Space Empires - Ideas Thread

[Mr Moron]

One of my favorite games of all time was Space Empires IV. I'm assuming this is based on that. Sounds like an impressive undertaking.

edit : Damn, sorry if I stole a reserved spot.

Not trying to make too many off-topic posts but is saw this and had to comment.Seeing this topic I was thinking the same thing. Can't wait for SEV, it's looking to be pretty cool.

 

[Vadus]

Hi all,
good to see some response again. Actually I'm working (more thinking) on this mod since I could free my self from oblivion .. what was some days ago..

Currently I'm trying to create a root version of this mod, from which techs, buildings, weapons and so on can be added only by changing the xml files.
Therefore I still have to solve the problem to save and load the unit sandbox data during a game save / load.
And I have to change the cities to my model.

@MooManof_ : oh, thanks for the hint. I will have a look to the apolyton project
@dalek master : yes, please post your thoughts to my vision. Why should you fail ?

I can see a lot of great possibilities for unit promotions. Hyperspace drives, tractor beams, boarding parties, lots of good stuff. Judging by what they've done in FfH, I'd say there's virtually no limit to what you can do with promotions.

What is FfH ??

For implementing your planet sizes, maybe you can really tweak the land tiles to do this function. If they are only used for planets, just make each land type have a different amount of resources, with more variation than in vanilla civ. And limiting the number of units that can be on a certain tile type should be possible as well.
One thing you didn't mention though, what do you plan to do with resources?

Yes, just what I have in mind with the planets..
Resources : true, I will add a category to the terrain chapter

 

[Mozza]

Would it be possible to make a "star" terrain that is impassible to units (thus ensuring no one builds a colony on a star!) but very rich in resources, thus if you have a colony in a system but don't "control" the star, you'll be limited to a small colony, but with control of the star, and a decent terra-type planet you could have a huge colony, possible supporting outposts (hamlet-village-town) on the rocky planets in the same system.

Also in your off planet buildings, have an orbital trading post as well as defence stations.

Instead of farms/irrigation, you could have terraforming.

Coast would be "star system" with early crafts unable to leave their own system, then ocean would be "deep space" with later techs allowing you to travel through deep space.

For realism, have an early unit that's a probe. No combat value, can't carry units, but can travel through deep space, allowing you to comunicate with other races long before you can actually meet them. Most scientists agree when we finally contact alien races, we will communicate for generations before we have the technology to meet in person. Unless of course, your probe simply attracts the attention of a superior tech race that made trade tech, or come to your homeworld with less friendly intent.

 

[ForesterSOF]

Although the idea sounds like what I like I am helping on the C4:AC MOD.

This way we can play an improved SMAC/X using the C4 engine.

 

[woodelf]

What is FfH ??

Fall from Heaven mod.

 

[Vadus]

Would it be possible to make a "star" terrain that is impassible to units (thus ensuring no one builds a colony on a star!) but very rich in resources, thus if you have a colony in a system but don't "control" the star, you'll be limited to a small colony, but with control of the star, and a decent terra-type planet you could have a huge colony, possible supporting outposts (hamlet-village-town) on the rocky planets in the same system.

Hm, when I build a colony in a system, what are you mean with "accessing" the star ? I already get the light on my planet, and some heat. Then I think, borders indicate the sensor range of a planet in this mod, beacuse there is no fog of war in your own area, isn't it. As what do you see the borders, in the case, that you gain resouces from a star, when the star in in your "realm" ?
Small outposts on rocky planets : well, because the special civilians of a city will produce also nutrients (see chapter VI) other planets in a city range (of 2) shouldn't be farmed. You can still do it, but it will be more efficient to colonize this planets aswell.

Also in your off planet buildings, have an orbital trading post as well as defence stations.

Defence Stations, yes of course. They will give a defence bonus to all units next to them (in orbit).
Trading post : could be a good idea, but maybe it will be better to have trading posts as a system-space improvment, which will increase the trade value of a system-space tile enormous (from 0 to 4 or so ) . Then as building you can have something like Tradeport, which works like a marketplace. What do you say ?

Instead of farms/irrigation, you could have terraforming.

hm, you mean a farm on a planet will make it terran ? But than every planet will become terran in one step. And when you build a colony on it, the farm will disappear. And think of other races like Silicoids. A race, that has it's origin on a rocky planet wants to terrarform all to rocky planets

Coast would be "star system" with early crafts unable to leave their own system, then ocean would be "deep space" with later techs allowing you to travel through deep space.

For realism, have an early unit that's a probe. No combat value, can't carry units, but can travel through deep space, allowing you to comunicate with other races long before you can actually meet them. Most scientists agree when we finally contact alien races, we will communicate for generations before we have the technology to meet in person. Unless of course, your probe simply attracts the attention of a superior tech race that made trade tech, or come to your homeworld with less friendly intent.

Yes, there is the difference between system and deep space, like in the civ3 space terrain (see sig. )
And your're right, the first space exploring unit should be a probe. Actually there is already a satellite unit vor civ4

 

[ForesterSOF]

You can use Height for planet size and Terrain for planet type.

this way you only have to edit the dds files and XML

 

[Vadus]

how many height levels are possible ? I guess 3 ? flat, hill and mountain ?

 

[darkedone02]

Try doing something that others did not do, Be able to play more then 1 planet, that include space transportation, planet making, and other things. If you do that, you make a successful mod, however it will be difficult as it maybe impossible to do, however give it a shot and you be famous if you succeed.

 

[ForesterSOF]

5 heights and 5 terrains

Sea, Coast, Land, Hill, Mtn.

