Stealth Fighters: Do you use them? Why/why not?

[planetfall]

Starrider,

Yes, but too boring. I'd rather either have a few more SBombers or more land units for conquering.
I used 4 in last game, 2 for recon and 2 for strategic resource denial. 2 turns of use and then I couldn't find anything worthwhile to use them on, so froze them. Not a good use of shields. I only created 4 cause I was wondering if I was missing something by not usually creating them. Nope, going back to 1 or 2 for recon, if needed.

By this stage in game, I rarely use pilliaging. I would only be pilliaging my territory. Sure it's influence is currently another countries, but in a turn or two it's mine.

I had 2 extra enslaved units I just parked. Funny to see them being created. As if I could hijack a plane in mid air. Unlike movies, never heard done in RL.

PF

 

[starrider]

Starrider,

Yes, but too boring. I'd rather either have a few more SBombers or more land units for conquering.
I used 4 in last game, 2 for recon and 2 for strategic resource denial. 2 turns of use and then I couldn't find anything worthwhile to use them on, so froze them. Not a good use of shields. I only created 4 cause I was wondering if I was missing something by not usually creating them. Nope, going back to 1 or 2 for recon, if needed.

By this stage in game, I rarely use pilliaging. I would only be pilliaging my territory. Sure it's influence is currently another countries, but in a turn or two it's mine.

I had 2 extra enslaved units I just parked. Funny to see them being created. As if I could hijack a plane in mid air. Unlike movies, never heard done in RL.

PF

Ah cool...i have used mine to cut an island/continent in half when I invade. My newly captured city only faces half the defenders. Just wondering what you did

 

[planetfall]

Starrider,

I do NOT want to cut defenders in half. I only use tile bombardment in initial DDay landing.
Ideal scenario:
1. clear roads around landing
2. land forces
3. plant city
4. build airfield
5. take as many as turns as possible removing attackers
6. advance 3 tiles in all directions so safe
7. rebuild roads
8. start invasion.

I want step 5 to last as long as possible. I want to see massive AI SOD's. The more I see the easier and faster the conquest will be. If they are attacking they lose the bonuses:
1. fortified
2. across river
3. city
4. civil defense
5. radar tower
Thus the doubling of their defense is lost when they attack vs defend.

In a couple of games, I goofed and tried DDay too soon, and was Dunkirked, but I just had DDayII and all went fine.

PF

 

[starrider]

Starrider,

I do NOT want to cut defenders in half. I only use tile bombardment in initial DDay landing.
Ideal scenario:
1. clear roads around landing
2. land forces
3. plant city
4. build airfield
5. take as many as turns as possible removing attackers
6. advance 3 tiles in all directions so safe
7. rebuild roads
8. start invasion.

I want step 5 to last as long as possible. I want to see massive AI SOD's. The more I see the easier and faster the conquest will be. If they are attacking they lose the bonuses:
1. fortified
2. across river
3. city
4. civil defense
5. radar tower
Thus the doubling of their defense is lost when they attack vs defend.

In a couple of games, I goofed and tried DDay too soon, and was Dunkirked, but I just had DDayII and all went fine.

PF

Ideally I use marines and capture a city...bomb railways and roads two spaces out so armor is exposed and cannot counterattack the second move. This leaves SoD of MechInf and Modern Armor (or tanks depending on era) exposed to artillery and bombers. I was able to destroy a huge number of enemy forces this way, as the AI was "stuck" just short of attacking the city I captured.

I've never had much luck in the modern era landing forces and planting a city...usually has been easier for me to send scores of suicide marines and capture a coastal city, plant a large number of defenders to prevent CF (and resistance is usually over the next turn anyway).

Thanks for the strategy tho, its a different way that I had not considered.

 

[starrider]

If they are attacking they lose the bonuses:
1. fortified
2. across river
3. city
4. civil defense
5. radar tower
Thus the doubling of their defense is lost when they attack vs defend.

In a couple of games, I goofed and tried DDay too soon, and was Dunkirked, but I just had DDayII and all went fine.

PF

Um, I thought radar towers gave bonus on both attack AND defense as long as the units were within the radius of the radar tower?

 

[planetfall]

I've never had much luck in the modern era landing forces and planting a city...

Thanks for the strategy tho, its a different way that I had not considered.

I used to capture cities, but after losing one to a culture flip I switched to planting a city. I don't use marines except for 1 tile cities. RR'ed AI is so strong, I want a good hill or limited access site to a bit of def bonus. Typical landings are 4..6 transport loads. It just depends on how strong the AI is.
One full transport is artillery.

The real problem is not CF but the time it takes to build an airport/field.

Capture city
turn 1. capture city
turn 2. resistance ends, rush airport [IF possible, often had to wait]
turn 3. start airlifted reinforcements

Plant city
turn 1. plant city
turn 2. plant airfield and start airlifted reinforcements

Could do airfield in turn 1, but usually want to make sure troops will survive.
Rethinking over last games, I now realize I would be better off doing this all in turn one whenever possible.

It is amazing the difference in effect in the earlier airlift reinforcements.

PF

 

[planetfall]

Um, I thought radar towers gave bonus on both attack AND defense as long as the units were within the radius of the radar tower?

Oh, they do but I remove the ones in range via bombers almost always before DDay landings. They only have a range of 2 tiles, so that is only 1 or 2 towers at the most.

PF

 

[planetfall]

Ideally I..bomb railways and roads two spaces out so armor is exposed and cannot counterattack the second move..

