure could have built that Shrine.

T33
--

T34
Agriculture done.
Mecca whips again. :cry: or is that good somehow?

T35
Gilgamesh founds 10th worldwide city. :eek: :eek2: :eek: :eek2: :eek: 8 new owned tiles for Gilga. How many turns will it take for the full complement of barbs to spawn. How long to lemming us? How long before we die? Let the fun begin!

Looks like Sal founded Judaism in his second city but didn't revolt since he's already Hindu.

T36
First barb warrior 1.6/2HP already appears 4 tiles from Rome. Shesus.
Sal adopts OrgRel

T37
Wounded barb warrior vanishes. New barb warrior appears 1E of EWar.
Zara settled WW City #11 for 8 new owned tiles.

T38
Damn barb evades EWar to the north. EWar has to protect our mine, Warrior1 has to move NE to protect other mine. WWar has to move south to protect third mine. Frkessima.

T39
EWar defends mine from barb attack.
Gilgamesh has BW and revolts to Slavery. BW is getting cheaper all the time.
Hannibal found WW City #12. Only Darius doesn't have second city. WTH is he building?

War1 returns to chokepoint only to find a barb warrior to the southeast.

T40
War1 defends against barb.
Some AI loses or disbands an archer somewhere. :D

T41
--

T42
Pwnage.


Uploaded.







.
 
Mitchum said:
Why? What is the advantage? Could lose Rome to wandering archer...
Click to expand...
Can't lose Rome because Darius will talk after 4t with the scout capture. The advantage is to hopefully get Darius to not build GW later on. He could build 2 settlers and still beat us to GW if he gets stone.
 
Too bad about NWar. :(

I would probably switch back to building the warrior as soon the AI settles another city. Delay to GW from pillaging barbs could be much more than the 1 turn we lose by finishing the warrior. In the unlikely case that all AIs are still at only one city on t33, I would skip the warrior and go for t41 GW.
 
Pollina said:
I would probably switch back to building the warrior as soon the AI settles another city. Delay to GW from pillaging barbs could be much more than the 1 turn we lose by finishing the warrior. In the unlikely case that all AIs are still at only one city on t33, I would skip the warrior and go for t41 GW.
Click to expand...
We now have two warriors with 2/2XP. I'm thinking they should be put where there's the most threat of mass invasion: west and north. The third has 1/2XP and goes to the east. The southern chokepoint is less precarious, once we get the fourth there because he'll only be subject to random barb movement.

So on T30 at the latest, I would stop and review the situation. Is your T33 plan based on the assumption we'll be able to run 13h on T41? One pillaged mine screws that. T32 might be a tad safer in that we could still work a 1f2h. Of course, T31 would allow 2@ 1f2h, and so on...
 
LowtherCastle said:
So on T30 at the latest, I would stop and review the situation. Is your T33 plan based on the assumption we'll be able to run 13h on T41? One pillaged mine screws that. T32 might be a tad safer in that we could still work a 1f2h. Of course, T31 would allow 2@ 1f2h, and so on...
Click to expand...
My point was that t33 is the very latest I would switch back to the warrior, especially if the AI ends up expanding super slowly. 3 defending warriors are plenty, if human barbs don't spawn until after t33.
 
Pollina said:
My point was that t33 is the very latest I would switch back to the warrior, especially if the AI ends up expanding super slowly. 3 defending warriors are plenty, if human barbs don't spawn until after t33.
Click to expand...
Yes, I understood that part, sorry for not acknowledging it. That's a good strategy, I think. I was carrying your idea forward and looking at how many hammers the GW would have on T41 in that case. We wouldn't want GW completion to leak into T43.
 
Hi...

You probably asked yourself already what was going on with me. Well: I had a massive Virus / Malware infection that I only discovered accidentally because I followed a link to a (good! ) site, that can check the security of a PC online. It seems, that my whole network is infected, so mobile, router, notebook. I'm fighting against the Malware for over a week already, installed my system newly three times, and I believe, that I got the infection under control now. Required over 10 different programs, because normal scanners like Avira Free or Malwarebytes don't detect such infections, because the Malware infects their code and hides from them, so even if one thinks one is safe, probably the opposite is true.

You can send me your eMails per PM, then you'll get a long mail from me that informs you about what I learned over the past weeks, so basically everything you need to know about Computer and Internet safety in 2015. This is important info for you, so do it.

It's gonna need some days, maybe a whole week or two, 'til I'm fully back. I still need to monitor my devices if the infection reappears (could be the case if it's one of those superheavy but very rare "BIOS infections" ) , and then I need to set up all of my systems completely from scratch. I've also decided to upgrade to Windows 10, because the moment is perfect, as I need to set up everything newly anyhow, and against my initial fear, that Windows 10 was a bad OS because of security and privacy issues, I read very much that makes the impression, that Windows 10 is really good, that it's the OS for the future, and that all security and privacy issues can be solved via (very well) hidden settings.
Anyhow, this will require a lot of work so cost me a lot of time, because I upgrade from Windows 7 and use an Alienware M17r X4 Notebook, and there's no Windows 10 support for that model, so I have to find out which drivers I can use. It's definitely possible, many M17 owners have done it already, but most use the official DELL Win 8.1 drivers, I want something better, like using Win 10 drivers from the manufacturors of the components (i. e. Intel or Realtek) and find tutorials for how to mod the installation information, so they accept my notebook as supported hardware. This is possible, but there are almost no manuals on how to do this specifically for the M17 in the net, but I will search further.

So much from me for now. Do what I wrote about sending me your eMail, and all the best to you all for the moment.

Your teammate & friend,

Seraiel
 
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