SGOTM8 - Bede

Here is the save:

http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/sgotm8/Bede_SG008_AD1405_01.SAV

I am not a happy old monk when I open the save. Too much money in the treasury, we have an MPP with Japan, and a Military Alliance against China and Rome, the MPP includes Ivory from Japan and gpt from us :eek:, the MPP has eight or nine to run and the alliances have 19, 90% corrupt towns building marketplaces and using way too much food, libraries and universities missing from the core, and most of the work force ganged on two mountains outside the usuable terrain building roads. :shakehead

So here we go:

First thing to do is get of the cash by rushing some needed projects, then go looking for Steam.

Liz offers the best price out there and I don't want to feed the Japanese beast anymore anyway and Liz is getting three of our luxuries for shump change, anyway. So it's let make a few deals

1350_01.jpg


1350_02.jpg


1350_03.jpg


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Can't forget Lizzie's cousin, the Dane, as he has something we need too

1350_05.jpg


And finally I buy Lizzies's incense for cash.

1350_06.jpg


And that was pretty much that, running rails in the core and a mainline out to the provinces, managing the citizens to get the optimum research output (electricity in 10 with positive cash) which meant fiddling the assignments every time a town grew or a university or library came on line, fighting off a Roman invasion (a single cavalryman who killed two of ours before dying), paying off the Dane

1360_01.jpg


who declared war in an alliance with Rome a few turns later, the bum.

And then we get this news

1370_01.jpg


Looks like Liz is taking over the top dog slot as Toku is taking it hard, the Romans have taken his horses and coal and at least two towns.

The budget takes careful management right now but if all goes well we will get healthy in a hurry in about ten as it looks like only Rome has researched Electricity and everyone else is researching the government knowledge. England now has all the money in the world, most of it ours, and we should be able to relieve her of it soon.

The rail gangs concentrated on the core towns trying to jack output by railing high shield tiles. Keep them at it until you have squeezed every shield you can out of the mountains and plains. Cut the forests if that will help with a building project, then mine and rail. Look for long food towns and cut it back to 24 by mining (that applies only to the cities south of the mountains. Every north of that should be watered until half the population are either tax guys or scientists depending on which gives the best output of cash/research. Anything north of St Louis needs no buildings at all. Keep them building cannon as you can never have enough of those and you can always dump the shields for a worker or settler if you need one, or cash rush if there is enough in the kitty.

Resiopolis should be watered until the citizens can work the mines in the mountains.

Toku has ivory for sale if you need it. And you probably will as the towns in the south grow to city size.

Obligatory roster check


SpikeIt - gets to manage the ToE preparation
azzaman - skip to my lou
residuetiger - did okay. got a leader but I am a little concerned about the MPP. That could bite us if Toku gets to feeling his oats.
juballs2001 - Got the Romans and the Chinaman off the island. Nice. And bought us some breathing space with WW1
Bede - sold the farm but got us Steam
 
Sounds like we're in the neighborhood of 25 turns to Sci Method. Can't check out the save until this evening. When electricity comes in, if Lizzy doesn't have it we may want to trade for Industrialization so we can get a factory in Newark. It can start a pre-build for either a factory or ToE any time now I would guess.
 
Ah criticism, the spice of life!!!!

Yes, yes, the MPP with Japan was my doing, but dammit, I say I am not a crook!!!

....wait, that's for a different speach.

Well anyway, I hope it doesn't bite us in the ass, and I don't think it will.

Good job btw, on the trades that got us Steam and medicine, Bede.

Like I said in an earlier post, I try to make the best decisions I can at the time, so keep the friendly criticism coming, I'll learn eventually.

On a completely off topic subject, who is getting Civ 4?
 
Oooh. Looks like some management turns. Got it. Now I just have to analyze to figure out what the heck is going on! Nice job of trading there Bede, as usual.
 
I took a look at the save and think that Newark should switch immediately to a palace. At 20 spt, that will deliver ToE in 30 turns. We have 9 to electricity which would give us 21 turns to make it to Scientific Method. We can do that easily enough.
 
Go for the Pre-build Spike.
 
Almost done, but won't be able to post the finish until tomorrow. Rome has started ToE, but in a poor city. Japan is close to finished. Rome and England are the big dogs.
 
