SGOTM 9 - jeffelammar

[pindicator]

I tend to agree with putting it at the Iron Works site in Spain. It's in Stravanger right now, but I imagine Ghandi should take that town within the next 5-10 turns. Our capital being in Entremont, Steel Harbor seems the next best spot.

 

[TimBentley]

I skipped a year in my log, so I played 11 turns; nothing exciting happened except for four cities given to the Celts, two cities razed by India, and war with the Celts (and that really hasn't been exciting) anyways.

1725(0): start transferring slaves to mainland and natives back
found Celtic uranium
do some minor MM

1730(1): it won't do much good if the Celts have a resource and don't know it
give Celts 1000g for possible trade

1735(2): Celts bought motorized transportation from India for music theory, almost 1000g

IBT: Entremont builds Wall Street

1740(3): zzz

IBT: Camulodunum builds Heroic Epic

1745(4): give Celts 4000g

1750(5): Celts bought rocketry
Interesting: India culture cuts our railroad path
give Celts Celtic Alum, New Svolvaer, New Honningsvag, Celtic uranium
New Honningsvag does not currently control uranium

IBT: learn recycling, start on integrated defense

1752(6): apparently I forgot to log this turn (as such I took 11 turns)

1754(7): Celts sold aluminum to India; Celts know amphibious warfare

IBT: Celts, India sign MA against us
Entremont riots

1756(8): zzz

IBT: India razes Bergen

1758(9): sell some libraries providing no extra science in cities India could capture in one turn

IBT: India overruns airfield (and the mech inf is fortified there)

1760(10): good, India just produced a few mech infantry

IBT: India razes Reykjavik

1762(11): kill Celt TOW that dared to enter our territory

Notes: 62 tiles to the domination limit
for the Celts to have an extra uranium, New Honningsvag needs culture or New Bodo needs to cease being a Scandinavian city (but they don't know fission yet, so no hurry yet)
Would it be worth 68g to plant a spy in the Celts?
Alesia's about to expand so we have some aluminum
I figured the MGL could rush the FP (won't be too long, I suspect)
I thought maybe being 2 tiles from one of their cities caused them to raze Bergen and Reykjavik, but I tested that in another game and they kept the city; nevertheless, I wouldn't be surprised if they razed Fauske

Here is the save.
Screenshots from end of turns attached.

 

[denyd]

How's our military strength against those two? Maybe he felt that either he couldn't defend them or the flip risk was too high (or maybe his meds haven't kicked in yet).

Have we done a investigation of what he's building lately? When you investigate the capital, check out what resources & luxuries he has?

Have we got a spy planted in the Celts yet? We might want to use him to sabotage some Celtic military builds. Does either the Celts or India have rubber or oil yet? If we can keep oil from them, we'll face a much weaker attack force, though we'll still see cruise missles.

 

[Paul#42]

Sometimes you guys are pretty fast...

to pindicator & tim.

To lose to Gandhi is one of the toughest tasks I ever faced in Civ3

This guy is really giving us some headache, isn't he?

I think I can get it in about 12 hours from now (when kids are sleeping, finally) and play right away.

 

[Jove]

Nice job.

It's good to know that Brennus and Ghandi will trade with each other. We might as well continue the charity until Brennus catches up in tech. But with 4000g in the bank, Ghandi would rather wait 8 turns for a barracks than buy it? What is up with that guy??

 

[Paul#42]

I'd say: Watch Gandhi's cash flow and wait with further investments till he has learned how to deal with money. Remember this guy just learned currency after 5000 years paying with shells and leaves (like some consultants suggested as there where plenty of those)

We want him to still get money when he is on track to become a space cowboy. By the way, does anybody know whether the AI buys future technologies?

But this kid razing our flouring cities makes me cry
I wonder if there was any other civilisation less inappropriate for this quest than India

 

[TimBentley]

Have we got a spy planted in the Celts yet? We might want to use him to sabotage some Celtic military builds. Does either the Celts or India have rubber or oil yet? If we can keep oil from them, we'll face a much weaker attack force, though we'll still see cruise missles.

No spy in Celts yet (doing so would be good). Both of them have rubber, but no oil; Celts would get oil with a cultural expansion in their southern island city.

 

[Paul#42]

No spy in Celts yet (doing so would be good). Both of them have rubber, but no oil; Celts would get oil with a cultural expansion in their southern island city.

Now wouldn't that be a nice spot for our Inf-Army?

 

[Paul#42]

Got it.

