I am very good at fog-gazing in this particular game.. I can even see where modern age resources are located anywhere in the fogleif erikson said:Anyone else good at fogazing?
SGOTM8 - Xteam
- Thread starter AlanH
- Start date
With Gator back with us, now I'd like to talk about roster.Capt Buttkick said:
Capt. has volunteered to start us out. If everyone agrees that this is OK, this is what I suggest.
Capt Buttkick starts
Nemesis
Gator
Bluebox
Leif
Willow - on sabbatical until 18 August
I thought about the geograpical way we did it before and, with our experience, have found that the time for discussion is more important than rushing through.
Now for admin stuff,
We have usually allowed 24 hours for a "Got it" and 72 hours to post results of your 10 turns. If you can't make 72 hours, no problem, but please let us all know or we'll declare a skip and the turns you played will not be used.
Alan has set up the server so that only one of us can upload a save by our forum names. If you can't get a save to upload, it usually means your name is incorrect in the database. Post the problem so we can get it resolved.
There is no need really to post the save in the thread but you can if you want. The saves will be posted here.
SGOTM08 is not listed yet but will be at mid-night server time (GMT - 6)
If we have agreed to the roster and the Scout move south and south, Capt may pick up the save and move and post a screenie for us all to check out. Gator said he will read all our posts tonight and I think we need to hear from him before we get moving.
Almost there!!
EDIT - After I posted this Alan posted a more detailed description of uploading and downloading saves from the server in this post
Can I borrow your crystal ball, or at least 15 minutes at your computer?Gyathaar said:I am very good at fog-gazing in this particular game.. I can even see where modern age resources are located anywhere in the fog
Can't wait to start this one Gyathaar.
Don't bust a gut laughing at us spinning in circles now!
DJMGator13
Still breathing
Great discussion team. A few comments I have have mostly been stated already.
1 - with an arch map I'm not sure how valuable a second settler is. I like Capt's suggestion of waiting the turn before it pops and possibly switching it to a warrior.
2 - airports don't allow transport of artillery/workers/settlers/leaders or armies (even unloaded).
3 - Need to determine the size of our core before deciding on RCP 3 vrs 4. RCP3 will probably allow a few more cities on our island.
My fog gazing abilities work better on the actual save file but I think there is something on the N N NW flood plain. I'd like a chance to llok at the opening save before making our first moves, then have the first player post a new screenie after moving the scout and the worker.
If we can meet enough neighbors and build enough cities we should have the tech lead by the end of the AA. The first Wonder I'd worry about is getting Copernicus to help speed our research.
Hey Tomoyo, do you have a link for the RBC covenant game, that might be worth reading before we crank up?
1 - with an arch map I'm not sure how valuable a second settler is. I like Capt's suggestion of waiting the turn before it pops and possibly switching it to a warrior.
2 - airports don't allow transport of artillery/workers/settlers/leaders or armies (even unloaded).
3 - Need to determine the size of our core before deciding on RCP 3 vrs 4. RCP3 will probably allow a few more cities on our island.
My fog gazing abilities work better on the actual save file but I think there is something on the N N NW flood plain. I'd like a chance to llok at the opening save before making our first moves, then have the first player post a new screenie after moving the scout and the worker.
If we can meet enough neighbors and build enough cities we should have the tech lead by the end of the AA. The first Wonder I'd worry about is getting Copernicus to help speed our research.
Hey Tomoyo, do you have a link for the RBC covenant game, that might be worth reading before we crank up?
Hi Gator, nice to see you back. 
Hope all is well.
Is the proposed roster/play order OK?
Hope all is well.Gyathaar modified the list to include leaders in this post.DJMGator13 said:
This is a reasonable way to go. Let's all download the save, have a look and check back in.DJMGator13 said:
Is the proposed roster/play order OK?
just to list of helicopter transportable, not for airlifting with airportsleif erikson said:
TheNemesis666
Warlord
i'm happy with the roster. My Tuesdays and Thursday evenings at the moment will probably prevent me playing on those days but i'll still be able to make the gotit/play timeframe. For reference it's 12:35pm Friday here at the time of this post. (GMT+10:00)
Thanks Gyathaar, I'm starting to get confused.Gyathaar said:
It is old age I'm afraid... Of course, I've forgotten what a leader looks like anyway.
So when the save comes out, it should be about 3 PM for you. You'll have it all analyzed and ready for us when I drag myself out of bed in the morning.TheNemesis666 said:
Hi Team! 
roster seems ok to me.
I looked at the save. Can't see anything under the fog, but that doesn't mean there isn't anything.
Our Opponents:
Moving scout SS to verify possible BG could seem smart but considering most tiles made visible WW is the best option. I'd move the Scout WW (and settle on desert tile if the scout doesn't find anything interesting).
roster seems ok to me.
I looked at the save. Can't see anything under the fog, but that doesn't mean there isn't anything.
Our Opponents:
Code:
Rome mil/com WC ABC
Greece sci/com BW ABC
China mil/ind WC MSY
England exp/com PTY ABC
Vikings exp/mil PTY WC
Japan rel/mil CB WHL
Capt Buttkick
Emperor
Should we vote on where to send our settler?