Hummm, I haven't tried 2 tiles out. I usually only have 1 or 2 carriers and that is not enough to reach 2 tiles out. One carrier is fighters only, so I usually only have 3 bombers available within range. Earlier I used to have 3..4 carriers, but with increased AA of C3C, I reduded and put in more land units instead. In one tough game this meant 12 artillery instead of 6 in landing zone.

PF

 

[planetfall]

Could do airfield in turn 1..

Disregard this, coffee had not kicked it yet. Airfields can't be built on turn 1.

turn 1. land worker
turn 2. turn worker to airfield.

 

[starrider]

I used to capture cities, but after losing one to a culture flip I switched to planting a city. I don't use marines except for 1 tile cities. RR'ed AI is so strong, I want a good hill or limited access site to a bit of def bonus. Typical landings are 4..6 transport loads. It just depends on how strong the AI is.
One full transport is artillery.

The real problem is not CF but the time it takes to build an airport/field.

Capture city
turn 1. capture city
turn 2. resistance ends, rush airport [IF possible, often had to wait]
turn 3. start airlifted reinforcements

Plant city
turn 1. plant city
turn 2. plant airfield and start airlifted reinforcements

Could do airfield in turn 1, but usually want to make sure troops will survive.
Rethinking over last games, I now realize I would be better off doing this all in turn one whenever possible.

It is amazing the difference in effect in the earlier airlift reinforcements.

PF

I haven't had the issue of CF because I land a massive amount of troops into the captured city. Invasion force is something like 1 transport of marines per enemy mechinf, 2 transports of artys, 2 armies of mechinf, 2 transports of SAMs, and at least 2 transports with a mixture of mechinf and modern army. Resistance is usually over the next turn. The goal is to capture a city already containing an airport. If this is not possible, you can still get an airport on the next turn. Each transport disbands into 30 shields. Airports require 160 shields to build. Disbanding 5 transports and a redlined marine (or some other combination) gets you the airport on the next turn, regardless if the city is in resistance or in civil disorder. Next priorities are barracks and civil defense, then a culture improvement.

When I invade a coastal city, I make myself answer this question: Is this force strong enough to withstand counter-attack without reinforcements for several turns. If it can't...I put the invasion on hold until it can.

One last note, as soon as your newly captured city leaves resistance, you will get a city defensive bonus if it is over 6 pop 50% isn't bad, 100% metropolis bonus is even better. If you found a city, you will have to build walls to protect it.

As for the stealth bombers...they help slice up the roads and RRs so I get an extra turn to quell the resistance (and get my bonus!).

 

[planetfall]

Airports require 160 shields to build. Disbanding 5 transports and a redlined marine (or some other combination) gets you the airport on the next turn, regardless if the city is in resistance or in civil disorder. Next priorities are barracks and civil defense, then a culture improvement.
)

This is an interesting approach. I didn't consider disbanding transports, humm. This I will have to give a try if an enemy city exists where I want it.

You initial build order is a bit different than mine. I usually go for temple/library to slow down attackers by culture. This way I can still use roads and get very few troops stranded outside the city at the end of the turn. [some targets are just too juicy to not risk exposure on next turn]. Then come barracks. Civil defense is never built as I have either expanded so far, this city does not need it, or I'm dead already and it's mote.

Instead of walls, I use artillery. Before they moved radio, sometimes I would bring along a couple workers for radar tower support.

Sounds like either approach will work in this game.

PF

 

[starrider]

This is an interesting approach. I didn't consider disbanding transports, humm. This I will have to give a try if an enemy city exists where I want it.

Nearly all of my transports in my games are one way. It takes far too long to send the transports home than to build a new one and ship off new troops.

I do, however, keep a few around for sneaking marines behind enemy lines as the AI pushes its troops forward (if I have enough marines left.) Sneaking marines around to another weaker coastal city, bombing it a few times, then taking it confuses the AI. The AI doesn't do multiple front's well. Even if you can't hold this weaker, smaller city, you divert troops from attacking the city you care about.

You initial build order is a bit different than mine. I usually go for temple/library to slow down attackers by culture. This way I can still use roads and get very few troops stranded outside the city at the end of the turn. [some targets are just too juicy to not risk exposure on next turn]. Then come barracks. Civil defense is never built as I have either expanded so far, this city does not need it, or I'm dead already and it's mote.
PF

Yeah, I have done that also. It all depends on what type of force I'm facing. If wave after wave of Modern Armor comes after me, the civil defense bonus is more important than culture. Rushing civil defense can give you a bonus faster than waiting 3 turns for culture expansion. Artys can eliminate rails and roads two spaces out from your city, slowing down enemy and exposing his armor. If slower units are coming after me, I'll build culture instead of civil defense.

What keeps you alive for the next few turns depends greatly on the particular circumstance, which is why your strategy works well too.

 

[Bluemofia]

what happened to the stealth fighter discussion?

 

[starrider]

what happened to the stealth fighter discussion?

Well the Stealth Fighters are used to cut a swath 2 spaces out from the captured city. pillaging to force enemy armor to expose itself

 

[planetfall]

Bluemofia,

Once we talked about using Stealth Fighter for long range recon and helping clear tiles to slow down attack on landing zones, no one including you came up with other uses.

Enlightenen us.

PF

 

[starrider]

They have lethal bombardment too...so you can use them on weakened troops in the open.

 

[sabo]

THe only use I"ve found for them is they are good scouts for the stealth bombers so I can see the damage I'm doing with them