[0] 1405AD
We can build the Heroic Epic and Military Academy. Maybe we should?
We have 24gpt income right now.
MM to cut one more turn off Electricity.
Switch Newark to palace pre-build for TOE

IBT
What budget woes? Rome and England sign peace.
China and Greece sign peace.
Japan and Greece MPP
Oh yeah, Greece is OCC now.

[1] 1410AD
So now no deals with Greece.
Up tech pace. Elec. due in 7.
Start Heroic Epic in DC.

[2] 1415AD
Worker moves. Elec. due in 6.
Chinese want to talk.

IBT
Chinese musket pulls up next to DC.

[3] 1420AD
Rome still only with Electricity.

IBT
Chinese land cav next to Washington. Romans start ToE. That can't be good.

[4] 1425AD
Chinese invaders are gone.
ToE is being built in Reading of all cities. Its not in their core. We still should have a shot. We don't have the money currently to check this out, but I don't think we need to yet.

IBT
Rome is making great strides against Japan. it won't be long now.

[5] 1430AD
Just working tiles.

IBT
Greece and Rome sign peace.

[6] 1435AD
England has iron clads

[7] 1440AD
Electicity due in 1. Hopefully we can turn that into some factories as well. Japanese alliances up next turn as well.

IBT
OCC Greeks "offer" MPP, ROP with us paying 17gpt! Later Jack.
Electicity comes in. Sci Method due in 13.

[8] 1445AD
Rome has replaceable parts.
Electricity for Industrialization, 20 gold and WM from Japan.
Washington Heroic Epic build switched to factory.

IBT
Rome lands a couple of infantry next to Burlington!
We lose our incense - English deals are up.

[9] 1450AD

Our 12 canons take off 4 hps off the infantry. That still leaves 5 hps left. We will likely lose a cav to take them out. Instead, I load 4 muskets into Burlington. we'll let them attack if they dare. They can't take the city, we can bombard further and then clear next turn when they have more damage.

We are railroaded from North to south except for the two north tundra cities. Mountains and such are railroaded down south and Resiopolis has been irrigated to grow into its shield potential.

Newark is pulling 24 spt on palace prebuild for ToE. ToE costs 600 shields and we have 183 invested already. I could either switch to factory or just keep prebuilding. Factory would be due in 3. Some math: 417/24 gives us 17 turns to ToE. Take 3 turns for factory, and start prebuild/ToE build gives us 3 turns + 600/36 (or less - i forget exactly how the multipliers affect the factory) = 19 turns. I stick to the pre-build and no factory.

We may be able to rush the factory, but with a 1 turn difference, if the multiplier won't gain us 36gpt, it won't be worth it.

We need our incense back. Plus we could use England and Rome fighting as they are the two top dogs. Japan's goose is cooked soon. We should watch for Japan to get down to 1 city and try and buy some techs from him. Sanitation might be useful.

So back to Liz. I cancel the wine deal with Liz.
Then I trade dyes and gems for incense and 43 gold.
PAK_1450AD_Liz1.jpg

Next we ally with England against Rome for 23 gpt.
PAK_1450AD_Liz2.jpg

Lastly we recoup some money and end our alliance with Liz against China adding 24gpt back into the bank.

The Corporation is out there and Liz will sell for the right price. We can buy it, but it will slow research on Sci Method by at least 3 turns. With ToE only possible in 16 turns anyhow, this might be worthwhile. Current Research on Sci Method is due in 8.

Ooops. Looking at civ assist, this is supposed to be turn 10. I guess I got a shorter shift this go round by one turn. I'll stop here. Sorry I completed the deals on last turn.

Remember - There are two infantry to our north. I left the cavs with movement so if the next player wants to finish them off this turn, go ahead, but I suggest waiting a turn an take them when they are weaker. Also USE the F1 screen religiously. You can click on a specialist head to switch them between clown/taxman/scientist. Use this to get the fastest research at the lowest cost by going through your cities and one by one switchig specialists one way or the other to either cut a research turn or get the most money for the current pace.

Good luck team!

http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/sgotm8/Bede_SG008_AD1450_01.SAV
 
Just a quick bump here.

residuetiger - UP
juballs2001 - On Deck - hopefully will build us ToE
Bede - sold the farm but got us Steam
SpikeIt - started ToE prebuild and rail roaded away
azzaman - skip to my lou
 
I got the save, but i'm heading off to work at the moment, I may be able to finish tomorrow. I've read the reports so far, but if any of you have any advice, let me hear it, I'll be cruising the boards tonight at work I'm sure.
 
