Dhoomstriker
Girlie Builder
- Joined
- Aug 12, 2006
- Messages
- 13,452
Well played! Great job at Beshbalik!
Here are the current votes available:
Saladin 88
Hatty 24
Us 57
Kublai 21
Frederick 8
Darius 3
Mao 1
Churchill, Gandhi, Joao, and Stalin 0
We might get another 11 Votes next turn if Islam spreads successfully in XO Cognac
If we wanted to get a couple of more votes ourselves, we could cold-whip another Islamic Missionary and then spread it next turn, before the AP Vote.
We'd then have the option of doubling our Votes by switching into Islam as our State Religion
Kublai has 3 Islamic Cities, so we'd have no way to capture all of his Islamic Cities before the next AP Resolution, so if the Resolution is to stop the war against us, we'd have to Cease Fire with Kublai.
From previous Voting Results on T120:
91/148 = 61.5% were required for the Resolution to pass
Let's assume, then, that 60% are required for a Resolution to pass, such that we could block a Resolution with 40% or more of the Votes
Currently, there are 202 votes.
Just going with the current numbers, if we switched into Islam, we'd have 114 Votes and there would be a total of 202 + 57 = 257 Votes
114/257 = 44%
So, we already have enough Votes ourselves to block any Resolution if we switch into Islam. That's a comforting thought.
We have 2 turns until we can switch Civics again. Thebes looks to be a tempting target, but I think that we should be patient and try to get Kublai as our Vassal before we get involved in a war with Mao + Hatty, since Kublai still thinks that "his side" is stronger than "our side" of the war, and we don't want to give ourselves another enemy--although, it would be nice to know for sure whether a war with a third-party would be calculated in Kublai's relative Power evaluation formula; for now, I'll assume that third-party wars will get factored into his formula.
Mao is still only +1 toward us, so getting him to +3 (according to the test game) won't get him up to Pleased status, so No State Religion doesn't seem like it will help us as much as going into Islam could.
We won't have to switch into Islam until next turn, since the Resolution will be proposed at the end of next turn (the end of the turn where the F8 MEMBERS screen says "Turns until next Vote: 0"), so we can still benefit from Christian Pacifism for one more turn (the current turn).
There is a stack of 3 Workers with 1 Horse Archer that Kublai's Keshiks could theoretically attack, if he uses AI cheating radar to see them, by moving 1 W along Stalin's Road > 1 SW onto a GH Riv > 1 SW to attack the stack. If we temporarily reinforce those Units with Rostov's Chariot, the attack will be less likely to occur and also less likely to succeed.
It will probably be wise to send our Great Artist to our core Cities' area, both for the sake of safety and so that if we get other Great People, it could be used in one of our Legendary Cities for more "seed" Culture for our Spread Culture Espionage Missions.
I do have a concern that Frederick may tech Machinery, or get it in trade, before we're ready to attack him.
On the plus side, his Spearmen cannot be upgraded to Macemen, so it wouldn't be totally nasty, just somewhat nasty to deal with. Oh well, again, we shouldn't get involved in other wars until Kublai is our Vassal, so Frederick will just have to wait.
We have 19 Spies in London.
Assuming about 1500 see Culture, we need 73 Spies there. Uhhhh. Let's hope that we luckily get an AP Victory? Heh. If we used a Great Artist Culture Bomb, we'd "only" need 47 Spies there. It's actually quite a tall order, but let's see what we can do with very aggressive 1-pop-whipping.
With us getting out of Nationhood soon, there's less of a need to preserve population points for Drafting purposes.
Micro:
Paris can work one more Cottage
Orleans needs a Military Police Unit
Hamburg can work a Farm instead of a Coast to try to grow +1 population point, allowing us to later 1-pop-whip a Temple and still have a citizen remaining to turn into a Priest Specialist
Now is the last time to make Chariots, as we'll probably be switching to 100% Science in 2 turns when we can switch back into Bureaucracy (unless there are objections to switching), and it looks like Aberdeen is going to make a Chariot in 2 turns' time. I'm not sure that we really need more than that
If we can get a Road at 1 SW + 1 S of St. Pete's, we could build an Islamic Missionary in Cologne and spread it in St. Pete's one turn sooner than we otherwise might
Argent is better off not working 2-H TunH squares--we didn't choose to build Windmills, so we can hire a Scientist instead
I'm surprised that Mao hasn't traded Paper to Hatty for a tech, such as Machinery. Perhaps it is because Mao is only Cautious toward Hatty. Let's see if we can figure it out... yes, it looks like Mao hordes techs, so almost everyone else would have to know Paper before he'd trade it away. So, there's no need for us to gift Paper to Hatty.
Joao won't trade Paper away until 6 AIs know it, so we don't have to worry there, either.