India has oil right next to Stockholm. Can't take that away from them...

 

[Paul#42]

Pre flight check

nothing special. peaceful times...

Take off

1) 1762
plant spy in Delhi (again ) - successful
investigate city of New Svolvaer - totally corrupt, building a Marine - due in 103 turns
Delhi prospers, builds a university due in 23 turns

Trondheim shrinks. Four entertainers. Building third Mech Inf. No elephants around
Channel City started a destroyer Gandhi is finally about to explore the seven seas!!
All towns still have most of their improvements. All have also wonders IIRC. That's why he kept

them...
Start evacuating those workers on the mountain chain.

IBT India captures a slave near Oslo.

2) 1764
some movements...

IBT Indias take Birka and keeps it! (it provides Ivory)

3) 1766
India ows 3673g. Doesn't rush any builds.

IBT zzz

4) 1768 India down to 3269g. What are they spending money on?

IBT zzz

5) 1770 zzz

IBT zzz

6) 1772 founded Reykjavik in northern Spain to keep Celts from thinking expansion

IBT zzz

7) 1774 zzz

IBT zzz

8) 1776 time for some investigations:
India
Trondheim (2) builds settler
Channel City (2) a destroyer (at 20spt with 2 citizens)
OSlo (1) finishes third TOW.
Stockholm (1) started MA (24 turns at 4spt)
Birks (7, still 6 resistors) builds Mech Inf (due in 15 at 6 spt)
Aarhus (4) builds settler
Molde (2) Mech Inf (in 6 at 12 spt)

Celts
Delhi (11) university in 16 (7 spt)
other cities are busy building nonsense due in 100 turns

rush a factory with 2 armies in Washington to celebrate your independence day

IBT Indian Invasion!!
Capture Stavanger, Hovd, destroy (2SE of Batsfjord)
capture Alesund, Bodo, destroy Karasjok, Tromso,
capture Fauske

9) 1778 crash - reload from autosave...

IBT zzz

10) 1780 done
can you believe that: I ended C3C without saving. Reload from autosave and save again


After flight check

I made a fast turnset this time.
Gandhi advances slowly. He does not seem to want too many resistant cities.
No elephants seen yet. Maybe he wants to trigger his GA by building a wonder?
I did not rebuild our FP yet as Iron Works will be finished next turn there.
Gandhi owns 10 towns by now. We can rebuild our new home in Celts' island. 116 tiles from domination

Here is the save

 

[denyd]

Hello CKS are you out there??

 

[denyd]

Ok if CKS hasn't checked in by 8pm PST tomorrow night (Monday), I'll pick it up.

 

[CKS]

Go ahead and play, denyd. I do have internet access again, but I haven't gotten caught up with the reading yet, and I wouldn't have time to play until Wednesday anyway.

 

[pindicator]

Just want to jump in and say I will be away from my computer on Wednesday and won't be back to it until Saturday

 

[denyd]

Quick update: I was in turn 5 when we lost power last night. So far Iron Works & Pentagon are done. Two more MA Armies in the field. Most of Celtic island is settled. Now starting on islands.

As for Gandhi the Moron, all he's done in raze about 5 cities. I bought peace & Ampibious War from Brennus for about 7,000g and he bought Fission from Gandhi for 10,000g and Gandhi hasn't spent a penny yet. All he's building are MA & MI.

I've got one idea I'm trying to get Gandhi to keep our cities. I'm cash rushing settlers in a couple cities to get them to size one and hopefully he'll keep those (less flip risk).

Any and all suggestions welcome before I play another 5 tonight.

PS: Where did we want the FP?

 

[Jove]

PS: Where did we want the FP?

Well, there isn't a town there yet, but in the NE part of old Celtland is a spot where another Ironworks can be built. Looks great for another FP to me. Found it, stuff it, built it.

Other advice, hmmm, ... We need to undertand better what 'motivates' Ghandi. How does he make his decisions? Surely when 'he' looks out at the game, he sees some kind of table with weighted values. What are they? Specifically, what will make him value capturing then keeping our cities, and then of course build what we want?

