Discussion in 'Civ6 - General Discussions' started by Mahi, Aug 26, 2020.
Yeah, but I expect the AI to cheat and have more knowledge that I can possibly have.
Agendas are already a AI exclusive mechanic as well, it seems fine if they get a bit of additional clairvoyance to support the system.
The idea behind this mod seems like a great solution. Shame it appears to be less than functional.
Wasn't info even more accessible in CIV V and IV?
I would love if they made the availability of such information dependent on diplomatic visibility (but not the AI. The AI has enough challenges as it is and should have full access at all times).
That can still be done without the exact numbers being available.
No; but the UI was better for accessing what was available. Certainly in IV.
I appreciate in VI they tried to reduce the number of info screens, wanting to tie more stuff to the map etc; but I still think that fails to account that people like getting info in different ways; and so having those various screens (sortable too *cough cough*) is a minimum requirement if you want widespread UI approval. I can't imagine playing the game without the better report mod!
It's part of the game. Of course it's not cheating.
It's definitely not cheating because it's available to everybody. It's not an exploit because this is literally programmed into the game. It doesn't break a rule.
As others have said -- it's more of a question of should we have this information from a design/gameplay perspective. I think the game would be more interesting if it was attached to diplomatic visibility. It'd make Black Queen Catherine France and Mongolia more interesting for sure.
I actually always thought the ribbon was a mod. I don’t recall ever turning it off, but guess I must have?
I only recently ‘rediscovered’ it is part of the core game when I accidentally somehow locked on my camera pivot and was trying to turn it off.
I think its useful if you don’t want to get too far ahead, but if your play is competitive, it is a bit of a crutch.
It was a mod originally; then the Devs added it to the game.
It "feels like" cheating to me, being able to know exact infos like that.
As many suggested (and I'm gonna grab that mod rn) it should have scaled with diplo visibility.
In Civ4, yes. Most information was available via demographics and diplomacy, and what wasn't usually was available via espionage. You could discover what your opponent was earning and so on.
1. The devs didn’t add the mod, but implemented the idea in their own way. The code is very different. Btw, game ribbon is very minimalistic.
2. The mod only ever showed the information ALREADY available in different parts of the UI (mostly in various tooltips in the WorldRankings screen). So, it was created for convenience.
I do not think the Ribbon is cheating, because you could get that information any way if you had some degree of visibility. I agree however with anything else you said. Playing pacifist in Civ 6 is much too easy. And the Ribbon makes it a complete walk in the park. Just keep up with unit score and you will never be declared on. Force the AI into friendships that are disadvantageous to them and you'll be at peace for literally the entire game. It's kind of maddening to be honest, the way the new friendship works.
However this is only really an issue for more experienced players, since most players are unaware of how unit score works, and how it mathematically ties into the AI declaring on you or leaving you alone.
Yea, the ribbons do not show anything that wasn't available before, so it is not 'cheating' in any way. The problem is maybe more that all of those numbers were available to be seen even without any diplomatic visibility.
Same with the official version that was added.
It's worth noting that not only is this true, but the computer is many many many times more effective at using this information than a human could ever be. Inserting data into a game gives the computer an irreconcilable advantage.
If anything the computer is cheating us with the diplomacy ribbon.
Absolutely. The dreadful, merciless Civ6's AI is a living proof of how effective the computer is. I am afraid that without the ribbon, noone would stand a chance against it. It is just so good.
Should I add /endsarcasm to the previous post or not? I hope not.
Jokes aside though, even the best AI on the planet would need to be constantly fed the information for many of the agendas to be possible. In my opinion, if the computer reads through all of the information every turn, no way is it cheating to glance at it every few turns.
Edit: Although it absolutely should be related to diplomatic visibility for both humans and AI.
Edit 2: And nobody is allowed to complain about the AI if they have more than 1000 hours in the game. Of course they can absolutely annihilate it every game.
If it were any good at playing the game that would be true. But right now the game has an undertaking behaviour to cope with thre fact that the ai tries to put multiple units on a tile in a game with one unit per tile.
If you gave a poor player the ability to process this much data he'd instantly be one of the greatest players ever.
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