I mean, I could of course make the decision, but I'm seriously in doubt here, specially after the fog gazing...
I mean, I could of course make the decision, but I'm seriously in doubt here, specially after the fog gazing...
Good Morning,Capt Buttkick said:
The save is out and I had a look, not that it mattered much. I did detect a disturbance in the fog to the north but I have no theory of what it could be.
Instead of voting, I thought a discussion of the pro's and con's of making a move would be more appropriate, and more educational. Some things to think about:
If there were wheat to the north, would it be worth the turns, at Emperor, to delay founding to get there? In fact, how many turns are we willing to walk to obtain a food bonus resource?
What is most important in moving the Scout, seeing the most tiles or checking to see that the desert square is a good enough place to settle. If we move to the mountain and find something, see the first question.
Are there advantages to settling on the desert tile? Any disadvantages that would make us want to move elsewhere to settle?
Just some thoughts. In doing this, I think the answer will become evident pretty quickly.
Capt Buttkick
Emperor
If we could verify that there is indeed FPW on the FPs, I think we should move SS. If there's a 4-turner there, I'd rather move S to certainty than W on a gamble.
If we can't verify if there's FPW, I'm thinking perhaps WW with the scout to see if there's anything there. I've moved 3 tiles on emperor before and I'm not very worried if we get to a 4-turner by doing that. The problem is that there need to be a lot of shields to the W to enable a 4-turner. We can prob set the city up with 1-turn growth on size 6, but that would mean just 1 shield + any we get on expansion
If there's FPW to the NW NW N, we could settle NW and catch both FPW and the sheep on expansion. Prblem is we won't get to see that tile by moving WW...
If we can't verify if there's FPW, I'm thinking perhaps WW with the scout to see if there's anything there. I've moved 3 tiles on emperor before and I'm not very worried if we get to a 4-turner by doing that. The problem is that there need to be a lot of shields to the W to enable a 4-turner. We can prob set the city up with 1-turn growth on size 6, but that would mean just 1 shield + any we get on expansion
If there's FPW to the NW NW N, we could settle NW and catch both FPW and the sheep on expansion. Prblem is we won't get to see that tile by moving WW...
Capt Buttkick
Emperor
Very nice, Bluebox.Yes, it does seem to be something there (apart from the green food dot).
I'd like to hear some more opinions be4 doing something, though:
1) Do you think there's FPW to the NW NW N?
2) a) If there is FPW there, what should we do with our scout?
2) b) If there isn't FPW there, what should we do with our scout?
2) c) If you're unsure whether or not there's FPW there, should we send our scout westwards?
DJMGator13
Still breathing
If that is a FPwheat then settling NW would give us +5fpt at size 5 but would leave us 2-4 shields short of a 4 turn factory.
Center...2/1
Lamb.....2/2
FPw......5/0
Hill........1/2
Plain......2/1
FP.........3/0
Total....15/6
Problem is that we have no forest or BG with that location which means we'll at best pick up an irrigated plain tile for 1 shield or possibly a regular FP for no extra shield on growth. Which gives us shields of 6/7/7/8=28 if we pick up the irrigated plain or only 6/6/7/7=26 if we pick up regular FP. Another downfall for NW is the possiblity of disease, but we'll be working the FP's anyway so that is unavoidable.
Based on that I think we might want to settle on the desert tile and squeeze out a settler as fast as possible (even skipping a second scout) and get it to the wheat area. This would leave us open to an early barb attack which could jeopardize our settler production.
EDIT: I looked more closely at the desert spot. That spot brings 7 grassland tiles into our border and if some of those are BG's we could make a 5 turn factory there. One BG with the lamb and 3 reg FP would give us +5fpt again, but we might be a few shields short of a 4 turn factory.
Center...2/1
Lamb.....2/2
FPw......5/0
Hill........1/2
Plain......2/1
FP.........3/0
Total....15/6
Problem is that we have no forest or BG with that location which means we'll at best pick up an irrigated plain tile for 1 shield or possibly a regular FP for no extra shield on growth. Which gives us shields of 6/7/7/8=28 if we pick up the irrigated plain or only 6/6/7/7=26 if we pick up regular FP. Another downfall for NW is the possiblity of disease, but we'll be working the FP's anyway so that is unavoidable.
Based on that I think we might want to settle on the desert tile and squeeze out a settler as fast as possible (even skipping a second scout) and get it to the wheat area. This would leave us open to an early barb attack which could jeopardize our settler production.
EDIT: I looked more closely at the desert spot. That spot brings 7 grassland tiles into our border and if some of those are BG's we could make a 5 turn factory there. One BG with the lamb and 3 reg FP would give us +5fpt again, but we might be a few shields short of a 4 turn factory.
I came to the same conclusion as Gator, that settling NW to get the FP-Wheat would give us a food rich but shield poor site. That doesn't mean that the northern side of the Wheat, if it is there, may not provide enough shields to suit our needs, but that would require at least 4 turns to get the settler there, too many for my taste. 