 

[denyd]

http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/sgotm9/Jeffelammar_SG009_AD1800_01.SAV

Turn Log 6

Turn 0 – 1780 AD – Clean up some pollution – Who built the Modern Paratrooper and why? – Found Napa to add wines to our list – Trade 1000g to Celts for WM and a Peace Treaty – Trade 6000g to Celts for Amphibious Warfare – Spend 150g to investigate the 6 Indian cities all building Modern Armor or Mech Infantry

IBT: India razes Batsfjord – (I’m not going to record city builds unless it’s special) – Steel City builds Iron Works starts – Note that India now has 10000g and Celts have Fission

Turn 1 – 1782 AD – Move some native workers out of harms way – Load up a MA Army

IBT: India razed Uskudar

Turn 2 – 1784 AD – I’m going to try something– I’m going to hurry settlers to get a couple cities to population 2 and see if India will keep it – Evacuate some native workers

IBT: Gandhi comes calling – Sorry no peace – New Reykjavik is razed – Neti Oslo is razed

Turn 3 – 1786 AD – Hurry a bunch of settlers

IBT: Ulaanbaatar is razed – Hippo is razed – New Oslo is razed – Alesia builds Pentagon – India still has 10,000g

Turn 4 – 1788 AD – Hurry some more settlers – Found New Forbidden Palace City

IBT: Tabriz is razed – Discover Integrated Defense research Stealth at 20%

Turn 5 – 1790 AD – Move our 20 new settlers in place to be captured – Hurry a bunch more settlers – Locate MGL and send him to future FP city

IBT: Horningsvag is razed – Elverum is razed – Neu Trondheim (size 1 city) is razed – So my idea of India keeping size 1 cities won’t work – no more hurried settlers – Future to be razed cities now to be set to wealth

Turn 6 – 1792 AD – Reset all settlers in process to something else

IBT: Leptis Magna is razed

Turn 7 – 1794 AD – Entremont starts SDI – India just spent about 400g (Still at 9,956g) – A brief (3 city) investigation shows Gandhi building MI & MA units in major cities – Note that Stavanger is back to size 14 – I should also mention that India is now Fascist

IBT: Sarpsborg is captured – Lillehammer is razed – Gandhi spent another 800g

Turn 8 – 1796 AD – MGL hurries Forbidden Palace

IBT: - Almarikh is razed – Forbidden City builds Forbidden Palace

Turn 9 – 1798 AD – Notice that India has founded Bangalore, Lahore, Bombay, Calcutta & Madras is recent turns – Discover we still had a musket and upgrade him – Move the Warriors north in case India ever builds a WE – India now up to 4 destroyers, 4 MA & 44 MI (also 4 TOW) and 16 cities.

IBT: Carthage is captured

Turn 10 – 1800 AD – Just some pollution cleaning and setting up sacrificial settlers

It is a bit frustrating to watch Gandhi raze all of our hard work. He only kept 2 cities and one had a wonder while razing quite a few. SDI comes on line next turn. Gandhi still has +9K gold, so there's no hurry on sending any more gold his way for a while. I did notice in my last city examine that Gandhi does not yet have uranium available. We should check out why. We're about 125 tile from the limit, so we might want to build a library or temple on the Celtic island and once we've expanded, sell the culture building off. We're at 50K with about 100 per turn, so no worry about winning that way.

I did notice that we're ahead of the other 2 teams in the 1800's in Jason score for what that's worth.

 

[jeffelammar]

Rock On guys. I see it. I have a hockey game at 8:15 tonight, but I may be able to start afterwards. If I don't get to it tonight, then tomorrow evening is free.

@CKS - if you want to play tonight, please feel free to do so. Just post a got it so I don't duplicate. I'll place a got it later tonight if I do play tonight.

 

[Jove]

Nice experiment with the settlers. Too bad it didn't work, but at least we can cross that off the list.

I had an idea in the same vein... maybe we'd seem less threatening to Ghandi if we were in anarchy. jeffelammar wanted to switch to Communism for fun anyway, so there's the motive. Wanna give it a shot?

 

[Paul#42]

I guess it's just our culture that's threatening him - maybe we rather switch to fachism to minimize culture growth? I never played each of them so I'm fine with both.

We had thought about placing the FP in Spain's Iron City because cities on Celtic island will have low corruption anyway. Placing it in Spain would provide us with one powerhouse there - not that it would matter much...
Maybe even Madrid (or some other) would be the better site if we put stress on commerce over production.

It is really disappointing to see another nice plan fail
I can't wait to see how the other teams coped with those problems...
Looking back I'd say Gandhi would have developed better if he had come out of the box in Ancient Times. Good thing we had no chance to let him out before Modern Times so we can't regret a wrong decision.

If Gandhi really razes ALL towns, maybe we should disband some cities to have no overlap to reduce flip risk?

Did we already gift all slaves to Gandhi to provide him with new happy citizens?