Spike's summary of where to go from here is pretty good I think.
 
One point to make. If we have ToE in 16 and Sci Method in 8, that leaves us an 8-turn window. If nothing can be researched in those 8 turns, I'd turn science off. Ideally, you'd like the latest advance to come in, then switch to Atomic Theory as ToE comes in the same turn. Then take that as your first free tech. Electronics of course is usually second. Then we have some trading material.
 
I've noticed that some of our core cities have some unhappy folks, could be a problem if left unchecked, are we opposed to building temples and such here? How should I handle this? Or is it a non-issue?

Also, we can trade with Greece for Sanitation or Nationalization, are we dealing with them?
 
Deal with them if it makes sense, use luxes and specialists and the slider to keep folks happy. Temples cost too much in shields and gold unless you need them as cathedral precursors for towns at pop20 or so
 
residuetiger said:
I've noticed that some of our core cities have some unhappy folks, could be a problem if left unchecked, are we opposed to building temples and such here? How should I handle this? Or is it a non-issue?

Also, we can trade with Greece for Sanitation or Nationalization, are we dealing with them?

Its never an issue to have unhappy folks. We just don't want more unhappy than happy. With the luxuries we have plus those we trade for, we can sustain size 12 cities without needing the luxury slider. That's why I made sure to deal for the incense again on my turn. As for temples and such, as long as our luxuries are keeping people happy, we don't really need them. We need the gold to buy techs and luxuries.

I thought about those trades as well, but what's the point to them. Neither are required techs. Nationalism is always overpriced. Rifles could be nice as defense, but our best defense is offense as we'll just be picking off any landings with offensive units and bombard units. Not really worth it in my opinion. Sanitation won't get us much either. I don't think we'll get a lot of value out of this. Not many of our cities can grow beyond size 12 as it is.

So, if neither tech is required, and we can't really get much use out of them, the only other criteria to buy would be if we could use them to get gold or other techs. Everyone has those except maybe the Vikings. So they are just going to cost us money without reward. The only tech I'd consider buying at this point would be corporation. But if we can nab ToE, we'll be able to trade for that, plus others.

I think M60's idea to reseach Sci Method and then sit on it until we get ToE at zero research is a great idea, unless we could research Corporation in 8 to time them together as he proposed.
 
#0 1450 AD Eliminated the two enemies up north, finishing up railroading of core cities
#1 1455 AD Added some scientists to our payroll in our northern cities, cutting off a turn from Scientific Meth research, now due in 7 at -1gpt.
#2 1460 AD worker moves
IBT China and England sign peace treaty
#3 1465 AD ....
IBT China lands a longbowman near Philly, oddly enough, Philly riots at about the same time. But with our current money situation, we were able to lower our science slider to 40%(without increasing our research time) and raise lux to 20%.
SM due in 4
#4 1470 AD Killed the Chinese archer near Philly. Workers making more improvements north of core.
IBT Scandies and Greece sign peace treaty
#5 1475 AD Washington finishes factory, begin construction of Military Academy, due in 14. Adjustment of scientists/taxmen gives us +34 gpt and SM due in 3
IBT Scandies and England sign peace treaty
#6 1480 AD Trenton set to produce Heroic Epic in 16 turns. MM'd to get +37gpt, SM due in 2, 317gp in bank account
#7 1485 AD for lack of a better plan for our workers, I'm railroading the whole damn continent!!!!
#8 1490 AD worker stuff. Scientific Method arrives
IBT Scandies land some troops near Ocean City, we deal with them without a problem.
#9 1495 AD .......
#10 1500 AD 468gp currently in treasury, +6 gpt, Newark building ToE, due in 8. researching corporation, due in 6
Pretty quite turn set really, Liz didn't seem to want to deal for Corporation, so I let it pass. According to CivAssist, China, rome, and Scandies are willing to negotiate.

http://gotm.civfanatics.net/saves/sgotm8/Bede_SG008_AD1500_01.SAV
 
residuetiger said:
#5 1475 AD Washington finishes factory, begin construction of Military Academy, due in 14.

Not sure of the value in that. We cannot use air transport to send armies overseas. Heroic Epic is fine. Next up will want to turn science off after 6, or simply push research back to 8.
 
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