Settling on the desert tile to the south provides enough food but may also be short of shields. The beauty of this site is that there are a number of grass and forest tiles which may yield BG's for us to use. From what I can see, it may also be shield poor but we have a better chance of gaining those shields. We also can cut the forests for a temporary increase in shields for a Granary or other build. An industrious worker requires 5-turns to chop for 10 shields.
Should we decide that south is our best bet, I would not waste a Scout move to the south. I would send the scout to the western mountain and then north to confirm the wheat. If the wheat is there and there are suitable shields available, the risk of pushing out a settler quickly may be justified. With citizens working unimproved tiles, depending on how we prioritize worker actions, that means 17 to 20 turns for Washington to reach size 3. That gives us time for either a warrior or a scout before the settler. I would prolly build a warrior for MP and security.
There are many worker turns needed to get this site up and running. If we push an early settler, we may want to pump an early worker or two from the second city.
There has been time enough for comment, imho.
Capt, if you have enough info to decide what to do, please proceed with the first 20 turns. If you would like more guidance/advise, please let us know and I'm sure we can easily create more spam.
The roster, then, is:
Capt Buttkick - UP
Nemesis - On Deck
Gator
Bluebox
Leif
Willow - Having a great vacation!
Good luck Capt.
Settling on the desert tile to the south provides enough food but may also be short of shields. The beauty of this site is that there are a number of grass and forest tiles which may yield BG's for us to use. From what I can see, it may also be shield poor but we have a better chance of gaining those shields. We also can cut the forests for a temporary increase in shields for a Granary or other build. An industrious worker requires 5-turns to chop for 10 shields.
Should we decide that south is our best bet, I would not waste a Scout move to the south. I would send the scout to the western mountain and then north to confirm the wheat. If the wheat is there and there are suitable shields available, the risk of pushing out a settler quickly may be justified. With citizens working unimproved tiles, depending on how we prioritize worker actions, that means 17 to 20 turns for Washington to reach size 3. That gives us time for either a warrior or a scout before the settler. I would prolly build a warrior for MP and security.
There are many worker turns needed to get this site up and running. If we push an early settler, we may want to pump an early worker or two from the second city.
There has been time enough for comment, imho.
Capt, if you have enough info to decide what to do, please proceed with the first 20 turns. If you would like more guidance/advise, please let us know and I'm sure we can easily create more spam. The roster, then, is:
Capt Buttkick - UP
Nemesis - On Deck
Gator
Bluebox
Leif
Willow - Having a great vacation!
Good luck Capt.
Capt Buttkick
Emperor
Nah, I think the last two posts were good ones so I'll play later today. Still some time for more comments, though
![[pimp]](/images/smilies/pimp.gif "Pimp [pimp]")
I know mining the hill takes a long time, but if we didn't work it except on growth, couldn't we get a 4-turner anyway?
Like this:
Working tiles food/shields at size 5.0
Centre 2/1
FPW 5/0
Lamb 2/2
Irrigated plains 2/1
Irrigated plains 2/1
Irrigated plains 2/1
Total shields = 6
Working tiles food/shields at size 5.5
Centre 2/1
FPW 5/0
Lamb 2/2
Irrigated plains 2/1
Irrigated plains 2/1
Irrigated plains 2/1
Catch hill on growth for another 2 shields:
Total shields = 8
Working tiles food/shields at size 6.0
Centre 2/1
FPW 5/0
Lamb 2/2
Irrigated plains 2/1
Irrigated plains 2/1
Irrigated plains 2/1
Irrigated plains 2/1
Total shields = 7
Working tiles food/shields at size 6.5
Centre 2/1
FPW 5/0
Lamb 2/2
Irrigated plains 2/1
Irrigated plains 2/1
Irrigated plains 2/1
Irrigated plains 2/1
Again catch hill on growth for another 2 shields:
Total shields = 9
Shields = 6+8+7+9 = 30
Capt Buttkick
Emperor
Problem by settling NW is we might destroy the chance of having 2 4-turners.
If we settle S and move our first settler NW NW of the start, we probably have 2 if there is indeed FPW in the NW.
If we settle S and move our first settler NW NW of the start, we probably have 2 if there is indeed FPW in the NW.
Could Gyathaar be so generous as to give us 2-four turn factories? Or are we getting greedy?
I am not convince the wheat is really there, however, you could alter the Scout move to NW and NW on the first turn to satisfy our curiosity and then go SW and SW onto the mountain on the second turn. imho this wouldn't matter because if we see anything from the mountain, it won't change the decision to move south.
And remember, we are inductrious, so mining the hill requiresd only 3 turns instead of 6.
I am not convince the wheat is really there, however, you could alter the Scout move to NW and NW on the first turn to satisfy our curiosity and then go SW and SW onto the mountain on the second turn. imho this wouldn't matter because if we see anything from the mountain, it won't change the decision to move south.
And remember, we are inductrious, so mining the hill requiresd only 3 turns instead of 6.
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