But, we do need to watch out for Friendly-Friendly relationships, such as Mao + Kublai being Friendly toward each other--Kublai probably CANNOT become our Vassal if we go to war with Mao + Hatty because of that relationship. So, we'll be stuck without Thebes for a while longer
Note that Saladin has Paper, so we'll have to keep an eye on him learning Education; do you guys know how to tell when an AI learns a tech that we have researched? On the F4 TECHS screen, if an AI who knows Paper doesn't have Education in the Wants column, then Liberalism will be in jeopardy of being stolen out from under us. AIs who do not know Paper will have Paper in the Wants column, unless those AIs don't know both of Civil Service and Theology, in which case Civil Service and Theology will appear in the Wants column.
Cottages are not going to be useful build items to build at this point, so if we have absolutely nothing else to do with our Workers (such as the Workers in London), we can build Workshops on unimproved squares, but I doubt that those Workshops will ever get worked.
So, overall items:
No declaring war on Mao + Hatty until Kublai is our Vassal UNLESS we are going to be prepared to Cease Fire with Mao before making Kublai our Vassal
T147
Do some micro
T148
Switch State Religion to Islam
Try to bribe Saladin into a war, preferably against Kublai, but maybe also against Gandhi
Double-check the voting totals to ensure that we can block a Resolution, if needed
T149
Vote No to probably just about any Resolution
If necessary, take steps to ensure that the Resolution won't pass, such as by going to war with Mao + Hatty, but I think that recapturing Thebes and dragging out a long war with Mao, while being unable to Capitulate Kublai, is actually going to make our end game longer than if we simply live without Representation + Free Religion, so preferably, we can just block such a Resolution with our voting
I'm glad that you're prepared!Cactus Pete said:Keshik shows up 2 west of Moscow. (WEs are in place.)
Good call. A related point to keep at the backs of our minds is that in BtS, unlike Vanilla, siege Units are invinsible from the Collateral Damage that other siege Units cause when another siege Unit attacks a stack, with the defending siege Units able to "soak up" some of the Collateral Damage hits and deflect them into nothingness.Cactus Pete said:Also, moved several units away from 1W of Beshbalik to minimize potential cat damage.
We could do that, although since we can't trade Drama to Joao, we might see an AI trade Drama to Joao for one of his techs. Mao also has 0 Gold to trade right now, so we'd probably need to gift it to him, too, to avoid him trading away one of his techs. We also couldn't trade Drama to Kublai, so we might just create a situation where the AIs get multiple techs traded around. We'd then potentially anger some AIs by trading with their Worst Enemies with "good" deals for those Worst Enemy AIs. For now, until we have Kublai as our Vassal, I suggest that we hold off on that trading, and then perhaps reconsider doing the trading once Kublai is our Vassal (even though we still wouldn't be able to trade with Joao, since we'd need to remain at war with Joao).Cactus Pete said:Gandhi and others have gold to trade -- for Drama?
Good call. At least we'll get in a bit more Bombarding in the meantime.Cactus Pete said:Mace at Macau is so badly wounded by our HA that he doesn't confront our WE, so I delay attacking until he heals a bit and defends the city again.
Thanks for the heads-up!Cactus Pete said:Have continued to draft 3 units each turn (one of those prematurely this turn in England)
Here are the current votes available:
Saladin 88
Hatty 24
Us 57
Kublai 21
Frederick 8
Darius 3
Mao 1
Churchill, Gandhi, Joao, and Stalin 0
We might get another 11 Votes next turn if Islam spreads successfully in XO Cognac
If we wanted to get a couple of more votes ourselves, we could cold-whip another Islamic Missionary and then spread it next turn, before the AP Vote.
We'd then have the option of doubling our Votes by switching into Islam as our State Religion
Kublai has 3 Islamic Cities, so we'd have no way to capture all of his Islamic Cities before the next AP Resolution, so if the Resolution is to stop the war against us, we'd have to Cease Fire with Kublai.
From previous Voting Results on T120:
91/148 = 61.5% were required for the Resolution to pass
Let's assume, then, that 60% are required for a Resolution to pass, such that we could block a Resolution with 40% or more of the Votes
Currently, there are 202 votes.
Just going with the current numbers, if we switched into Islam, we'd have 114 Votes and there would be a total of 202 + 57 = 257 Votes
114/257 = 44%
So, we already have enough Votes ourselves to block any Resolution if we switch into Islam. That's a comforting thought.
We have 2 turns until we can switch Civics again. Thebes looks to be a tempting target, but I think that we should be patient and try to get Kublai as our Vassal before we get involved in a war with Mao + Hatty, since Kublai still thinks that "his side" is stronger than "our side" of the war, and we don't want to give ourselves another enemy--although, it would be nice to know for sure whether a war with a third-party would be calculated in Kublai's relative Power evaluation formula; for now, I'll assume that third-party wars will get factored into his formula.