Desert, Plains, Grassland, tundra, Ice.

 

[Vadus]

5 heights and 5 terrains

Sea, Coast, Land, Hill, Mtn.

Desert, Plains, Grassland, tundra, Ice.

hm, since Sea and cost is already used for deep space and system space there are 3 sizes for planets left. But this could work, I think

But I'm worried about only have 5 types of land terrain (planets).. If it is possible just to add a new terrain to the xml files ? ..

@darkedone02 : SpaceTransportation like supply an industrial planet with food might be done with caravans (from the according mod comp), though this will be hard micromanagement. But I can imagine such a feature for the later development. Thanks for the hint.

 

[woodelf]

But I'm worried about only have 5 types of land terrain (planets).. If it is possible just to add a new terrain to the xml files ? ..

I think it's possible, but I don't know exactly how. Check the C&C and I think it has been discussed and implemented.

 

[Pvtbones]

have you given thought about asteriod rings around solar systems (like resources with teh graphics of a section of asteroids.

 

[darkedone02]

when will you released the beta test of it? or alpha test?

 

[ForesterSOF]

there are also 6 features: sea ice, forest, jungle, oasis, flood plans, fallout.

there is also the river system that will give you 8 and then the bonuses that could give you 24.

not to mention there is a reveal/not reveal.

all this is in the BMP to WBS program in my tools.

 

[Andrew_Jay]

Hey Vadus, good to see you interested in working on another Space mod. Too bad things didn't work out with Civ III, but I think it'll go really well in Civ IV.

If you don't mind, I'm just going to repost my ideas from the Star Trek thread on how planets could work . . .

I can't remember if there's been any model for how the terrain will work in this mod, but I found some mock-ups I did a few weeks ago. One thing you'll notice is that I prefer 1x1 tile planets and stars to anything else - though perhaps that's just a preference left over from the CivIII mod, it's quite possible that some awesome-looking (and functional) 2x2 planets (or bigger) can be made with CivIV's graphics.

This first shot (taken from the Civ4 Editor utility) basically encompasses many of my ideas for how the game could work.

Of course, the form that cities will take is perhaps the biggest decision, and it seems that there are two ways to go:

"Star Cities" has the "city" built on the star, allowing the civilization to claim the entire star-system. The city then reaches out and works the planets in that system (for both models, I picture the coast and ocean tiles - unless they possess resources/asteroids - producing nothing - farms in space? - Food/Hammers/Trade will depend on the planets themselves and the improvements you build on them).

One cool thing about this model is that it can take advantage of all of the great new tile improvements that are in Civ IV; one planet could have a "cottage" (of course, there would be some cool science fiction name for it, rather than "cottage"!) on it, another a "windmill", planets could be customised with mines, farms, "lumber camps", etc.

"Planet Cities" has each planet settled seperately. This allows for a little more flexibility, and the ability to exploit special resources on each (is there anyway to, for example, get a gold resource off of a one-tile island without a city on it? I don't think there is, which hurts the "star cities" model). One thing you should note is that I placed the planets in these examples so that they do not over-lap (so your "city" on Earth won't also be working Mars, for example). You lose the ability to build terrain improvements, however (because everything will either have a city on it, or wont. However, maybe there could be moons or asteroids attached to some planets that you could improve). Also, if we are to avoid over-lapping, this model can fit fewer planets around a star (maximum of four it seems, where the "star cities" allows for six before planets are joined to each-other - which it might be good to avoid).

I really don't know which I prefer right now, because obviously both have their advantages and disadvantages. What do other people think?

 

[Tholish]

If you can do something like this "wormholes" concept then you can essentially do multiple maps. If you can somehow make it that movement across a particular square boundary moves you to square b instead of square a, then you can section off corners of the map to represent the planetary surface and get there from the main map only by moving into a specific square, a point in space on the main map that is associated with the corner of the map where the planet surface is represented. Movement to that square on the main map from the submap would have to require some special unit attribute, ie spaceflight capability. So, if you had the planet maps as rectangles cut out of the edges of the map you could skip the sea stuff and let it all be "land."
Even better, if you can do something like that you can make these submaps wrap however you like. And perhaps you could even have some kind of neutral unit that moves in a programmed fashion, and all this square association for planets moves with whatever square the unit is in. These units would be planets, and you could schedule planetary motion in orbits or whatever. If that is not possible, you could have multiple layers, like inner system , outer system, kuiper belt, oort cloud, nearby stars, etc...Passing outward from the edge of the inner system map you only go to the center of the outer system map.

Making the motion of spacecraft be physical vectors, where you accelerate in a direction, would be even more advanced, and probably not necessary.

 

[ForesterSOF]

I like the idea of Planet Citiesa tad more and for the whormhole tech that means adding that tech and for properties I guess you give it some sort of link command in the XML or make a py file that creats the links randomly.

 

[Vadus]

@Andrey_Jay : Hey, thank you for this nice terrain explanation The examples show how I want the terrain. I think single tiled planets and colonies will work will with the new citizen concept.

@Tholish : Well, having a few big planet surfaces will put the focus of this space mod to far away from exploring the deep space

@ForesterSOF : Maybe a tech can unlock the movement on a wormhole terrain like the gallay can't move on ocean .. ( so can it move on ocean after researching the optic ? )

@darkone : a first release will take still some time. Currently I'm testing some basic features on a raw civ4 mod (having only one civ and tech .. )

 

[ForesterSOF]

You can use the <PrereqTech>NONE</PrereqTech> in the Civ4Info.XML\units\XML so the whormhole points cant be used till an item is researched.