Mao is still only +1 toward us, so getting him to +3 (according to the test game) won't get him up to Pleased status, so No State Religion doesn't seem like it will help us as much as going into Islam could.
We won't have to switch into Islam until next turn, since the Resolution will be proposed at the end of next turn (the end of the turn where the F8 MEMBERS screen says "Turns until next Vote: 0"), so we can still benefit from Christian Pacifism for one more turn (the current turn).
There is a stack of 3 Workers with 1 Horse Archer that Kublai's Keshiks could theoretically attack, if he uses AI cheating radar to see them, by moving 1 W along Stalin's Road > 1 SW onto a GH Riv > 1 SW to attack the stack. If we temporarily reinforce those Units with Rostov's Chariot, the attack will be less likely to occur and also less likely to succeed.
It will probably be wise to send our Great Artist to our core Cities' area, both for the sake of safety and so that if we get other Great People, it could be used in one of our Legendary Cities for more "seed" Culture for our Spread Culture Espionage Missions.
I do have a concern that Frederick may tech Machinery, or get it in trade, before we're ready to attack him.
On the plus side, his Spearmen cannot be upgraded to Macemen, so it wouldn't be totally nasty, just somewhat nasty to deal with. Oh well, again, we shouldn't get involved in other wars until Kublai is our Vassal, so Frederick will just have to wait.
We have 19 Spies in London.
Assuming about 1500 see Culture, we need 73 Spies there. Uhhhh. Let's hope that we luckily get an AP Victory? Heh. If we used a Great Artist Culture Bomb, we'd "only" need 47 Spies there. It's actually quite a tall order, but let's see what we can do with very aggressive 1-pop-whipping.
With us getting out of Nationhood soon, there's less of a need to preserve population points for Drafting purposes.
Micro:
Paris can work one more Cottage
Orleans needs a Military Police Unit
Hamburg can work a Farm instead of a Coast to try to grow +1 population point, allowing us to later 1-pop-whip a Temple and still have a citizen remaining to turn into a Priest Specialist
Now is the last time to make Chariots, as we'll probably be switching to 100% Science in 2 turns when we can switch back into Bureaucracy (unless there are objections to switching), and it looks like Aberdeen is going to make a Chariot in 2 turns' time. I'm not sure that we really need more than that
If we can get a Road at 1 SW + 1 S of St. Pete's, we could build an Islamic Missionary in Cologne and spread it in St. Pete's one turn sooner than we otherwise might
Argent is better off not working 2-H TunH squares--we didn't choose to build Windmills, so we can hire a Scientist instead
I'm surprised that Mao hasn't traded Paper to Hatty for a tech, such as Machinery. Perhaps it is because Mao is only Cautious toward Hatty. Let's see if we can figure it out... yes, it looks like Mao hordes techs, so almost everyone else would have to know Paper before he'd trade it away. So, there's no need for us to gift Paper to Hatty.
Joao won't trade Paper away until 6 AIs know it, so we don't have to worry there, either.
But, we do need to watch out for Friendly-Friendly relationships, such as Mao + Kublai being Friendly toward each other--Kublai probably CANNOT become our Vassal if we go to war with Mao + Hatty because of that relationship. So, we'll be stuck without Thebes for a while longer
Note that Saladin has Paper, so we'll have to keep an eye on him learning Education; do you guys know how to tell when an AI learns a tech that we have researched? On the F4 TECHS screen, if an AI who knows Paper doesn't have Education in the Wants column, then Liberalism will be in jeopardy of being stolen out from under us. AIs who do not know Paper will have Paper in the Wants column, unless those AIs don't know both of Civil Service and Theology, in which case Civil Service and Theology will appear in the Wants column.
Cottages are not going to be useful build items to build at this point, so if we have absolutely nothing else to do with our Workers (such as the Workers in London), we can build Workshops on unimproved squares, but I doubt that those Workshops will ever get worked.
So, overall items:
No declaring war on Mao + Hatty until Kublai is our Vassal UNLESS we are going to be prepared to Cease Fire with Mao before making Kublai our Vassal
T147
Do some micro
T148
Switch State Religion to Islam
Try to bribe Saladin into a war, preferably against Kublai, but maybe also against Gandhi
Double-check the voting totals to ensure that we can block a Resolution, if needed
T149
Vote No to probably just about any Resolution
If necessary, take steps to ensure that the Resolution won't pass, such as by going to war with Mao + Hatty, but I think that recapturing Thebes and dragging out a long war with Mao, while being unable to Capitulate Kublai, is actually going to make our end game longer than if we simply live without Representation + Free Religion, so preferably, we can just block such a Resolution with our voting